• Welcome to The Farming Forum!

    As part of this update, we have made a change to the login and registration process. If you are experiences any problems, please email [email protected] with the details so we can resolve any issues.

Woodland thinning who pays who?

cjt

Member
We have around 50 acres of woodland which is a mixture of hard and softwood.
A tree surgeon has approached and offered to thin the wood in exchange for the firewood from it. He has suggested it would be a straight swap without any money changing hands. I was wondering if this is an acceptable deal or if the owner should be profiting out of this. Another option could be for us to ask for a certain amount of firewood. If anyone has any experience of deal like this I would be grateful of some advise.
Thanks
 
Location
Suffolk
My immediate reaction is one of horror. You need to put some kind of order in place else whose to say which trees he's felling, who clears up the mess created? How long will the timber produced be stored on site. Working the actual value based on £50+ per ton roadside.... All those things.....Along with the long term view for the benefit of the woodland & its future produce, not simply taking the biggest sticks for burning.
SS
 

woodworm

Member
Location
Thetford Norfolk
We have around 50 acres of woodland which is a mixture of hard and softwood.
A tree surgeon has approached and offered to thin the wood in exchange for the firewood from it. He has suggested it would be a straight swap without any money changing hands. I was wondering if this is an acceptable deal or if the owner should be profiting out of this. Another option could be for us to ask for a certain amount of firewood. If anyone has any experience of deal like this I would be grateful of some advise.
Thanks

Nooooooo, dont do it. Where are you based?
 

PSQ

Member
Arable Farmer
I’m guessing the softwood was planted to shelter the hardwood, and therefore only the softwood will need thinning?

Or is the tree surgeon after taking out some nice hardwood too, like every ash tree he can find....
 
We have around 50 acres of woodland which is a mixture of hard and softwood.
A tree surgeon has approached and offered to thin the wood in exchange for the firewood from it. He has suggested it would be a straight swap without any money changing hands. I was wondering if this is an acceptable deal or if the owner should be profiting out of this. Another option could be for us to ask for a certain amount of firewood. If anyone has any experience of deal like this I would be grateful of some advise.
Thanks

We have done this recently. Depends on the growth stage of the woodland. Earlier on in a woodland's life you need to cut a lot of trees down for a given volume of timber which is less efficient and more costly. At these stages (say after 20 years) the thinning in exchange for thinned timber seems the normal deal. In successive thinnings you would then expect to see a financial return.
 

A1an

Member
We have done this recently. Depends on the growth stage of the woodland. Earlier on in a woodland's life you need to cut a lot of trees down for a given volume of timber which is less efficient and more costly. At these stages (say after 20 years) the thinning in exchange for thinned timber seems the normal deal. In successive thinnings you would then expect to see a financial return.
Yep.

Very little value in first thinnings, you just need to make sure he is thinning for the benefit of the woodland and not for the benefit of his wood pile.
 
If you are in England on relatively flat to slightly sloping ground this is absolute tosh. On the other hand if you are in Scotland on 10ft deep peat its a fair comment.

We had a chap out who is a forester to act independently to advise us. The advice was as per what I said above. Checked with a friend who works in estate management for Savills and he said that was fair given what he's seen. Maybe I did miss something though.
 

cjt

Member
Thanks for your replies. We are near Cardiff. The tree surgeon is keen to show us what he has done to his woodland which is just up the road. He seems very keen on the conservation side of things and no doubt on the profit as well. I do know him already so I’m prepared to trust him slightly. The wood is on a hill which is strangely wet and boggy considering the gradient.
 

renewablejohn

Member
Location
lancs
Sorry but if its first thinning and you want a proper job doing taking out the nursery trees then I would expect to be paid 250 a day plus the disposal of any timber removed.
Sounds to me a cowboy wanting to rip the good stuff out the wood and leave the rubbish. Easily sorted by dot painting all trees to remain and taking pictures.
 
Last edited:

woodworm

Member
Location
Thetford Norfolk
We had a chap out who is a forester to act independently to advise us. The advice was as per what I said above. Checked with a friend who works in estate management for Savills and he said that was fair given what he's seen. Maybe I did miss something though.

If you are in East Anglia your thinnings are worth SOMETHING, it may not be much but they are worth something, and companies like Suffolk Woodchips would be able to pay you for the whole tree, not just the stem, leaving you with a clear forest floor where you then have easy access for shooting or underplanting with other species which can then be harvested for energy at a later date
 

renewablejohn

Member
Location
lancs
We have around 50 acres of woodland which is a mixture of hard and softwood.
A tree surgeon has approached and offered to thin the wood in exchange for the firewood from it. He has suggested it would be a straight swap without any money changing hands. I was wondering if this is an acceptable deal or if the owner should be profiting out of this. Another option could be for us to ask for a certain amount of firewood. If anyone has any experience of deal like this I would be grateful of some advise.
Thanks

How old is the woodland and when was it last thinned.
 

cjt

Member
Not sure of exact age of woodland but I seem to think it is around 100 years. No thinning in the last 20 years. I doubt it has ever been thinned from my very limited knowledge. Just about concluded that as long has he does a good job no money needs to change hands.
 

woodworm

Member
Location
Thetford Norfolk
Not sure of exact age of woodland but I seem to think it is around 100 years. No thinning in the last 20 years. I doubt it has ever been thinned from my very limited knowledge. Just about concluded that as long has he does a good job no money needs to change hands.

That would be madness
 

renewablejohn

Member
Location
lancs
Not sure of exact age of woodland but I seem to think it is around 100 years. No thinning in the last 20 years. I doubt it has ever been thinned from my very limited knowledge. Just about concluded that as long has he does a good job no money needs to change hands.

In that case you would be mad not to clear fell and replace a compartment at a time. Any thinning of that age of woodland would kill the remaining woodland anyway. Would sell the timber as standing woodland and you would have plenty of buyers.
 

renewablejohn

Member
Location
lancs
Thanks for your replies. We are near Cardiff. The tree surgeon is keen to show us what he has done to his woodland which is just up the road. He seems very keen on the conservation side of things and no doubt on the profit as well. I do know him already so I’m prepared to trust him slightly. The wood is on a hill which is strangely wet and boggy considering the gradient.

Woodworm I think you missed this.
 

How is your SFI 24 application progressing?

  • havn't been invited to apply

    Votes: 29 34.9%
  • have been invited to apply

    Votes: 17 20.5%
  • applied but not yet accepted

    Votes: 29 34.9%
  • agreement up and running

    Votes: 8 9.6%

Webinar: Expanded Sustainable Farming Incentive offer 2024 -26th Sept

  • 2,510
  • 50
On Thursday 26th September, we’re holding a webinar for farmers to go through the guidance, actions and detail for the expanded Sustainable Farming Incentive (SFI) offer. This was planned for end of May, but had to be delayed due to the general election. We apologise about that.

Farming and Countryside Programme Director, Janet Hughes will be joined by policy leads working on SFI, and colleagues from the Rural Payment Agency and Catchment Sensitive Farming.

This webinar will be...
Back
Top