Thinking of changing to shedding sheep. Change my mind.

[neilo]

Absolutely nothing wrong with cull Shetlands. They're the cornerstone of my flock. I won't have any scabby though. I've @The sheep dipper man on speed dial.

I nearly put ‘three legged scabby mule’, but thought you might bite sooner.
The same principle applies though, quality premiums go out of the window when supply is short.

 

[unlacedgecko]

I nearly put ‘three legged scabby mule’, but thought you might bite sooner.
The same principle applies though, quality premiums go out of the window when supply is short.

They do indeed.

I'm breeding towards a quality carcass. It might just take a couple of generations.

 

[Aspiring Peasants]

The same principle applies though, quality premiums go out of the window when supply is short.

The premium for Beltex lambs which I reckon was £20 before Xmas is now between £35 and £40 based on what I sold this week.

Wouldn't dream of selling them live weight.

Do you not think it's a bit short sighted to have a sheep system where dead weight selling is the only outlet?

 

[SteveHants]

The premium for Beltex lambs which I reckon was £20 before Xmas is now between £35 and £40 based on what I sold this week.


Do you not think it's a bit short sighted to have a sheep system where dead weight selling is the only outlet?

You can change it very easily by putting a wooled terminal to them for your slaughter generation lambs - works great, all mine went live and made the same as mule x terminals.

 

[Aspiring Peasants]

You can change it very easily by putting a wooled terminal to them for your slaughter generation lambs - works great, all mine went live and made the same as mule x terminals.

If you do that do you not lose the benefits promoted by shedders of no wool = no maggots, less work etc

 

[SteveHants]

If you do that do you not lose the benefits promoted by shedders of no wool = no maggots, less work etc

Not in your ewe flock, no - you have the wooled rams to manage and possibly some later summer fly treatment on the lambs, but hopefully if they are born in April, they'll all be dead by christmas.

 

[Tim W]

If you do that do you not lose the benefits promoted by shedders of no wool = no maggots, less work etc

---use a shedding terminal sire?

 

[Aspiring Peasants]

---use a shedding terminal sire?

Such as?

 

[Poorbuthappy]

To be fair, you could have sold a three legged scabby Shetland to advantage last Spring. When numbers are short and demand is on fire, quality really doesn’t matter.

Trade was pretty good through Nov & Dec this year, but my Exlana (& crosses) were between five and ten pound behind the Charollais crosses at the same weights.
I appreciate that they are a maternal breed, and accept/want a poorer carcass from them, but the purebreds are pitiful on that score, from the shoulders right through to the hindquarter. Obviously that lack of shape and width should make for better lambing ease and reduced losses, but there is always a balance to be made economically.

I've certainly got some pures that would come under your "pitiful" description, but I'm perfectly happy with direction mine are headed on the conformation side. Very little if any difference between them and the freshly shorn highlander types. Which is what you yourself said when you first had them.

 

[hendrebc]

Such as?

Not much available as our shedders for terminals but I do like the idea of trying a texel or beltex that peels as a terminal sire it's meant to work quite well to give yo shedding lambs or at least lambs that peel well enough to hopefully not need any fly treatment.
I think lambs with no wool would be more useful than ewes with no wool. With ewes if you shear them then at least your mostly done for the year. With lambs it's constant dirty tails and fly spraying. If something has maggots I can almost guarantee it will be a lamb getting rid of that headache would be a massive help. But you need shedding ewes to get shedding lambs.

 

[unlacedgecko]

@Woolless has texel influenced shedders which could be used as a terminal sire.

Or there are people breeding clean shedding dorpers with good feet. Alternatively, breed your own shedding terminal.

@Tim W has posted photos of shedders based on Suffolk crosses before.

 

[neilo]

I've certainly got some pures that would come under your "pitiful" description, but I'm perfectly happy with direction mine are headed on the conformation side. Very little if any difference between them and the freshly shorn highlander types. Which is what you yourself said when you first had them.

Many of my remaining shedding ewes (more than half were culled in the Spring) are very similar to freshly shorn Highlanders. At slaughter weights they would be a bit behind on confirmation. Whether confirmation is overrated is subject for debate of course…

I chuckle when I see the mutual backslapping on Facebook when kill sheets are posted up with lambs (Exlana or Easycare) that are at max dw limits & above, most verging on the fat end of the scale, and yet still more O’s than U’s.

There’s no reason that can’t be improved by selection of course, if it’s considered of merit.

 

[neilo]

Not much available as our shedders for terminals but I do like the idea of trying a texel or beltex that peels as a terminal sire it's meant to work quite well to give yo shedding lambs or at least lambs that peel well enough to hopefully not need any fly treatment.
I think lambs with no wool would be more useful than ewes with no wool. With ewes if you shear them then at least your mostly done for the year. With lambs it's constant dirty tails and fly spraying. If something has maggots I can almost guarantee it will be a lamb getting rid of that headache would be a massive help. But you need shedding ewes to get shedding lambs.

This year my shedding ewes have gone to a Texel lamb by @gatepost ‘s shedding stock ram. Partly to add a little width and shape, but also to sort of temperament issues. Very pleased with how the lamb has grown on without seeing any concentrates too.

IF the resultant lambs shed, I aim to use that cross over my Exlana x Highlander x females.
Pure Exlanas certainly aren’t for me, but I am still experimenting for now, using them as a source of shedding genetics. A couple of pure exlanas went over the ewe lambs this year too, partly for an easy lambing but I will also have a few more 3/4 shedders to select from, depending on how I feel about them come the end of April.

My two unrelated Highlander rams remain on standby to sort things out , having only covered twenty or so ewes this year.

 

[Kingcustard]

I have all the 1 crop and older ewes to a NZ Suffolk and they topped the market in October out of 3000+ lambs

To be honest the marts are struggling, fine for 2 percent of the sale that butchers buy but as an average I would rather the piece of mind of knowing what I am getting. That may be different down south though.

And as I have said before, the wool shedding is only a part of why I have them, they lamb themselves on sh!t grass with no cake or fert and they produce good lambs.

They aren't for everyone and those who don't agree find plenty reasons to knock them but so far they have worked for my system and they will be here until that changes.

We don't all have grass all year round, options to reseed, brassica crops and land for paddock system grazing.

They certainly outperform my mules when EVERYTHING is considered.

Still looking to keep conventional eraly lambers for the better fields and to break up lambing and try and catch the early market but if I had to do one or another it would be shredders no doubt.

 

[Kingcustard]

Not much available as our shedders for terminals but I do like the idea of trying a texel or beltex that peels as a terminal sire it's meant to work quite well to give yo shedding lambs or at least lambs that peel well enough to hopefully not need any fly treatment.
I think lambs with no wool would be more useful than ewes with no wool. With ewes if you shear them then at least your mostly done for the year. With lambs it's constant dirty tails and fly spraying. If something has maggots I can almost guarantee it will be a lamb getting rid of that headache would be a massive help. But you need shedding ewes to get shedding lambs.

I tried a Beltex and a texel, weren't better than the pures, NZ Suffolks were but worry about having to pull a few.

 

[Kingcustard]

Many of my remaining shedding ewes (more than half were culled in the Spring) are very similar to freshly shorn Highlanders. At slaughter weights they would be a bit behind on confirmation. Whether confirmation is overrated is subject for debate of course…

I chuckle when I see the mutual backslapping on Facebook when kill sheets are posted up with lambs (Exlana or Easycare) that are at max dw limits & above, most verging on the fat end of the scale, and yet still more O’s than U’s.

There’s no reason that can’t be improved by selection of course, if it’s considered of merit.

At the end of the day its about the bottom line surely. Yes they can be improved but if you are laughing at my lambs at £132 then laugh on, they left more money than my fancy E grade Beltex lambs that cost a fortune to keep and had to be lambed inside as they were dying outside in March Scottish weather out of mules.

 

[neilo]

The premium for Beltex lambs which I reckon was £20 before Xmas is now between £35 and £40 based on what I sold this week.

Is that an increase in those types, or easing back of ‘normal’ lambs not affecting them so much?
That’s certainly a healthy premium and makes it worth some extra effort. It’s not something we ever see in marts further South though, or certainly not to that degree.

Out of interest, what proportion of lambs actually attain those premiums? I’m guessing your average lamb price isn’t £30 above the mean?

 

[neilo]

I tried a Beltex and a texel, weren't better than the pures, NZ Suffolks were but worry about having to pull a few.

Are you saying that NZ Suffolk crosses were better grading lambs than Texel and Beltex X out of the same ewes?

 

[Kingcustard]

Yes in my case, the texels didn't grow as well so needed creep and the Beltex were happy to die in the weather.

At the end of the day the abattoir are the experts and if they didn't like my lambs they wouldn't take them or would penalise me for them. Hitting the maximum money is what counts, grades are vanity with my abattoir.

We can't all be spending time recording and improving, some of us just get on and farm

 

[gatepost]

That's interesting, my neighbour who lambs 1000 mules, half to NZ Suff and the other half to my tups, consistently sells more Tex lambs first at better grades than the Suffs, which take more finishing, they have a good trade in Suffolk x ewe lambs, and before anyone jumps in, they are NZ suffolks and its a top flight operation on PP.