Replacing our Dowdeswell DP7

[John 1594]

Slightly off topic but the OP presumably has UCN or SCN boards on his DP7. How good are the modern dowdeswell DD or DDS boards that replaced them? I can see they are a lot bigger and more suited to modern tyres but beyond that I know nothing. I liked the big boards I had on my overum before I went back to UCN and a dowdy.

Have used allsorts here over the years, SCNs have always done a great job on this land, KV no9s made the worst job, awful finish, horrid things. DD bodies seem to be a scaled up version of the SCN, very similar finish, but with the added ability to work at wider widths

 

[John 1594]

Finish left by DD bodies at 14" wide on some of our heavier land

 

[Agri-Hire]

I'm assuming you are wanting to continue to plough in the furrow? If so we could offer you a 5 furrow 2140. If you are wanting to plough on top then it would be a 2145.
Please feel free to PM us for more information.

 

[Selectamatic]

We had a cat called Derek......

Our Milkman was called Derek.

 

[Drillman]

Slightly off topic but the OP presumably has UCN or SCN boards on his DP7. How good are the modern dowdeswell DD or DDS boards that replaced them? I can see they are a lot bigger and more suited to modern tyres but beyond that I know nothing. I liked the big boards I had on my overum before I went back to UCN and a dowdy.

I've found DD bodies ok with 520 rear tyres but struggle with 600 rear tyres. Maybe that's just our land though.

 

[John 1594]

I've found DD bodies ok with 520 rear tyres but struggle with 600 rear tyres. Maybe that's just our land though.

They are a damn sight better than KV no9s i know that

plough we had with those on left a furrow that you could just about get a 13.6 tyre in the bottom, and pulled bloody hard to achieve it

18.4 for heavy land and 20.8 for light land is what id consider an optimum "in furrow" tyre

any wider and its a compromise between lost adhesion and messy furrows between bouts

certainly the JD at work shod on 20.8/38s is a much better ploughing tractor than the other one shod on 650s

the 20.8s still grip when the 650s struggle to get you round the headland

 

[Mr Charisma]

Have used allsorts here over the years, SCNs have always done a great job on this land, KV no9s made the worst job, awful finish, horrid things. DD bodies seem to be a scaled up version of the SCN, very similar finish, but with the added ability to work at wider widths

No9's I believe were designed for deeper ploughing , the heavy land boys around me all seem to be using No 8's ,

To me the art is to find the right mouldboard that suits most of your land , my difficulty is that for the clay type soils you need plenty of turn to invert the furrow and yes the scn did this well ,,,,, clay soils by their very nature weather well , our red marl also needs a mouldboard with a similar action to a scn to invert that well , but and it's a big but , nice looking inverted ploughing on red marl is no good to man nor beast ,,,, as the ground just does not weather like clay , ,,,,,,, a good winters frosting will bring it down but if you turn some red marls over when they are a tad unkind and you think you are going to batter them into a seedbed after a couple of weeks then think again .
I do a lot of work with a neighbour , he runs a KV on no28's , I've got a Besson on no5's. ,,,,,, after a wet spell I can be onto the Besson ploughing up to a week earlier because the no 5 leaves a very open broken furrow , not nice ploughing to look at compared to the 28's I would agree but it lets the ground dry and is open to weathering
so what I'm trying to get at is find the mouldboard which works well for your land / tyre equipment and not move to far away from it ,,,, I for one would not worry about 1or 2 fields which are at the other end of the spectrum of your average soil type , you want to do a good job across most of your land

 

[Mr Charisma]

They are a damn sight better than KV no9s i know that

plough we had with those on left a furrow that you could just about get a 13.6 tyre in the bottom, and pulled bloody hard to achieve it

18.4 for heavy land and 20.8 for light land is what id consider an optimum "in furrow" tyre

any wider and its a compromise between lost adhesion and messy furrows between bouts

certainly the JD at work shod on 20.8/38s is a much better ploughing tractor than the other one shod on 650s

the 20.8s still grip when the 650s struggle to get you round the headland

Ironically my KV is on no9's and it's partner in crime is sat on 710's , i
It's all about using a furrow widener on the back furrow and setting your tractor tyres up well,,,,,,, ploughed many thousand of acres with that set up , and ploughed well ,,,,, the one occasion that let's it down is if you have wheel slip , wheel slip moves the furrow leaving it difficult to put the right amount back in ,,,,,, it was all about knowing when to go home !!!!

 

[Two Tone]

I would love to have been at the sales meeting where they decided that the best name for a plough is 'Hubert'.
Will they make a powerharrow called 'Derek'?

I think I know why they are called Hubert. I was brought up in (North) Suffolk and I have very fond memories of the accent used there.

There was a guy from E H Knights & Sons at Harleston, who taught me to plough with a brand new Ransomes TSR108 in 1976.
His name was Herbert, but everybody including himself pronounced it Hubb-ert! (Apologies to all Huberts (Hugh -berts) out there!)

In Suffolk, a true pronunciation for Hubert wold be something like Hoo-but. Derek might be Derr-ook?

Oi hoop oi int torken a lood ov owel squit!
But whatever you do, don't ever fall ill in Suffolk. Else yu'll be queer!

 

[John 1594]

Ironically my KV is on no9's and it's partner in crime is sat on 710's , i
It's all about using a furrow widener on the back furrow and setting your tractor tyres up well,,,,,,, ploughed many thousand of acres with that set up , and ploughed well ,,,,, the one occasion that let's it down is if you have wheel slip , wheel slip moves the furrow leaving it difficult to put the right amount back in ,,,,,, it was all about knowing when to go home !!!!

I wouldnt have a plough with furrow wideners if you gave me it

to me its a half arsed cheap way of curing a problem that shouldnt exist if you have a decently matched plough and wheel equipment

and when it turns wet, anything which throws loose soil into the furrow bottom is asking for trouble

 

[John 1594]

No9's I believe were designed for deeper ploughing , the heavy land boys around me all seem to be using No 8's ,

To me the art is to find the right mouldboard that suits most of your land , my difficulty is that for the clay type soils you need plenty of turn to invert the furrow and yes the scn did this well ,,,,, clay soils by their very nature weather well , our red marl also needs a mouldboard with a similar action to a scn to invert that well , but and it's a big but , nice looking inverted ploughing on red marl is no good to man nor beast ,,,, as the ground just does not weather like clay , ,,,,,,, a good winters frosting will bring it down but if you turn some red marls over when they are a tad unkind and you think you are going to batter them into a seedbed after a couple of weeks then think again .
I do a lot of work with a neighbour , he runs a KV on no28's , I've got a Besson on no5's. ,,,,,, after a wet spell I can be onto the Besson ploughing up to a week earlier because the no 5 leaves a very open broken furrow , not nice ploughing to look at compared to the 28's I would agree but it lets the ground dry and is open to weathering
so what I'm trying to get at is find the mouldboard which works well for your land / tyre equipment and not move to far away from it ,,,, I for one would not worry about 1or 2 fields which are at the other end of the spectrum of your average soil type , you want to do a good job across most of your land

strange how we struggled to make a good job with the 9s when we tried to go below 8-9" deep, they simply wouldnt turn the furrow over, instead tending to push it messily over in lumps, they didnt have the twist to invert the furrow over before it started to break

but then all no9s are is a glorified set of 8s with a bit welded on the top, similar to comparing UCN and SCN

The DDs have a much longer, smoother curve, but are still short enough not to require huge power input like a 28

 

[Flat 10]

I wouldnt have a plough with furrow wideners if you gave me it

to me its a half arsed cheap way of curing a problem that shouldnt exist if you have a decently matched plough and wheel equipment

and when it turns wet, anything which throws loose soil into the furrow bottom is asking for trouble

Like my furrow wideners
Cost £2 from a farm sale. Had to buy some long rear landslides mind. Hell of a lot cheaper than changing all 4 tyres on my tractor..... 20.8s would be ideal but I'm 600s. ploughing quite a bit more level now..........

 

[John 1594]

Like my furrow wideners
Cost £2 from a farm sale. Had to buy some long rear landslides mind. Hell of a lot cheaper than changing all 4 tyres on my tractor..... 20.8s would be ideal but I'm 600s. ploughing quite a bit more level now..........

On this slippery stuff i dread to think what they would be like in the wet

often have trouble with the first breed through the field after a rain because the bottom of the furrow has turned into a skating rink

im much happier seeing a nice clean furrow bottom whats been suitably trimmed off by a well adjusted disc, it just looks neater, especially combined with a wide share what cleans the bottom of the furrow out completely, something we struggled to achieve with the previous lemkens and kvernelands

 

[Flat 10]

On this slippery stuff i dread to think what they would be like in the wet

often have trouble with the first breed through the field after a rain because the bottom of the furrow has turned into a skating rink

im much happier seeing a nice clean furrow bottom whats been suitably trimmed off by a well adjusted disc, it just looks neater, especially combined with a wide share what cleans the bottom of the furrow out completely, something we struggled to achieve with the previous lemkens and kvernelands

I will take them off if I can't get along. A cheap crude solution to the problem though. Some of mine is tough enough.

 

[Mr Charisma]

I wouldnt have a plough with furrow wideners if you gave me it

to me its a half arsed cheap way of curing a problem that shouldnt exist if you have a decently matched plough and wheel equipment

and when it turns wet, anything which throws loose soil into the furrow bottom is asking for trouble

John without the risk of sounding patronising I wish I was still able to plough with 18.4 or 20.8 but I need more output from a tractor and plough than these tyres can produce, I'm afraid for us 120 hosses and 4 furrows ain't enough !!!!!! ,,,,,,, our last tractor on 20.8 was well matched with the plough she had which was the Dowdeswell , time moved on and when that tractor was changed she was replaced with a tractor on 710's , at that time the trio arrived which still does the majority of our primary cults ,,,,,,, then the 2 main tractors where on 710's as that is what there weight required to give a good cross section between flotation and traction ,,,,,,,,, ploughing carried on for several years on 710's with no real big deal ploughing land equal to yours in the heavy league . Things changed on the ploughing side when our big tractor was replaced by something a fair bit smaller(due to hiring a cat purely for pulling trio) . No need for 710's on this tractor but she did need 650's to make the most of her horsepower in my opinion , she has become our main ploughing tractor and with the besson and her furrow wideners make an excellent job of matching up . In a perfect world I would have 580 or 600 tyres and run duels but been there before and got the t shirt !!!!!!!

 

[Two Tone]

I wouldnt have a plough with furrow wideners if you gave me it

to me its a half arsed cheap way of curing a problem that shouldnt exist if you have a decently matched plough and wheel equipment

and when it turns wet, anything which throws loose soil into the furrow bottom is asking for trouble

I will take them off if I can't get along. A cheap crude solution to the problem though. Some of mine is tough enough.

I agree with @John 1594 . Furrow wideners are not a good solution. Especially where you need to plough properly to reduce Blackgrass, Far better to use narrower tyres and a plough with bodies that move the soil over enough for tyres to fit the furrow.

We actually specifically ordered our last main tractor with tyre that would fit the furrow better. I'd swear there isn't as much wheel-slip too. Wider wheels need a hell of a lot of weight to get them to grip. Narrower ones dig in and get better traction.

 

[Mr Charisma]

I agree with @John 1594 . Furrow wideners are not a good solution. Especially where you need to plough properly to reduce Blackgrass, Far better to use narrower tyres and a plough with bodies that move the soil over enough for tyres to fit the furrow.

We actually specifically ordered our last main tractor with tyre that would fit the furrow better. I'd swear there isn't as much wheel-slip too. Wider wheels need a hell of a lot of weight to get them to grip. Narrower ones dig in and get better traction.

I totally agree in every thing you say, it's a long known fact that narrow tyres bite in better , the problems start to arise when the acreage you farm doesn't drop you into one class or another ,,,,,,, two tone , I believe you are farming enough land to run a tractor on narrower ploughing tyres , I believe that John farms in a not such a big way and his tractors are on narrower tyres ,,,,,, I like a lot of others fall into the in between category , we have to make do with what we have ,

 

[4755dave]

KV no 8s are a nice all round body.
Totally agree with tyre width matching furrow bottom.
tbh thses days go on land, much better for soil, and if you see bold furrows behind tyres remember you just dont see it in a furrow bottom but it is still there and you dont plough it out!

 

[Two Tone]

I totally agree in every thing you say, it's a long known fact that narrow tyres bite in better , the problems start to arise when the acreage you farm doesn't drop you into one class or another ,,,,,,, two tone , I believe you are farming enough land to run a tractor on narrower ploughing tyres , I believe that John farms in a not such a big way and his tractors are on narrower tyres ,,,,,, I like a lot of others fall into the in between category , we have to make do with what we have ,

Farming is often a compromise. As is life!

We are lucky enough with the joint venture of machinery and labour sharing with our neighbour to have 2 190 hp NH tractors. One has wide wheels for top work and the other narrow ones for ploughing and deeper cultivations.

But what always stuns me is that occasionally we put our 2155 Fastrac on the plough, which weighs a fraction of the NH's, is 35 hp less and it will not only out-plough the NH, but does a better job! It only has 480/70 R30 tyres on it.

The plough is a Dowdeswell DP120 hydraulic vari-width with DD's. We also have a 3 metre press. But we have mostly given up using it with the plough, because it doesn't allow the plough to do a good enough job on heavy land burying BG seed.

However we do pull it behind a shakerator, when necessary to break down the large clods that the shakerator creates on heavy land. I've often wondered about doing away with the packer on our Sumo Trio and towing this press instead. I'm sure it would create a better finish on heavy land. But I am becoming even more certain that the Sumo Trio has made our BG problem much worse!

We have also been known to pull the press behind a set of 3 metre discs. They not only seem to make the discs penetrate more, but leave a much better finish.

I sometimes wish I'd just stuck with ploughing everything, using an intermediate power harrow when needed ahead of a combi-drill. Diesel and steel are cheap compared with chemical BG control, which doesn't often work well enough. There is little doubt in my mind any more that min till has ruined this farm.

From now on, I plan to only use it ahead of Rape, where we can still kill BG chemically. But it will also now only be properly drilled, not broadcast or band seeded.

This year, we ploughed ahead of nearly every cereal, drilled reasonably early (late Sept/early Oct), pre-em'ed and Avadexed everything. We now have well established crops with very little if any BG.

But, it did plough really well, which helps. And the best ploughing is always straight into undisturbed stubble.

 

[Humding]

KV no 8s are a nice all round body.
Totally agree with tyre width matching furrow bottom.
tbh thses days go on land, much better for soil, and if you see bold furrows behind tyres remember you just dont see it in a furrow bottom but it is still there and you dont plough it out!

They've moved here from No 8's to No 28' for the wider tyres. BTW who let you on here? Standards must be dropping.....