The puppy bubble has it burst?

[JP1]

We didn't get much say in it LOL
talking 40 years ago

Lasted well then

 

[alomy75]

We had our lab put down a few weeks ago (cancer). The out of hours vet cost alone to get him from lunchtime Saturday to 9am Monday morning where he could go back to his normal vet was £1800. That’s just to house and monitor him. No treatment. He was on a drip from ‘his’ vet so couldn’t come home. His insured level (we had reduced this to 1500…big mistake) was p*ssed up the wall in initial tests in the space of the first hour.

Mrs Alomy75 is now ready for another dog; has anyone got or know of a sensibly priced black lab or lab/spaniel cross (also black)? PM please (south lincs but will travel one county in any direction) thanks

 

[Henarar]

Lasted well then

Well no. What a stupid coment

 

[thorpe]

Well no. What a stupid coment

well youed know , you make plenty !

 

[Henarar]

well youed know , you make plenty !

I know, glad you agree

 

[john432]

I really do hope that the bubble has burst permanently.. my area is massive puppy farming...the odd one's do it tidy and care for their bitches.but they are the minority. No one knows how much it's worth to the rural economy,all cash in hand! But guessing the spending of some farms on flash new cars,and 4x4's in realasion to their livestock farming, it's a huge business. This makes me sound jealous or envious of these people...no I actually love dogs, and they love freedom and interaction with their owner.
Sadly so many breeding bitches never leave their cages, and are shot or put down when they're done earning.

 

[Northern territory]

I really do hope that the bubble has burst permanently.. my area is massive puppy farming...the odd one's do it tidy and care for their bitches.but they are the minority. No one knows how much it's worth to the rural economy,all cash in hand! But guessing the spending of some farms on flash new cars,and 4x4's in realasion to their livestock farming, it's a huge business. This makes me sound jealous or envious of these people...no I actually love dogs, and they love freedom and interaction with their owner.
Sadly so many breeding bitches never leave their cages, and are shot or put down when they're done earning.

Some vets doing very nicely out of the job as well.

 

[Doing it for the kids]

It’s pretty appalling out there.

Having just bread a litter of 9 working labs I am in tune with the market I feel.

The KC are pretty hopeless, only good at taking your money.

Lots of breeders are utterly clueless

Friend of friend was asking about values as she is about to have a litter, when pushed on info she’s done no health checks at all, no hip, eye or elbows, not even KC registered. I sent a message back to her that they were worthless and she was a disgrace, hope it got through.

Prices seem to be two levels, cheap or normal Quality is reflected in both of these

 

[essexpete]

Dogs must cost a fortune to keep (never owned one) amazing how many people complain they have no money but at the same time have a heap of pets.
Wonder what the environmental impact of all these animals is? It never gets mentioned, probably because it's a vote killer

One of my vegan customers had 2, I wonder how that works.

 

[Boysground]

I’ve had a couple of litters over the years. I keep being asked for pups from my youngest lab. Tbh I don’t think I will do it again, at the end of the day to have a litter and do it properly there is a lot of cost and work. selling them to good homes where I could be certain they would be looked after as I would is difficult. It’s more straightforward for me to buy a replacement pup from one of the good breeders I know.

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[Bald Rick]

Mrs Alomy75 is now ready for another dog; has anyone got or know of a sensibly priced black lab or lab/spaniel cross (also black)? PM please (south lincs but will travel one county in any direction) thanks

East would be the North Sea …

 

[Dry Rot]

The point is, all these health tests shouldn't be necessary. How did these genetic faults get into the breeds in the first place? If they are working dogs, hard work should soon show up the problems. What happened before health tests became the norm? Simple, if you bred more pups than you needed for replacements, they were worthless -- or not worth a price anyway. They were given away to friends or humanely dispatched.

Now the vets "won't put a "healthy dog down" so they are patched up to breed more of the same. I have a vivid memory of a dog sold at a sheep dog sale...and for good money too. It had hip dysplasia so bad it could barely run! I have never had a dog vet tested in my life, simply because they are all tested in the field and if they are not outstanding examples of the breed, they don't get bred from. And some of my dogs have been sold for five figures in today's money.

 

[workin f nowt]

I’ve had a couple of litters over the years. I keep being asked for pups from my youngest lab. Tbh I don’t think I will do it again, at the end of the day to have a litter and do it properly there is a lot of cost and work. selling them to good homes where I could be certain they would be looked after as I would is difficult. It’s more straightforward for me to buy a replacement pup from one of the good breeders I know.

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Me too

 

[Doing it for the kids]

It certainly takes a lot of time up!

 

[PostHarvest]

How did these genetic faults get into the breeds in the first place?

I remember the late Phil Drabble fought hard to prevent the KC from recognising the working collie as a breed. His argument was that they (KC) had messed up every breed by encouraging over use of show-winning sires and that the working colly had been bred for two or three characteristics, intelligence, stamina and agility amongst them.

 

[alomy75]

East would be the North Sea …

Not from south lincs

 

[Dry Rot]

I remember the late Phil Drabble fought hard to prevent the KC from recognising the working collie as a breed. His argument was that they (KC) had messed up every breed by encouraging over use of show-winning sires and that the working colly had been bred for two or three characteristics, intelligence, stamina and agility amongst them.

I spoke to the then secretary of the ISDS (a few years ago) and he said they had had meetings with the KC. His final remark solved the problem. "We've got the sheep!". The KC had no answer to that!

What the KC did do was to keep the monopoly of issuing Export Pedigrees and granted the ISDS "recorgnised" status. That means for, say, the American Kennel Club to accept that an ISDS pedigree as correct, the KC would issue an Export Pedigree. That maintains the KC's monopoly.

The joke is that if you examine any KC Export Pedigree it states that accuracy can't be guaranteed because the pedigree is drafted from information supplied by the breeder! In short, KC pedigrees could be utter bollox and if they are, it's nothing to do with the KC.

Pedigree fraud, which is widespread, could be very much reduced if a DNA sample was required (a tuft of hair would do) along with a registration application. But they won't do that because they are all at it! The whole thing is a fraud because the KC is basically saying, if your dog conforms to the breed standard, it is a representative example of the breed so should do what that breed does. But no one wanting a working dog buys a show dog if he has any sense (though I will admit a few breeds are dual purpose).

An Export Pedigree is not cheap but is required every time a KC registered dog is registered with a recognised foreign stud book. That is how they make even more money by "recognising" certain other stud books (like the ISDS) and accepting each other's pedigrees. It is a licence to print money, without as much effort or responsibility!

From the above, you may guess that I hate the KC with a vengeance. But I blame the owners of working dogs for accepting their nonsense even more. Shows have done more harm to domestic animals than any other single cause.

 

[MRT]

Pedigree fraud, which is widespread, could be very much reduced if a DNA sample was required (a tuft of hair would do) along with a registration application. But they won't do that because they are all at it! The whole thing is a fraud because the KC is basically saying, if your dog conforms to the breed standard, it is a representative example of the breed so should do what that breed does.

From the above, you may guess that I hate the KC with a vengeance. But I blame the owners of working dogs for accepting their nonsense even more. Shows have done more harm to domestic animals than any other single cause.

Not just dogs. Some sheep societies are so bent you can stand at the sales and see several breeds sold under one banner. As long as you are a member though - you may register anything and sell it. You can buy unregistered stock from unregistered flocks and sell them. There are genuinely less crossbred sheep in the unregistered flocks. Buyer beware.

Why don't working breeds do away with the KC and use other systems to keep a lineage?

 

[Dry Rot]

Why don't working breeds do away with the KC and use other systems to keep a lineage?

Some have, but not as far as I am aware, here in the UK. (Denmark, I think). The KC is like a cross between the Free Masons and the Mafia!

I took on the KC over some of their rules over the control of gundog field trials. Their committees had the last word on the selection of judges, even who could hold field trials, etc. I found a firm of solicitors who took on my case pro bono. They took it to The Office of Fair Trading who made it be known that if the KC did not change the rules, legislation could follow. That opened things up so in theory anyone could run a field trial, within certain limitations. But it takes guts to stand up against the KC and I don't think anyone actually dared do it. I am effectively banned but as I have my own clients, it doesn't really bother me.

The problem is, the KC is a private club and it's members can make any rules they like. If you want to use their registry, you dance to their tune. In the USA, if dog oners don't like the way the AKC is run, they simply go a 100 yards down the road and start up their own registry! I saw that happen. A dog breeder was caught out on pedigree fraud and got all his dogs de-registered. He simply started up his own registry and carried on as before!

 

[Hooby Farmer]

I’ve had a couple of litters over the years. I keep being asked for pups from my youngest lab. Tbh I don’t think I will do it again, at the end of the day to have a litter and do it properly there is a lot of cost and work. selling them to good homes where I could be certain they would be looked after as I would is difficult. It’s more straightforward for me to buy a replacement pup from one of the good breeders I know.

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Thats the same as me, decided not to breed my last bitch a couple of years ago. I really wanted a pup from her to keep the line going just for sentimental reasons. Then i thought 4 dogs would have been too many and also I hate getting rid of the pups because you never really know the homes they go to.