S690i and 770 demo

[Mr Charisma]

Looking at this thread it certainly seems that the Lexion Hybrid certainly has more set up options than our JD670 Hybrid ,,,,,,, all this talk of bomb doors and altering rotor speed has me slightly envious

Anyway. @Clive , I seem to remember that you used to get on well with a CTS ,,,,,,. Last couple of years I've been able to open my concave up to nearly 30 , this year I haven't got past 18 without filling the tank up with ear tips , even increasing throughput didn't thrash them up , helped when I shut sieves a bit but all that did was start the returns 'roundabout' , does this mean my crop is not as fit as I think it is, I always seem to find that sweet spot in the morning and as the sun goes down but hate the heat of the afternoon , and when I study my swath I understand why the rotors struggle to separate the grain from the jumbled up mess ,,,,,, by the way I don't get hung up on sample or average losses

 

[Colin]

What size rotors is yours small or large

Large with ONLY 490hp[emoji41]

 

[Honest john]

Large with ONLY 490hp[emoji41]

I believe there is only one size of rotor in CR's. You can have different bits bolted too the rotor though.
Then in more resent years a feed cylinder in front of the pair of rotors.
It's the width of sieve box tank size & HP that goes up in the range.

 

[Honest john]

Looking at this thread it certainly seems that the Lexion Hybrid certainly has more set up options than our JD670 Hybrid ,,,,,,, all this talk of bomb doors and altering rotor speed has me slightly envious

Anyway. @Clive , I seem to remember that you used to get on well with a CTS ,,,,,,. Last couple of years I've been able to open my concave up to nearly 30 , this year I haven't got past 18 without filling the tank up with ear tips , even increasing throughput didn't thrash them up , helped when I shut sieves a bit but all that did was start the returns 'roundabout' , does this mean my crop is not as fit as I think it is, I always seem to find that sweet spot in the morning and as the sun goes down but hate the heat of the afternoon , and when I study my swath I understand why the rotors struggle to separate the grain from the jumbled up mess ,,,,,, by the way I don't get hung up on sample or average losses

I run a C670.
We run the cave at 30/35 mm mostly 25/40 full range.

Mostly start the day at 30 if it's getting the grain out of head.
In the heat of the afternoon it slows you a bit as straw breaks tooo much loading sieves.
Then in the evening you speed up as the straw stays in one bit. Then as damp creeps in lack of power slows you up.

I believe in running the cave as wide as poss. Takes less power, easier for grain to get though the mat of straw in the cave area.
Speed as fast as poss without damage to grain. Slowing as grain gets dryer, but most adjustment of cave gap.

Tips you are going to leave in heap or close sieves & slow down.

The Class keeps the straw in better order than the Deere which must be positive on Diesel & forward speed.

All my obviations. What's wrong with a 40/50 mm setting On the cave when straw is dry ??

 

[T Hectares]

I believe there is only one size of rotor in CR's. You can have different bits bolted too the rotor though.
Then in more resent years a feed cylinder in front of the pair of rotors.
It's the width of sieve box tank size & HP that goes up in the range.

The narrow body machines have smaller diameter rotors.

 

[db9go]

I believe there is only one size of rotor in CR's. You can have different bits bolted too the rotor though.
Then in more resent years a feed cylinder in front of the pair of rotors.
It's the width of sieve box tank size & HP that goes up in the range.

The are two sizes of rotor 17" or 22" the early CR 9070 had 17" rotors then the later CR 9070 had 22" rotors when it went to add blue engines about year 2012.
The new CR.80 combines are small rotors and the CR .90 combines are large rotors.

 

[Honest john]

The are two sizes of rotor 17" or 22" the early CR 9070 had 17" rotors then the later CR 9070 had 22" rotors when it went to add blue engines about year 2012.
The new CR.80 combines are small rotors and the CR .90 combines are large rotors.

Or was I getting mixed up with Class.
Sorry It's confusing its class that only have the one rotor size then.

Thank you for making that clear.

 

[homefarm]

I think it is much easier to learn/set the combine when not chopping, you need to see the straw to understand what is happening.
Rotor speed sets the centrifugal force needed to get the grain from the ear for each crop. I find I hardly change it but 450 for OSR and 950/1000 in wheat. Faster is not better as then you force more material not grain, MOG , through the concaves.
MOG needs to stay with the straw It is your enemy on the sieves. If you watch the grain coming in the tank the sieves are massive for that amount of grain. They overload with MOG, try not to make any by over threshing.

Concave I alter a lot,but start wide and close till just threshed and straw hardly broken I expect to see white tips in the sample and never had a claim. The rethresher on the NH might help with this but why bother.

The biggest losses are usually header losses. Heads the ground and caused by uneven feeding of the rotor.
The NH vario has revolutionise this in my opinion. The crop has to flow perfectly and an inch or two in or out with the knife makes such a difference sometimes, I alter it going one way to the other and definitely when you change speed.

 

[fergie35]

Another question which was bugging me is what is it about a 10.90 that allows it to get a lot more output. If it's just more engine power with the same innards otherwise where is that power actually used to increase output. Can you just force crop more crop through the same concave clearance, or can you spin the rotors faster than in a 9.90? The world record was only set in a sub 10 t/ha crop of Santiago and they were spotting at over 100 tph most of the time with 80 t/hr on average. We're currently at more like half that.

Slightly different rotors in a 10.90 still twin pitch but slightly different plus a DFR (although yours might have DFR)

 

[fergie35]

That's where the key question of sensor proportionality comes into it. When we go faster normally the rotor losses shoot up and the returns go up in that above scenario. If these are just going up because there are more losses per second, then we might be fine to increase the speed. Obviously the answer is to scratch around out the back and see if the losses are acceptable. I have been doing that quite a bit and certainly we're at lower losses than we ever had with the MF. Accordingly, given the rotor losses seem to jump up the quickest, we turned the sensitivity down of that sensor and upped the speed from about 5.5kph up to 6.3kph.

on your CR the sensors want to roughly be set at 30 30 50. On new cab machines i.e CRX.X machines sensors roughly at 10 10 30 as they have different wiring/sensors and software.

 

[fergie35]

Nicely put.

I was thinking about @Clive and @T Hectares recommendations earlier. Clive seemed to say go with as slower rotor speed as is possible, whereas T Hectares said go with the rotor as close to flat out as possible. Given what you're saying with your spin dryer analogy, it would seem that you'd side with T Hectares. Maybe the difference of opinion is reflected in the differences in design between the hybrids and the true rotor designs with the former being part mangle and part spin dryer.

a Claas hybrid combine doesn't use rotors for threshing it uses a drum just like a walker machine. Where as the CR/Axial flow use the rotors for threshing hence you need the speed and concave gap wide. Fast and loose is how your drive a CR as my colleague keeps telling me.

 

[fergie35]

I believe there is only one size of rotor in CR's. You can have different bits bolted too the rotor though.
Then in more resent years a feed cylinder in front of the pair of rotors.
It's the width of sieve box tank size & HP that goes up in the range.

Not true. two different rotor sizes, 17" (narrow chasiscombines - same width as 5 walker mahcines) and 22" (wide chassis machines - same as 6 walker machines) also two different types of rotor S3 or Twin pitch. Then you can have DFR or no DFR

 

[Fish]

Another thing to consider in this mix of settings, are the concaves themselves, ie, which to use ? Small wire, big wire, pull wire etc, or a mix.
After 20 years of running AFs, my typical set-up for wheat is a mix of small wire and as many big wire concaves as I can get away with.
At the moment I'm running (7140 case with 6 concaves) 3 small wire then 3 big wire, then as the crop gets fitter I will change to 2 small and 4 big, this will get most of the grain clear of the rota before it passes over the grate area.
This set-up will allow me to run with a slower rota speed and a more open concave setting and stop the combine mashing the straw + giving big out put.

 

[homefarm]

We run a helical small wire concave first not CNH but has bars at right angle to crop flow, then large wire, then standard small wire where returns enter rotor.
Helical allows wider concave setting I find, as more aggressive early threshing helps.

Still have three heavy concaves so hardly ever swap around.

At the moment I'm running (7140 case with 6 concaves)

Perhaps you can answer my question as like me you will have had a increase in power over the last twenty years with little change in rotor and concave design.

Could you still use more HP in your 7140?

 

[charlesbrown]

Perhaps you can answer my question as like me you will have had a increase in power over the last twenty years with little change in rotor and concave design.

I'm sure you are right, we went from an underpowered AF 1660 with 16ft cut to a 5088 and 20ft which was horrible until we had a Steinbauer power module fitted that has absolutely transformed it, been cutting dry Crusoe/Skyfall at 7mph plus this year, and smashing the straw to smithereens!

You need the power to keep that rotor stuffed full- faster the better. Certainly a year when we could have done with a wider cut!

cb

 

[Wiking]

@Feldspar Thanks for the nifty little loss calculator

 

[farmerbill]

Where do you have the concave set on the scale? Have it on 2.5 atm, wondered about opening it a bit and increasing rotor speed. On 820rpm at the moment. Trying to save straw.

 

[farmerbill]

This is with a late 1680

 

[homefarm]

I'm sure you are right, we went from an underpowered AF 1660 with 16ft cut to a 5088 and 20ft which was horrible until we had a Steinbauer power module fitted that has absolutely transformed it, been cutting dry Crusoe/Skyfall at 7mph plus this year, and smashing the straw to smithereens!

You need the power to keep that rotor stuffed full- faster the better. Certainly a year when we could have done with a wider cut!

cb

Our 5088 has a chip!
Turned it off once to see the difference, would have stopped after 100metres but phone rang so did a round. Never been off since.

 

[homefarm]

Where do you have the concave set on the scale? Have it on 2.5 atm, wondered about opening it a bit and increasing rotor speed. On 820rpm at the moment. Trying to save straw.

Every year seems different but I think one year I had the concave on 4 on the old scale but more often 2.5. This year does seem an easy thrash year here ,try it and see, as I have said earlier I start wide and close rather than narrow and open