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A great day today, thanks to @brendon bumkin for organising the day, joel has certainly given me more to think about and try in the coming year
Soil Health; A Living Perspective - Optimising Soil Management for Productivity
- Thread starter Brendon Bumpkin
- Start date
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- CW5 Cheshire
dontknowanything
Member
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- Cambridge
Was any sort of proof given, or just wishful thinking optimism?
i don't think proof of anything much exist in agriculture, you just have to try stuff and see what works and what doesn't I guess and even if something works for one farm it might not for another
pity i couldn't go Monday - the school nativity was great though !
dontknowanything
Member
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- Cambridge
I've got some magic beans you'll love
i will try them - if they don't grow I won't repeat it
only one way to find out anything for sure
dontknowanything
Member
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- Cambridge
come one, pull the other one. You can't try everything.
Are you trying to tell me that someone selling their ideas with no evidence to back it up is as convincing as someone who has farmers doing it and showing the benefits in practice?
come one, pull the other one. You can't try everything.
Are you trying to tell me that someone selling their ideas with no evidence to back it up is as convincing as someone who has farmers doing it and showing the benefits in practice?
i will try anything that seems plausible and is possible without incurring great cost trying, i won't live long enough to try everything
no one is as convincing as knowing myself if something works for me or not, I don't believe anyone or anything until I have seen it myself
dontknowanything
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- Cambridge
Exactly. So seeing it working somewhere else is a good way of filtering out what is more likely to work with you. Hence my question - did he actually show anything, or was it all sweet-talking only?
i didn't go - i was at school nativity !
seeing things work elsewhere is useful but doesn't exclude me from trying things if I think they sound plausible as long as trying isn't too expensive that is !
dontknowanything
Member
- Location
- Cambridge
I know you weren't there, I'm slightly bemused why you're defending it (does it even need defending?)
No Worries
Member
- Location
- Cheshire
The short answer is NO he didn't provide any evidence!
I'm defending nothing other than a principle that you won't learn anything for sure unless you try
- Location
- CW5 Cheshire
Joel packs an awful lot into a day, covering several different angles of improving your soil. He starts by pointing out that achieving good soil requires good physical structure, chemical balance and biology and all three of these are of equal importance. However one of these three has clearly been almost totally overlooked until recently. His approach comes over as doing what you can to improve your soil, in your circumstances, on your farm. He quotes quite a few research articles to back up his theories, and is very open on what can be proven and what is more based on his belief. For example, he is a fan of No Till, but is aware of the lack of proof and difficulties of working out if it raises O.M or not. He is very keen on mycorrhizae and gives links to plenty of research on this. He is of the opinion that mycorrhizae can boost soil quality, plant health and alter weed populations. As an example of weed control, he puts forward that annual meadow grass can be controlled in golf courses by AMF. He gives plenty of advice on how to minimise damage to mycorrhizal populations in the soil, but accepts there will always be compromises on farm.
Joel describes himself as a communicator these days, not a researcher or a farmer. He also spends quite a lot of his time informing and education consumers on the benefits of eating healthy food, as well as giving talks to farmers all over the world.
He points out that we are still at the very beginnings of understanding soil biology and is of the opinion that in ten years time much of what he says will have been updated, and some also proven wrong. However, he is of the opinion that we have to start somewhere. For people well read on this subject already, listening to Joel is probably not going to revolutionise your views on anything, but he is very good at pulling lots of different things together in a way that makes sense. I would recommend anyone with an interest in soil biology to listen to him if they get the chance.
Joel describes himself as a communicator these days, not a researcher or a farmer. He also spends quite a lot of his time informing and education consumers on the benefits of eating healthy food, as well as giving talks to farmers all over the world.
He points out that we are still at the very beginnings of understanding soil biology and is of the opinion that in ten years time much of what he says will have been updated, and some also proven wrong. However, he is of the opinion that we have to start somewhere. For people well read on this subject already, listening to Joel is probably not going to revolutionise your views on anything, but he is very good at pulling lots of different things together in a way that makes sense. I would recommend anyone with an interest in soil biology to listen to him if they get the chance.
- Location
- CW5 Cheshire
Joel tried to get across to us that the most important thing to take away from his presentation was that fungi are significantly more efficient at converting a carbon food source into stable O.M. than bacteria. The O.M. produced by bacteria is much less stable than that produced by fungi, and therefore more easily consumed and released as CO2. I haven't subjected this statement to a @Feldspar type analysis, but it seems to make sense to me. You are probably already aware of the above fact, or may be you have evidence to the contrary? How many other people are aware of this though, and do I think it is an important message to get across (assuming he is correct of course).
By the way, I think Joel would be delighted that you came out and admitted publicly that you are an addict, but I very much doubt that he would suggest you go cold turkey.
dontknowanything
Member
- Location
- Cambridge
I already said specifically in my report that I couldn't go cold turkey. But you know that since you re read it every night before bed?!Joel tried to get across to us that the most important thing to take away from his presentation was that fungi are significantly more efficient at converting a carbon food source into stable O.M. than bacteria. The O.M. produced by bacteria is much less stable than that produced by fungi, and therefore more easily consumed and released as CO2. I haven't subjected this statement to a @Feldspar type analysis, but it seems to make sense to me. You are probably already aware of the above fact, or may be you have evidence to the contrary? How many other people are aware of this though, and do I think it is an important message to get across (assuming he is correct of course).
By the way, I think Joel would be delighted that you came out and admitted publicly that you are an addict, but I very much doubt that he would suggest you go cold turkey.
- Location
- CW5 Cheshire
Oops, sorry!
It's clear that my bedtime revision sessions must be slipping behind.
shakerator
Member
- Location
- LINCS
Small farms
Brendon Bumpkin
Member
Got one coming up in 4 weeks at Roehampton University (on a Saturday so free parking and not too much congestion to get there) - see http://regenag.co.uk/index.php/course-calendar/nutrient-management