TFF Group buys ?

Are any of these distributors listed companies? It sounds like they are creaming it in and I'd like to make a share of that profit, just like I can buy shares in Tesco or Morrison to get my bit of the retail chain.

Personally, I think that the idea has merit, but I suspect that Clive is underestimating the work that the distributors do - economics 101 would say that if it was as easy and profitable as is suggested, there would be more companies doing it and competition between them all.
 

bactosoil

Member
the farming job in one way or another is a servant to the supermarkets and bows in part to what they dictate on price , will uk ag stand up and win that battle … almost certainly not for a wide range of reasons , what Clive is suggesting is almost opposite to the supermarket, ag pooling its orders as customers and going to the supplier with factual very large orders which gives it a huge strength /clout , will farmers run with this ( that is way past trad buying groups ) …. I hope so as its one battle that could be won
 
Are any of these distributors listed companies? It sounds like they are creaming it in and I'd like to make a share of that profit, just like I can buy shares in Tesco or Morrison to get my bit of the retail chain.

Personally, I think that the idea has merit, but I suspect that Clive is underestimating the work that the distributors do - economics 101 would say that if it was as easy and profitable as is suggested, there would be more companies doing it and competition between them all.
Some are listed companies or owned by listed companies. As with most companies in the associated industries, there has been consolidation and there will be more of course. There are some big multinational companies involved as well, most of them with turnovers of a billion or more.

Whilst I am all for healthy competition the fact is that if margins get squeezed consolidation is generally the end result and fewer -but larger- players in a marketplace does not strike me as being in anyone's interests because it ultimately means farmers get less choice in future.

There are still a number of smaller, even family owned companies and one or two man bands providing agronomy services and supply around the country- I have met some of them- all of them are out there doing their damnedest to provide a worthwhile service in an ever changing marketplace and long may they continue.
 

kiwi pom

Member
Location
canterbury NZ
The margins the distributors are making out of agchem is huge maybe we could buy it from the manufacturers and cut the distributors out, saving us loads on our Agchem bill ? Makes sense to me
You cant cut out a distributor, because the product still needs to be bought and distributed. You could replace them though.
Arable farmers could sell all their grain direct too, cut out the merchants and organise the transport themselves. Why dont they?
 
Come on guys it’s a very interesting basic proposition, who wouldn’t want to dramatically reduce a few of the really large annual spends? Would it really matter if the organising company made an agreed margin if significant savings were in offer to us? How it would work in reality would be quite hard to develop I would surmise but I would be up for seriously considering it once the mechanics were known.
 

kiwi pom

Member
Location
canterbury NZ
Actually thinking about it a little more @Clive How about thinking bigger, some kind of huge central online farmer owned business that not only buys inputs and machinery etc for its members but sells all produce direct to mills, international customers etc, replacing the merchants.

There could be a livestock section to where members buy and sell stock between themselves, rearers to finishers and then farmers to butchers, abattoirs etc. Cutting out cattle auctions and the money they make and making livestock transport more efficient whilst improving animal welfare.

Maybe in time it could be some kind of farmer owned 'middleman' to the dairy industry, pooling owners milk and selling to processors on their terms.
A huge task but maybe doable? Buying chems could just be the start.
 
Pay upfront.
Use TAG recs.
Live without being able to send it back.

What discount would I need to do the above........
Live without being able to send it back and having to pay upfront would be a deal breaker for a lot of people I know.

If the manufacturer is not informed of a forecast requirement well in advance of it being needed it just won't be manufactured. They don't have factories sat waiting around for UK agchem orders. Remember not all products are even approved for use in all markets. It's not like they spend all day making Ally because it can be used all around the world- in some markets it may not be commercially viable or even legal to supply. Each marketplace is distinctly different to the one we are familiar with. Try getting hold of 3C in America. Ask our North American or Australian friends how many cans of Aviator they used last season.
 
If the manufacturer is not informed of a forecast requirement well in advance of it being needed it just won't be manufactured. They don't have factories sat waiting around for UK agchem orders.
Surely the volume of a certain chemical used in the UK won't change. The only thing that would change would be who distributes it to the farmers.
 

teslacoils

Member
Location
Lincolnshire
Paying upfront at 1.5 percent interest is not hard.

If I have wheat in the ground in October, I best most big growers could book their fungicides or 80 percent in November.
 

Clive

Staff Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lichfield
Actually thinking about it a little more @Clive How about thinking bigger, some kind of huge central online farmer owned business that not only buys inputs and machinery etc for its members but sells all produce direct to mills, international customers etc, replacing the merchants.

There could be a livestock section to where members buy and sell stock between themselves, rearers to finishers and then farmers to butchers, abattoirs etc. Cutting out cattle auctions and the money they make and making livestock transport more efficient whilst improving animal welfare.

Maybe in time it could be some kind of farmer owned 'middleman' to the dairy industry, pooling owners milk and selling to processors on their terms.
A huge task but maybe doable? Buying chems could just be the start.
It had occurred to me that the idea works both ways yes. But trying to do all that from day one would be far to great a task - if successful in Ag Chems the platform could quickly evolve as you describe
 

Clive

Staff Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lichfield
Farmers do the volume forecasting BTW - why do you think everyone wants YOUR data ?

yet another valuable thing that farmers currently give away to the benefit of others
 

Tonka

Member
Location
N Yorkshire
""""Some kind of farmer owned 'middleman' to the dairy industry, pooling owners milk and selling to processors on their terms.""""

Mmnn, wasn't that what the old Milk Marketing Board was all about?
 

homefarm

Member
Location
N.West
In my opinion we can not win the race to the bottom, lower imput prices might help short term. We need stop selling and market better. Produce what is wanted in the right quantities.

A JD guy told me our problem when discussing prices

"We produce 200 tractors every day if we sell 190 tomorrow, we discreetly sell 10 at a discount. Farmers produce one grain or litre extra and discount every grain/litre".

I believe the volatility in our markets discourages investment, after all what we supply is their essential raw material.

The internet has produced marketing models which have worked for some other industries.

The easyjet system I think could work for grain, but we would have to forget about emptying the grain store every year.
 

Brisel

Member
Location
Dorset
What do you mean by the EasyJet system?

You can empty your grain stores every year. Just sell physical grain and buy a futures position instead.
 

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Industry-wide ruminant group to tackle endemic diseases across the UK

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Written by John Swire

A new UK-wide cattle and sheep industry group is to be created to speed up progress against endemic diseases and reputational challenges which are costing the cattle and sheep sectors at least £500 million per year.

An industry consultation* on creating the new group had a strong majority supporting the move in principle, with many believing it will accelerate work to...
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