Round Up Resistant Blackgrass

[rob1]

If you home save seed and use robust rates of roundup i dont see the problem you will maintain its efectiveness and if youdont import bg seed in cereal seed sjould avoid problems. What other people do is their look out and if thty have to sow more to grass it will help the local price for those who can grow wheat

 

[Tractor Boy]

What the majority of meat consumed is irrelevant when the country is running a deficit in beef production and thus has to import so there is a good home market for it!

600mm is 23 inches, there are ranchers in USA growing lots of forage on 12 inches of rain mob grazing. It can be done, but not by set stocking as you have too small a root mass so that is why you're lawn is burning up.

Just googled mob grazing. Have to confess I know nothing about it.

 

[shakerator]

from what i have read, in crop applications to RR crops is infinitely more risky than "stubble cleaning".

however, European resistance has been found around hops/ vines etc, presumably where copious amounts have been used.

certain stragies: "double knock" w/ para/diuat on stubbles

http://paraquat.com/news-and-features/archives/paraquat-protects-glyphosate-in-aussie-double-knock-0

shame its banned

mix with 24d/mcpa if concerned on BLW

the ryegrass resistance in oz is certainly real but is that soil related?

 

[Andy Howard]

If you home save seed and use robust rates of roundup i dont see the problem you will maintain its efectiveness and if youdont import bg seed in cereal seed sjould avoid problems. What other people do is their look out and if thty have to sow more to grass it will help the local price for those who can grow wheat

That is fine until BG jumps the hedge from your neighbours. What does everyone consider robust rates to be of round up? Elmstead reckons 1500g of active. I think that is probably correct.

 

[SilliamWhale]

the ryegrass resistance in oz is certainly real but is that soil related?

They did have a history of using low rates and very low water. Also a lot of aussies spray multiple times in the fallow period which exacerbates the problem - they say they don't want anything growing and taking away moisture.

 

[SilliamWhale]

That is fine until BG jumps the hedge from your neighbours. What does everyone consider robust rates to be of round up? Elmstead reckons 1500g of active. I think that is probably correct.

If only we could confidently skip a year or two of roundup maybe two years in five then I think things become a little different. I think the attention has been turned to the issue and wouldn't be altogether surprised to see something based on glufosinate ammonium with some other stuff come to the market within about 5-10 years.

 

[rob1]

Is the use of low dose preharvest round up making things worse too?

 

[Tractor Boy]

Is the use of low dose preharvest round up making things worse too?

Wouldn't think so, as the black grass is pretty much ripe and shedding seed before then.

 

[Cow1]

That is fine until BG jumps the hedge from your neighbours. What does everyone consider robust rates to be of round up? Elmstead reckons 1500g of active. I think that is probably correct.

That's interesting because I've been thinking we have been going too low on volunteers etc. we have been as low as 720g/ha of active, 2 litres of generic and have seen stale seedbeds recover back from it.

 

[Tractor Boy]

That's interesting because I've been thinking we have been going too low on volunteers etc. we have been as low as 720g/ha of active, 2 litres of generic and have seen stale seedbeds recover back from it.

I don't think volunteers have been getting over a dose like that. It must be another flush! In reality around 540g/ha (1.5L/ha generic 360) should be enough. This should also be enough for 2/3 leaf black grass.

 

[shakerator]

It must be another flush!.

+1

 

[willy]

his year I have been having the discussion with my father that I do not want to use round up more than once in a.

That is just being stupid. If you need to go more than once do it. Just make sure you use robust rates and be more flexible.

 

[Cow1]

I don't think volunteers have been getting over a dose like that. It must be another flush! In reality around 540g/ha (1.5L/ha generic 360) should be enough. This should also be enough for 2/3 leaf black grass.

I thought the same until I looked. Too far forward plants to be fresh volunteers. It was using Roundup Ultimate at 1.33 l/ha, which equates to 720 g active. I've swapped back to generic now as I see no advantage in fancy stuff.

 

[Tractor Boy]

I think everyone is getting a bit tied up in what is a good robust rate of glyphosate. 3-4 L/ha are really for large broad leaved weeds and perennial grasses and BLW's. 1.5-2l/ha has always been considered strong enough for young BLW's and grassweeds. Indeed less than 10 years ago Monsanto produced a product called Sting Eco. This was specifically for producing stale seedbeds. It had 120g/ha glyphosate and rec rate was 3-4 L/ha. The only difference between this and generic roundup was it included a fast uptake wetter to enable cultivation within 6 hrs!!

 

[Andy Howard]

his year I have been having the discussion with my father that I do not want to use round up more than once in a.

That is just being stupid. If you need to go more than once do it. Just make sure you use robust rates and be more flexible.

Why is that being stupid? Basic herbicide resistance strategy is not to do multi annual applications. School boy stuff. Why is glyphoshate different? Because it is cheap?

 

[willy]

Why is that being stupid? Basic herbicide resistance strategy is not to do multi annual applications. School boy stuff. Why is glyphoshate different? Because it is cheap?

Because just saying using it once is very rigid and you need to farm with all your faculties and use common sense. I agree with checking herbicide resistance but you could be also increasing pressure by letting weed seeds multiply because you will only use it the once.

Blackgrass is simple to control. Drill early using direct drilling while the soil is warm, get good competitive crop, spray off blackgrass patches in may with round up and have at least 2 spring breaks in 5 years. Don't f**k about with stacking pre ems because you still won't get enough control and you will be reluctant to spray off in may because you have spent to much getting there.

P.s. may or June is the ideal time, don't know why but you will find that no more black grass will grow in these patches. I think it must be to do with communication in the soil and once the blackgrass goes to head other un germinated seeds will self destruct. ( I am not mad) I don't think

 

[Badshot]

Because just saying using it once is very rigid and you need to farm with all your faculties and use common sense. I agree with checking herbicide resistance but you could be also increasing pressure by letting weed seeds multiply because you will only use it the once.

Blackgrass is simple to control. Drill early using direct drilling while the soil is warm, get good competitive crop, spray off blackgrass patches in may with round up and have at least 2 spring breaks in 5 years. Don't fudge about with stacking pre ems because you still won't get enough control and you will be reluctant to spray off in may because you have spent to much getting there.

P.s. may or June is the ideal time, don't know why but you will find that no more black grass will grow in these patches. I think it must be to do with communication in the soil and once the blackgrass goes to head other un germinated seeds will self destruct. ( I am not mad) I don't think

If it is so easy to control why is it becoming such a pest on half the country?

 

[TWF]

I have been spraying multiple doses of generic roundup + wetter. We have had the best flushes of black grass I have ever seen. The trouble is the low dose isn't enough to hit the tiny plants just coming through . So the stale seed bed stays a shade of green. Mainly just did 2 x0.75lts/ha+wetter and last dose of 1.5l/ha ( land is mole ploughed and worked to 50mm rolled then rakerolled between the two low doses . The real problem is that most of the black grass doesn't come through till late October so now wet. But this year has been a very good year to try and get on top of grass weeds. Planting with Panorama WW at a high seed rate when conditions allow. So Safe till mid March.) Heavy land and still greening up nicely with blackgrass.

 

[willy]

If it is so easy to control why is it becoming such a pest on half the country?

Because chemical company's ain't gonna tell us and we are like sheep. We don't like doing something different from the norm incase some one might laugh us.

I am just begining to realise and have only just began to reverse the black grass population. But for the 1st time in years I feel that it's not the threat to my farm that I once thought and feel there are plenty of options against it. You just have to jump off the merry go round. Also use your own farming knowledge. One example is that they keep banging on about rolling to get the bg to chit. So I have done a trail back to front and have not rolled after the seed hawk because it has already rolled the seed so why bother rolling the rest of the bg. And results are really amazing

 

[TWF]

Because chemical company's ain't gonna tell us and we are like sheep. We don't like doing something different from the norm incase some one might laugh us.

I am just beging to realise and have only just began to reverse the black grass population. But for the 1st time in years I feel that it's not the threat to my farm that I once thought and feel there are plenty of options against it. You just have to jump off the merry go round. Also use your own farming knowledge. One example is that they keep banging on about rolling to get the bg to chit. So I have done a trail back to front and have not rolled after the seed hawk because it has already rolled the seed so why bother rolling the rest of the bg. And results are really amazing

And you have been DDing on light limestone land for a few years which will be helping. I have noticed the DD'ed land with the grass weeds left on top seem to take up the pre-M chemicals much better as the black grass is so shallowly rooted.