worming lambs question

[devonbrion1998]

Just a thought, If the fecs go up on my lambs, whats the best wormer to give them? I understand it should be white but which one should I go for? and going forward should they need another dose later in the year which should I use then? Thanks in advance

 

[neilo]

One that works on your farm. It’s I possible for anyone to say unless you know what your resistance levels are to each group.

Their is widespread resistance to white drenches, but some (lucky buggers) are still able to use them effectively. For others (the vast majority), whites are only much good as a first drench against nemo.

The same may, or may not, be the case for yellow or clear drenches, on any particular farm. If you have triple resistance (an increasing problem), none of those may be effective, leaving you with the option of only expensive ‘orange’ or (assuming you can get them) ‘purple’ drenches.

 

[devonbrion1998]

ah.. only ever used Cydectin and Oramec, normally give the odd lamb a drench if it's mucky
and when I think its more of a problem I do feces and if high drench the bunch then move them, they always have dried up and picked up, am I doing things right? never thought we had any resistance, but to be honest, never done post worming fecs as I have only just got the hang of doing it,

 

[andybk]

One that works on your farm. It’s I possible for anyone to say unless you know what your resistance levels are to each group.

Their is widespread resistance to white drenches, but some (lucky buggers) are still able to use them effectively. For others (the vast majority), whites are only much good as a first drench against nemo.

The same may, or may not, be the case for yellow or clear drenches, on any particular farm. If you have triple resistance (an increasing problem), none of those may be effective, leaving you with the option of only expensive ‘orange’ or (assuming you can get them) ‘purple’ drenches.

or you can combi drench like the boys down under , full dose of both (i know its not done here ) resistance is falling there so i have been told ,

 

[neilo]

or you can combi drench like the boys down under , full dose of both (i know its not done here ) resistance is falling there so i have been told ,

There aren’t any ‘combi-drenches’ licensed here, other than (the hard to get hold of) purple drench. You can legally sequentially drench with two (or more I suppose) active ingredients though, but you still need to know which product groups are effective on your farm.

 

[livestock 1]

On the subject is Levafas Diamond any good for nematadirus?

 

[Dkb]

or you can combi drench like the boys down under , full dose of both (i know its not done here ) resistance is falling there so i have been told ,

Why would resistance be dropping if their using Combi drenches? I thought that’d worsen the problem

 

[andybk]

Why would resistance be dropping if their using Combi drenches? I thought that’d worsen the problem

they should be looking into this now for licencing as it works better before you get into real resistance issues . rather than relying on the new groups of narrow spectrum wormers,
https://www.totallyvets.co.nz/portfolio,portfolio,,572,Drenching+lambs.html

 

[gatepost]

If you have been using nothing but an ivermectin, then you need to change group for a year, I went back to ''a white drench'' for 1st drench, generally very effective against spring hatched worms ie nemo, often ivermec for 2nd worming and maybe try Zolvix (at great expense) for weaning, on the basis that it sets them up having cleared out all resistant little beggars, generally using levamisole's through the autumn.

 

[neilo]

On the subject is Levafas Diamond any good for nematadirus?

All wormer groups are effective against nematodiris. White drenches are generally gentler on young lambs’ tums though supposedly.

Main reason for recommending white drenches I think, is that it reduces the number of times other (still effective?) groups are used, reducing resistance pressure on them.

 

[Mr always wrong]

ah.. only ever used Cydectin and Oramec, normally give the odd lamb a drench if it's mucky
and when I think its more of a problem I do feces and if high drench the bunch then move them,

Don't move them post drench, any worms left after dosing will be shed onto pasture. If this is done onto clean pasture all you are left with is resistant worms thus speeding up wormed resistance. If returned to original pasture first any remaining worms will be shed with original worms thus diluting resistant worms.
Hope this makes sense

 

[Bury the Trash]

https://www.xlvets.co.uk/sites/default/files/uploads/files/Wormer imposed VF LOW.pdf

 

[devonbrion1998]

Don't move them post drench, any worms left after dosing will be shed onto pasture. If this is done onto clean pasture all you are left with is resistant worms thus speeding up wormed resistance. If returned to original pasture first any remaining worms will be shed with original worms thus diluting resistant worms.
Hope this makes sense

Yes it does make sense, when I say dose and move I normally dose and move a week later, not sure if that's any good, but the idea is all worms/eggs are shed at home, however, they will return home later in the year,and they live in the pasture for years...So the more I listen to my self nothing really makes sense, perhaps we're all over thinking it.

 

[msheep66]

To help reduce worm resistance would there be any benefit in just worming the lambs which are scouring?

 

[Mr always wrong]

Yes it does make sense, when I say dose and move I normally dose and move a week later, not sure if that's any good, but the idea is all worms/eggs are shed at home, however, they will return home later in the year,and they live in the pasture for years...So the more I listen to my self nothing really makes sense, perhaps we're all over thinking it.

Either we are both wrong or yes your doing the right thing though a week might be a long,

 

[gatepost]

To help reduce worm resistance would there be any benefit in just worming the lambs which are scouring?

yes in theory, some suggest always trying to leave 10% un wormed

 

[neilo]

To help reduce worm resistance would there be any benefit in just worming the lambs which are scouring?

Not really, scours aren’t just caused by worms and not all lambs will scour for a given worm burden.
The ‘experts’ advise leaving 10% of the fittest unwormed these days though. How many farmers do it, I don’t know. I do sometimes, but not always, making a decision based on what the lambs look like.

 

[Man_in_black]

am I doing things right?

drench the bunch then move them

That depends how soon after you move them... You don't want to drench the lot then move immediately to clean grazing as the ones that survive drench are then dropped onto fresh grass to start cycle. You need to dilute any resistant (surviving) worms with non resistant (back on dirty fire 24 hours or don't drench 10% of the group).

 

[gatepost]

Not really, scours aren’t just caused by worms and not all lambs will scour for a given worm burden.
The ‘experts’ advise leaving 10% of the fittest unwormed these days though. How many farmers do it, I don’t know. I do sometimes, but not always, making a decision based on what the lambs look like.

I went on a bit of a course and the vet ,who had their own flock, advised leaving some fit ewes but in general terms it was a health matter and if your lambs needed dosing then they all did, as it was more important to keep your crop/income growing.

 

[msheep66]

I might try worming the dirty lambs in a small lot just as an experiment.