The man in the cheap suit

[turbo]

Of course he won. The battle for votes in next election has now to be fought on his terms.
His latest term is on the SM and CU.
He has moved from a hard out position on both to a transition period in on both.
Tories have no other option but to follow suit. Of course Corbyn will keep upping the anti, and pushing
the SM and CU from temporary to medium term, to some other modesty covering loin cloth which commits
Britain to permanent membership through some new painful associate membership of EU.

Meanwhile of course the Tory party will tear itself apart once more with the headbanging few
turning into UKIP mark II.

Either way you guys will probably have a true Marxist PM next time round in Corbyn.
OR you have a Tory PM elected on a manifesto driven by Corbys's agenda, leading a broken Tory government more intent on infighting than ever before.

Absolute worst of all possible worlds.

Thanks to Farage, Boris and the red bus.

You will be telling us next that remain won

 

[Old Boar]

Do you really think the general population cares who wears what? They, in general, have lost all trust in the politicians, whatever party. They want to go to work, come home to a warm house, good food and have a bit left over from their wages for treats. Every General Election we are all promised this and it never happens, and now we have sort of come to understand that the whole thing is a farce.
We were told if we all tightened our belts (not the bankers, of course!) for a couple of years, things would get better. It did not. The pay freeze and the rising prices means most people cannot afford what they could a few years ago, even working longer hours. People are beginning to see that no matter how fast they run on the treadmill, they will never get ahead, and it is beginning to pee people off.
To take the focus off the tax dodging, there is a concerted and ongoing blackening of anyone who is not employed, or God help them, disabled. Every day there is something in the press to build hate against this sector, but nothing against the bankers or tax dodging companies who cost a great deal more. People are beginning to see this as the lie it is, and are not happy.
There does not seem to be a politician with a working brain cell, who can see a way through the mess, and sell it to us in a straightforward manner, to give hope.
I dont have any answers, apart from buying an island and going off grid. It gets more tempting every day.

 

[le bon paysan]

I'd be interested to know why you think a person who has worked in a senior postion in a globalist bank is considered trustworthy and fit for public service.

Banks have been involved in many wars, including world wars ... specifically given the circumstances of the 2008 crash most normal people would point out they have little if any moral fibre, social duty or sense of community.

Banks have been forced to account for their incompetance by law, not by the character and will of their directors.

Macron appears to have moral fiber, social duty and a sense of community. He could have stayed a banker and made a lot more money with a lot less hassle than entering politics.
Time, as always, will tell.

 

[Henarar]

Do you really think the general population cares who wears what? They, in general, have lost all trust in the politicians, whatever party. They want to go to work, come home to a warm house, good food and have a bit left over from their wages for treats. Every General Election we are all promised this and it never happens, and now we have sort of come to understand that the whole thing is a farce.
We were told if we all tightened our belts (not the bankers, of course!) for a couple of years, things would get better. It did not. The pay freeze and the rising prices means most people cannot afford what they could a few years ago, even working longer hours. People are beginning to see that no matter how fast they run on the treadmill, they will never get ahead, and it is beginning to pee people off.
To take the focus off the tax dodging, there is a concerted and ongoing blackening of anyone who is not employed, or God help them, disabled. Every day there is something in the press to build hate against this sector, but nothing against the bankers or tax dodging companies who cost a great deal more. People are beginning to see this as the lie it is, and are not happy.
There does not seem to be a politician with a working brain cell, who can see a way through the mess, and sell it to us in a straightforward manner, to give hope.
I dont have any answers, apart from buying an island and going off grid. It gets more tempting every day.

so what to do ? spend money that isn't there ? kick the can down the road ? we here of these obscene wages that some get, more in a year than many will see in a lifetime
why are pay rises given as a % ? that only serves to widen the pay gap, why do some need more money as a pay rise than others ?

 

[caveman]

so what to do ? spend money that isn't there ? kick the can down the road ? we here of these obscene wages that some get, more in a year than many will see in a lifetime
why are pay rises given as a % ? that only serves to widen the pay gap, why do some need more money as a pay rise than others ?

Yep.
For instance.
The NHS wage bill could probably be adjusted to follow the "share the wealth" socialist mantra at no extra cost to the tax payer.
If those at the clean end of the stick who have it cushty don't like it....... they can pee off to the USA for more dosh and we could get some eastern european managers in on the cheap to replace them.

 

[Hindsight]

so what to do ? spend money that isn't there ? kick the can down the road ? we here of these obscene wages that some get, more in a year than many will see in a lifetime
why are pay rises given as a % ? that only serves to widen the pay gap, why do some need more money as a pay rise than others ?

Yes with all organisations that have pay scales the % pay rise has always flummoxed me. By default the better paid will get incrementally more and thus widen the pay gap. There you go such is life.

 

[rob1]

Yes with all organisations that have pay scales the % pay rise has always flummoxed me. By default the better paid will get incrementally more and thus widen the pay gap. There you go such is life.

why does that happen? could it be those at the top so benefit from a % rise are the ones making the desicions, surely not, people at the top like to be fair, dont they? They dont need to replace the managers with eastern eurpeans they just need less of them, OH works in the nhs, the level of managers is stupid, the front line numbers have been cut but not the management, there is more of them now

 

[turbo]

why does that happen? could it be those at the top so benefit from a % rise are the ones making the desicions, surely not, people at the top like to be fair, dont they? They dont need to replace the managers with eastern eurpeans they just need less of them, OH works in the nhs, the level of managers is stupid, the front line numbers have been cut but not the management, there is more of them now

It's not just the nhs that is top heavy with management the whole public sector is but they are never touched when there is job cuts just the minions on the front line

 

[Henarar]

Yes with all organisations that have pay scales the % pay rise has always flummoxed me. By default the better paid will get incrementally more and thus widen the pay gap. There you go such is life.

should put up everyone's pay by the same amount

 

[Muck Spreader]

Yes with all organisations that have pay scales the % pay rise has always flummoxed me. By default the better paid will get incrementally more and thus widen the pay gap. There you go such is life.

Suppose a lot of folk think the same about farm subsidies. The wealthier you already are the more subsidy you are entitled to.

 

[RagnarHairybreeks]

What a hell of a lot of people forget is that a very big slice of the 48% are properly p*ssed off with the Tories for the enormous, self serving, volte face they performed when the referendum result was announced. Those people, in droves, voted against TM and most voted Labour as they considered the Lib Dems to be a used condom.

On the other side of the coin, Corbyn was able to make huge, entirely unfulfillable promises because he didn't think Labour stood a cat's chance in hell of becoming elected. This got him the young, impressionable vote as well as the die hard membership and defectors from the Tories.

At least the defectors, I suspect, will desert him now as the result was sufficiently scarily close to be a dangerous thing to protest-vote over in that manner.

But yes. The Tory Party is now UKIP with a little tradition and nous added and Labour is now further to the left than a fishfork.

The Lib Dems are still damaged goods, but they represent the only hope I can see at the moment. I don't want to see jackboots of either stripe, and that is what the two main parties are offering at the moment.

 

[RagnarHairybreeks]

It's not just the nhs that is top heavy with management the whole public sector is but they are never touched when there is job cuts just the minions on the front line

Absolutely true. The NHS has become a holy cow. The cow needs some of the horns trimming and the resources passed to the udders.

 

[czechmate]

Absolutely true. The NHS has become a holy cow. The cow needs some of the horns trimming and the resources passed to the udders.

Most of my cows have horns. Are you saying they would make more milk without them?

 

[RagnarHairybreeks]

OK, rather a horribly tortured metaphor I grant you - but you know what I mean. To campaign on anything other than a 'more money for the NHS' ticket has become political suicide in this country.

Simply chucking money at something doesn't fix it. Finding out where it is going wrong and putting in measures to stop it going wrong fixes something.

 

[Muck Spreader]

OK, rather a horribly tortured metaphor I grant you - but you know what I mean. To campaign on anything other than a 'more money for the NHS' ticket has become political suicide in this country.

Simply chucking money at something doesn't fix it. Finding out where it is going wrong and putting in measures to stop it going wrong fixes something.

But the NHS is already markedly underfunded compared to the rest of the developed world's healthcare systems. It's a simple fact that healthcare is expensive and with a rapidly ageing population coupled with expensive pharmacological advances enabling us to be kept alive longer the costs and demands will only get bigger.

 

[wanton dwarf]

But the NHS is already markedly underfunded compared to the rest of the developed world's healthcare systems. It's a simple fact that healthcare is expensive and with a rapidly ageing population coupled with expensive pharmacological advances enabling us to be kept alive longer the costs and demands will only get bigger.

As far as I know that is not correct, it's spin put out by the Labour party which doesn't take account that each system is different. Personally I would call it a lie.

The NHS doesn't make a profit.

Whereas most other nations have insurance based healthcare.

I think Belgium used to have 6 different systems you could join when I was there ... each one making a profit for rich people.

NHS pays over 25% out in medical negligance claims ... whilst paying far too much money for simple medicines such as paracetamol and asprin.

 

[Exfarmer]

It is staggering the amount paid out by the NHS in compensation and pensions.
The compensation payments are a disgrace, in that they are attempting to compensate patients for negligence by employees which would never be tolerated in a private system

 

[rob1]

It is staggering the amount paid out by the NHS in compensation and pensions.
The compensation payments are a disgrace, in that they are attempting to compensate patients for negligence by employees which would never be tolerated in a private system

The pensions are a huge drain on the nhs, OH will be having a very nice one thank youvery much, while it is true she has worked for it since she left school and is a band 7 HV now she would have to have a fund of over 500,000 to get the same payout from a private one, we need a non political discussion in the country to find a way forward, the trouble is the labour party and unions just use it as a political football which benefits no one in the long run except their own short term political gain

 

[Exfarmer]

I do not have any problem with historic pensions, the employees often took a fairly low paid job in public service with expectation of a reasonably decent pension at the end.
However the situation has changed, pay has risen dramatically for many and the pensions , unfunded, paid as a percentage of terminal,pay is left to be picked up by future taxpayers.
Meanwhile the private sector who generate the income have seen their self funded pansions decline to a derisory sum compared to what was promised 30/40 years ago when first embarked on. To cap it all many pensions in the private sector have been taxed by payments made to those in the public sector who went private , then siscovered they would hsve been better off staying in the public scheme.
Dont get me started on compensation in the NHS covering the arses of those who have cocked up. Is it 400.000,000 paid out for children damaged at birth annually?

 

[Muck Spreader]

I do not have any problem with historic pensions, the employees often took a fairly low paid job in public service with expectation of a reasonably decent pension at the end.
However the situation has changed, pay has risen dramatically for many and the pensions , unfunded, paid as a percentage of terminal,pay is left to be picked up by future taxpayers.
Meanwhile the private sector who generate the income have seen their self funded pansions decline to a derisory sum compared to what was promised 30/40 years ago when first embarked on. To cap it all many pensions in the private sector have been taxed by payments made to those in the public sector who went private , then siscovered they would hsve been better off staying in the public scheme.
Dont get me started on compensation in the NHS covering the arses of those who have cocked up. Is it 400.000,000 paid out for children damaged at birth annually?

Compensation just shouldn't be paid in monetary compensation but in the underwriting of future care and support for the plaintiff. This would limit the desires of the ambulance chasing lawyers and the opportunists out to make a quick buck. People have to realise that medicine is not a precise science, guesswork and intuition still end up playing a part. I bet the veterinary profession wouldn't last long if they got sued everytime they failed to keep a calf alive.