Old folks should chuff off.......

[Av Gorritt]

I knew my time had come one day , when a couple of young lads from the cottages came knocking on the door . "Is you A------ in" "No , sorry , did you need him , or will I do " "No, we do need him , when he comes in will you tell him that he has a cow calving just by the lane - looks like it could use a hand . So much for me then , and my abilities . ! (I think he would have been teenage at the time , certainly no older .

 

[kiwi pom]

Thats all fine except that the doddering old fools have had it all their way at both ends. They inherited their place when they were still relatively young, because life expectancy in the 70s and 80s was still only late 60s/early 70s for men, but having inherited it in their 30s or 40s can easily expect to live well into their 80s. So the next generation might well be nearly 60 by the time they inherit. Its not an equal equation. The post war generation have (as in so many things in society) grabbed all the benefit for themselves at the expense of the later generations. Housing, pensions, university education, inheritances, they've got the best of all the deals. Their parents had to fight wars and die young, their children are sat wondering how they can manage to pay for their education, buy a house and afford a family.

My personal experience shows the trend - my grandfather died in his late 60s in the early 1970s and my father inherited the farm aged about 38. He's still with us now aged 85 (mainly due to the heart op that wasn't available for my grandfathers generation) and if other ill health matters hadn't forced him 10-15 years ago to pass things on to me and my sister, he'd still be ruling the roost today, and I'd be in my 50s wondering when I'd ever be able to take over.

I definitely think that there should be some carrot and stick within the tax system that makes people retire at a certain age. Or at least forces them to take the next generations into the business or face losing tax benefits, or even their state pensions. Its done in France, which is often lauded as being far more pro-farmer than the UK - you can't claim subsidy once you get to retirement age. Thus forcing the elderly through financial pressure to let go and hand things over the the next generation.

Looking at it from the outside, perhaps it's best for all children to leave the farm when they are finished with school and go off into the world? If mum and dad were managing the place by themselves there isn't room for another anyway, unless you expand at which point the children could be partners.
If all children left then the parents would need to make a decision about the farm when it became too hard around retirement age. Rent it out, sell up, employ someone or hand over to their children. If they rent it out it could be to the kids.
Staying home and doing all the work for a promise of inheriting, just means you do the work for them so they can carry on forever.

 

[hally]

Sadly he married a young model of 20 and is no longer with us.

The suspicion is that she drugged him with metamphetimes (sp?) but there may be other factors at play ....

View attachment 958544

For those who may be interested, the story is here

Young widow arrested on suspicion of murdering Japan’s self-styled ‘Don Juan’

Saki Sudo suspected of making Nosuke Nozaki ingest a lethal amount of an illegal drug

www.independent.co.uk

At least he had fun before he went

 

[FonterraFarmer]

One of our neighbours retired from the civil service at 46,to be fair is a good neighbour however 46!

Did they work at the civil service or were they employed???

 

[unlacedgecko]

No, I was 'lucky' in that other health issues forced the generational swap over 10 years ago, I took over at roughly the same age as my father did from his father. But for many people my age (50) there is a still a 70-80yo generation above them holding all the reins who are fairly hale and hearty and have no interesting in handing things over, despite their children being well past the age they were when they inherited. The post war generation have grabbed all the benefits of increased life expectancy for themselves, and won't let go voluntarily. That is what is causing a lot of the trouble in the multi-generational farming industry.

I remember telling one of my head keep landlords of my eventual plans for a gypsy OAD sorting block herd through a mobile parlour, all out wintered.

He said he was jealous of my freedom of action.

He stood to inherit a reasonable dairy farm. But in his late 40s he was basically his father's herdsman.

 

[Still Farming]

https://www.facebook.com/228735667216/posts/10158777858667217

 

[Two Tone]

We all get old. This is part of nature.
Unfortunately when some get old, they start to see that things are becoming too modern for them and fail to see that as things are changing, the younger ones have already thought well ahead and are making changes to future proof the business.

Take the demise of BPS, for instance. The older ones see this as a huge disappointment and that the end of their world is nigh. They then see everything as going down hill. They refuse to see or believe that changes need to happen that will allow their next generation to continue.

Worse still, they refuse to believe that the younger ones have already thought about it all and have the solution to the problem well in hand.

When it has got to this situation, it really is time for them to “Chuff off” and hand the reigns over.
The trouble is that they just can’t see it and are prepared to do so.

 

[DRC]

I don't see how this will work in most instances. Owner occupier retires and farm goes on the market for a few million, who will have the funds to buy it, most likely another established farmer, not a young new entrant .
Or if a tenant farmer like me retires, I can guarantee our farm will be put to the one big tenant they want to farm the whole estate, or if not, one of the big AD/ potato farms will snap it up. Again I don’t see a young entrant getting a look in.
A much better way would be incentivising some sort of share farming agreement to allow a young person to build up capital, whilst taking the physical work away from the older farmer.
As for new methods, why should someone like myself get rid of a tried and trusted method like ploughing, when all the equipment is bought and paid for, rather than invest thousands in a super duper no till drill.

 

[Derrick Hughes]

I don't see how this will work in most instances. Owner occupier retires and farm goes on the market for a few million, who will have the funds to buy it, most likely another established farmer, not a young new entrant .
Or if a tenant farmer like me retires, I can guarantee our farm will be put to the one big tenant they want to farm the whole estate, or if not, one of the big AD/ potato farms will snap it up. Again I don’t see a young entrant getting a look in.
A much better way would be incentivising some sort of share farming agreement to allow a young person to build up capital, whilst taking the physical work away from the older farmer.
As for new methods, why should someone like myself get rid of a tried and trusted method like ploughing, when all the equipment is bought and paid for, rather than invest thousands in a super duper no till drill.

Clasic case of Government meddling with things they don't understand, EU farm support was absolutely crazy at times , but ha ho I made money out of it so best keep my mouth shut

 

[Lowland1]

I don't see how this will work in most instances. Owner occupier retires and farm goes on the market for a few million, who will have the funds to buy it, most likely another established farmer, not a young new entrant .
Or if a tenant farmer like me retires, I can guarantee our farm will be put to the one big tenant they want to farm the whole estate, or if not, one of the big AD/ potato farms will snap it up. Again I don’t see a young entrant getting a look in.
A much better way would be incentivising some sort of share farming agreement to allow a young person to build up capital, whilst taking the physical work away from the older farmer.
As for new methods, why should someone like myself get rid of a tried and trusted method like ploughing, when all the equipment is bought and paid for, rather than invest thousands in a super duper no till drill.

I am sure that’s the plan fewer farmers less people to deal with but it could be made to work as you suggest. A few grants etc to encourage the existing farmer to take on a younger business partner would enable a new entrant to have a go rather than what is happening now that it goes to an existing business a little redistribution of funds is actually all that’s needed.

 

[Still Farming]

Will it apply Nationally???
Sadly Devolved power's rarely follow suit but off NO ALTERNATIVE in their regions?

 

[colhonk]

Maybe you all missing the point. Give the old farmer £100,000, sell his farm ? £3mill tax the feck out of him win win for gov get their £100k plus gazillions more back.

 

[DRC]

Anyone with an owned farm, or a tenant who can contract farm it out, might as well just stay put and take the payment over the next 5 years anyway.
why throw out all the experienced farmers in favour of some wet behind the ears youngsters?. It’s farmers already drawing a pension that keep the weanling trade going

 

[neilo]

Will it apply Nationally???
Sadly Devolved power's rarely follow suit but off NO ALTERNATIVE in their regions?

It’s England only.

 

[Lowland1]

Anyone with an owned farm, or a tenant who can contract farm it out, might as well just stay put and take the payment over the next 5 years anyway.
why throw out all the experienced farmers in favour of some wet behind the ears youngsters?. It’s farmers already drawing a pension that keep the weanling trade going

Can I take the retirement payment and let the kids take over that’s a win win situation.

 

[Still Farming]

It’s England only.

Yes Dripford ,Griffiths and Co. don't support ANY national policies.

 

[Av Gorritt]

https://www.facebook.com/228735667216/posts/10158777858667217

Well , they can give me £100,000 any time as quick as possible . Oh well then ---£50,000 , I'll settle for that

 

[unlacedgecko]

Can I take the retirement payment and let the kids take over that’s a win win situation.

That's exactly what will happen in almost every case.

 

[Cowabunga]

Old folk who retire at 50 to spend the next 30 years complaining and writing letters, sipping tea through sour faced thinnlips, washing their car every day, and existing only to be complete pains to everyone should be fed to a government incinerator. Others all fine.

Made into biscuits they would also feed the needy.

 

[Cowabunga]

That's exactly what will happen in almost every case.

It seems to me that you can unless they have already been made partners by forward thinking parents. Which sounds completely daft to me. Qualifying new managers/businesses would not qualify for any further subs though, so if already partners they may as well just keep things as they are and take the annual payments until they cease, in about four or five year's time.