Solar panel business rates

[Wooly]

Just when you think solar panels were a great investment, I've had business rates put on mine that were installed 5 years ago !

Yet another tax slipped in from the back door.

Has anyone successfully appealed against their business rates and if so how ?

Our system is only roof mounted panels and under 18kw

 

[David.]

Just you, or others locally too?
Did a rating officer visit or was it out the blue?

 

[Wooly]

Just you, or others locally too?
Did a rating officer visit or was it out the blue?

Completely out of the blue. Either seen from the eye in the sky or from the solar panel website.

Had business rates for the solar panels and another diversification enterprise on the farm. Luckily we got one reduced to nil undert small business rates relief.

 

[Clive]

Surely they are only a business if you sell the power ?

If the power is 100% used in a existing business they are just a tool of that business and if that business is farming then there should be no more case to rate solar than rate your tractors ?

If you are selling the power though I can see why they are rated (although it’s not exactly the right way to go about encouraging green business !)

 

[Wooly]

Because it is a small system and therefore no export meter, it is deemed that half is exported to the grid and therefore we 'sell' 50% .................. hence the business rates.

 

[farmerm]

Because it is a small system and therefore no export meter, it is deemed that half is exported to the grid and therefore we 'sell' 50% .................. hence the business rates.

If you don’t have an export meter you can’t be getting paid for selling power can you? If the capacity of the system is less than your annual use you can’t be selling power because you don’t have surplus to sell?

It’s irritating when the goal posts get moved after the ball has been struck!

 

[Wooly]

If you don’t have an export meter you can’t be getting paid for selling power can you? If the capacity of the system is less than your annual use you can’t be selling power because you don’t have surplus to sell?

It’s irritating when the goal posts get moved after the ball has been struck!

We get paid for 50% of what we produce, even if we use all or none of it. That’s how the small systems work.

We get 100% of the feed in tariff.

No mention of business taxes when we installed the system. In fact there was generous tax allowances because it is ‘green’ power !

 

[Farfrae]

Surely they are only a business if you sell the power ?

If the power is 100% used in a existing business they are just a tool of that business and if that business is farming then there should be no more case to rate solar than rate your tractors ?

If you are selling the power though I can see why they are rated (although it’s not exactly the right way to go about encouraging green business !)

If i'm reading it correctly this article would seem to indicate the opposite

https://www.solar-trade.org.uk/business-rates-mainly-export-solar-agreed-valuations-office/


"Due to existing legislation, complex VOA classifications mean that owners of solar panels are split into two classes; those who ‘mainly export’ their power, and those who use the majority of power onsite on the sites which they occupy. The good news is that the STA has signed a Memorandum of Agreement with the VOA [3] following close work on the fair treatment of ‘mainly export’ generators. This means that most solar systems exporting to the grid or via a Power Purchase Agreement to tenants will see a decrease in business rates, reflecting falling costs, and lower rates of subsidy.


However, great concern remains over the treatment of business and some public sector rooftops. Organisations that own their solar panels and use most of the power themselves – a highly efficient option – will see a 6-8 fold increase in the business rates they have previously paid for solar. This threatens to damage the commercial rooftop industry and sting businesses taking action on climate change. It is now up to Ministers to intervene to prevent red tape crippling the rooftop solar industry."

 

[farmerm]

we seem to have the most socialist of conservative governments! Numemerous stealthy tax changes aimed at hitting people with assets... like insurance premium tax... everywhere the system is rigged to penalise folk who scrimp, save and invest whilst rewarding those who spend every penny.

 

[Goweresque]

No mention of business taxes when we installed the system. In fact there was generous tax allowances because it is ‘green’ power !

As I said almost exactly 5 years ago, the State giveth and the State taketh away.......

https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index...-and-the-state-taketh-away.15803/#post-276746

 

[Goweresque]

we seem to have the most socialist of conservative governments! Numemerous stealthy tax changes aimed at hitting people with assets... like insurance premium tax... everywhere the system is rigged to penalise folk who scrimp, save and invest whilst rewarding those who spend every penny.

So poor people being forced to pay more for their energy so that wealthy landowners and people with capital to invest can make guaranteed returns is your definition of free market capitalism?

 

[Still Farming]

Easier to say that we take the financial and land risks and commitments with green energy and effects of climate change and give any gains ,to be fritted away by wasteful Councils ?

 

[MrNoo]

So poor people being forced to pay more for their energy so that wealthy landowners and people with capital to invest can make guaranteed returns is your definition of free market capitalism?

Yet it's ok to pay £149/Mwh (indexed linked for the next 25yrs +) for Hinckley point nuclear power where solar or suchlike is down to £45-47/Mwh, that argument doesnt really stack up does it especialy in light of zero subs for solar now???
The park they are due to put in here, the business rates are more than the land rent, money for nothing for them to fritter away on useless projects and what do business rates actually get you? No street lights, bins to empty, pot holes to fill, nada, you get nothing for paying business rates, is this your definition of free market capitalism

 

[Exfarmer]

Just when you think solar panels were a great investment, I've had business rates put on mine that were installed 5 years ago !

Yet another tax slipped in from the back door.

Has anyone successfully appealed against their business rates and if so how ?

Our system is only roof mounted panels and under 18kw

Is it an ag building? Are you using the power on the farm. As my understanding, if that is the case , you should not be liable. Speak to the NfU

 

[farmerm]

So poor people being forced to pay more for their energy so that wealthy landowners and people with capital to invest can make guaranteed returns is your definition of free market capitalism?

Despite what Trump believes our planet can’t survive free market capitalism and we don’t have another one. If these schemes kick started a new era of sustainable and affordable energy it would have been great for all not just the wealthy...

 

[Wooly]

Is it an ag building? Are you using the power on the farm. As my understanding, if that is the case , you should not be liable. Speak to the NfU

Yes, Yes ( except they presume 50% goes to the grid) and I certainly won't bother the NFU with this. They have the RT, BPS and CSS to sort out before worrying about solar panels.

 

[akaPABLO01]

Is it an ag building? Are you using the power on the farm. As my understanding, if that is the case , you should not be liable. Speak to the NfU

Doesn’t matter, I have an ag farmer paying £100/week in solar tax, he was pretty fuming about it as it meant the council would claim 25% of tariff off him over its lifetime. (£5k/year)

After all said and done he spent £95k on 100kW and is still set to earn £300,000 (after tax) on his investment, wherelse can this be achieved over 20 years?

Basically, the feed in tariffs were too high but export tariffs remain bottlenecked and the grid benefits substantially on top of tariffs they receive.

The argument for fairer export payment needs to be addressed more than business rates.

 

[Exfarmer]

Yes, Yes ( except they presume 50% goes to the grid) and I certainly won't bother the NFU with this. They have the RT, BPS and CSS to sort out before worrying about solar panels.

I would appeal it, I do not believe they can levy just on the panels, ( well I very much hope not)
I also believe that their is a rateable value below which no business rates are paid

 

[akaPABLO01]

I would appeal it, I do not believe they can levy just on the panels, ( well I very much hope not)
I also believe that their is a rateable value below which no business rates are paid

We have appealed and NFU are aware. From what I worked out it seems they are taking 50% FiT, calculated on current FiT level dependant when it’s sent off to Ofgem after inspection. 35% export currently.

There is a bigger back story on this particular yard though and currently receive large subsidies from Ofgem.

I have larger installs installed before that have had council inspection but no tax levied. It’s a strange somewhat unbalanced audit I can’t work out how sites are chosen to pay.

 

[Goweresque]

Yet it's ok to pay £149/Mwh (indexed linked for the next 25yrs +) for Hinckley point nuclear power where solar or suchlike is down to £45-47/Mwh, that argument doesnt really stack up does it especialy in light of zero subs for solar now???
The park they are due to put in here, the business rates are more than the land rent, money for nothing for them to fritter away on useless projects and what do business rates actually get you? No street lights, bins to empty, pot holes to fill, nada, you get nothing for paying business rates, is this your definition of free market capitalism

Oh, I totally agree, the Hinkley point contract is utterly bonkers, you won't get an argument from me on that (though there is an argument that a solid base load of generation is required if renewables are going to work, and the only carbon free base is nuclear, as we don't have suitable geography for hydro schemes).

My point is that renewables rely on subsidy to work in the first place, so its no good complaining if the government start withdrawing some of that money if they think its too lucrative or they just need more taxes to p*ss up a wall. What they give they can take away too. Farmers should know this, we've been taking subsidies for long enough, and know that what we get is subject to arbitrary removal/reduction/fines/having to jump through hoops.