Worsening blackgrass/ryegrass problem.

Previous cropping varies a bit but would be something like;
2017 WW
2018 OSR
2019 WW
2020 Spring Oat/Fallow
2021 WW
4 autumn crops 1 spring
50% spring crops
or better still Double spring crop the ultimate late drilling is mid April planting at the earliest the heavier the land the later you can get a crop worth growing but need lower disturbance than a Claydon
 

tr250

Member
Location
Northants
I'd buy a weaving gd.
I've used it for 3 crops now, after about 7 with the old KV tineseeder.
I had a couple of right royal feck ups with BG using the KV, but on the whole I was treading water or slightly gaining ground against it.
Since using the gd I'm definitely gaining ground, to the point that I'd almost say I'm breaking the back of the war.
If you want to win the war stop moving soil, you just keep bringing seed up, and have a zero tolerance on the stuff.
Chuck the kitchen sink at it for a few years to get on top.
I've just finished doing the T2 , and rogue as I go with little glyphosate sprayers. 50 acres a day isn't too bad on the whole, it's made much easier with auto steer though, it allows you to concentrate on looking for BG and anything else out of place.


Not what you wanted to hear no doubt.
This👆
ive had a weaving gd for 6 years now and feel I’m winning the war. I have struggled with establishing no-till crops these last2 wet autumns. My neighbors have been laughing at me all winter but now my crops albeit not great are pretty clean. Even my agronomist rang me the other day and said he thought it would out yield my neighbors plough combi wheat next door that’s looked great all winter but it now a carpet of bg
 

robs1

Member
This👆
ive had a weaving gd for 6 years now and feel I’m winning the war. I have struggled with establishing no-till crops these last2 wet autumns. My neighbors have been laughing at me all winter but now my crops albeit not great are pretty clean. Even my agronomist rang me the other day and said he thought it would out yield my neighbors plough combi wheat next door that’s looked great all winter but it now a carpet of bg
Everyday fields round here look worse, nothing drilled till early oct and in some fields they look brown from all the heads of bg, these are good farmers who do a good job, goodness knows what they will plant next year.
 

holmes65

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
S Yorkshire
Got the worst ryegrass in wheat here for some years. I feel it is mainly our own fault as we drilled end of September, the pre em was delayed due to wet weather, and the early post emergence top up herbicide didn't happen because it was too wet. But we have a reasonable crop of wheat as opposed to a poor crop of spring barley, so overall still glad we drilled when we did.
Here's hoping for a "normal" autumn this year.
 

thorpe

Member
Got the worst ryegrass in wheat here for some years. I feel it is mainly our own fault as we drilled end of September, the pre em was delayed due to wet weather, and the early post emergence top up herbicide didn't happen because it was too wet. But we have a reasonable crop of wheat as opposed to a poor crop of spring barley, so overall still glad we drilled when we did.
Here's hoping for a "normal" autumn this year.
we drilled mid to late oct i thought we were on to of the ryegrass but were not!
 

tr250

Member
Location
Northants
Everyday fields round here look worse, nothing drilled till early oct and in some fields they look brown from all the heads of bg, these are good farmers who do a good job, goodness knows what they will plant next year.
Have they done anything to overcome it or just expect chemicals to kill it? I always say bg is a sign of a good farmer ie gets drilled up on time gets a crop in the ground every year has no fallow etc
 

alomy75

Member
Have they done anything to overcome it or just expect chemicals to kill it? I always say bg is a sign of a good farmer ie gets drilled up on time gets a crop in the ground every year has no fallow etc
Quote of the day; “Bg is a sign of a good farmer” 😂 surely a good farmer starts with blackgrass and ends with none?!
 

Badshot

Member
Location
Kent
I've done 3 breaks in a row to get on top of the stuff in some fields, following the balls ups with the kvernland drill I mentioned before.
You have got to actually farm, and do things very differently if you want to get on top of it.
Doing wheat/break still will not produce the required results.
Those that can grass down are in a better/easier position.
Just as direct drilling requires a complete change of mindset, so does beating BG.


I still marvel at the fact plants won't grow in unmoved soil, I believed this for many years, it was how I learned to farm.
If this is true, how come my headlands are taller and stronger than the middle of the fields?
Busy topping the BG and wild oats off currently round the outsides, beans are halfway up the tractor cab,. A good 12 to 18inches higher than the middle of the field.
 

tr250

Member
Location
Northants
Quote of the day; “Bg is a sign of a good farmer” 😂 surely a good farmer starts with blackgrass and ends with none?!
Bit of a daft comment I get that but you miss my point they are farmers that have been yielding 4t acre wheat crops every other year all through the 90s-2000s relying on Chem for control unfortunately that style of farming is causing the problem
 

robs1

Member
Have they done anything to overcome it or just expect chemicals to kill it? I always say bg is a sign of a good farmer ie gets drilled up on time gets a crop in the ground every year has no fallow etc
Iirc the fields are all first wheats, so using rotations, one piece only growing corn for maybe 7 years and was grass last time but was ploughed so brought up the bg to the surface, aill still yield well as it looked a picture before the bg appeared, the problem will be what to follow it with.
Imvho the less the soil is disturbed the better, keep the weed seeds on the surface where the chems can get at them, imvho min till is a major cause of the problem.
 

GeorgeK

Member
Location
Leicestershire
Iirc the fields are all first wheats, so using rotations, one piece only growing corn for maybe 7 years and was grass last time but was ploughed so brought up the bg to the surface, aill still yield well as it looked a picture before the bg appeared, the problem will be what to follow it with.
Imvho the less the soil is disturbed the better, keep the weed seeds on the surface where the chems can get at them, imvho min till is a major cause of the problem.
And bad ploughing
 

DrWazzock

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lincolnshire
If it’s bad this year then plough it down and leave it down for a few years.
If that won’t help because there is seed mixed through the profile by mintilling with deeper working then grass it down for a few years.
Later drilled zero till spring barley can help but the establishment of the barley on heavy land by that method can be hit and miss.
If you are serious about tackling BG and you have bad areas of it I’d be inclined to spray off now before you get another massive return of seed. Painful but worked here.
 

Two Tone

Member
Mixed Farmer
IMO, the answer is that if you are going to move soil, do it properly with a well set plough. Don’t mix it by cultivating it such as Min-till.
OR move the soil as little soil as possible by Zero-till drilling with a disc type drill, such as the weaving GD.
Tine drills will move too much soil and worsen the problem.

I fecked this farm up Blackgrass wise by Min-till, got it back under control with the plough and have gone to the Weaving GD as of last Autumn. I have never seen this farm so BG free as it is this year.
Plenty round us are plastered with it this year though. All are Min-tillers or bad plough men.

The GD allows you to drill 2 weeks earlier in the Autumn into good conditions. The only worry is that from the road, you are looking at last year’s stubble until the Spring, before the new crop gets above it. Then it just takes off!
 

robs1

Member
IMO, the answer is that if you are going to move soil, do it properly with a well set plough. Don’t mix it by cultivating it such as Min-till.
OR move the soil as little soil as possible by Zero-till drilling with a disc type drill, such as the weaving GD.
Tine drills will move too much soil and worsen the problem.

I fecked this farm up Blackgrass wise by Min-till, got it back under control with the plough and have gone to the Weaving GD as of last Autumn. I have never seen this farm so BG free as it is this year.
Plenty round us are plastered with it this year though. All are Min-tillers or bad plough men.

The GD allows you to drill 2 weeks earlier in the Autumn into good conditions. The only worry is that from the road, you are looking at last year’s stubble until the Spring, before the new crop gets above it. Then it just takes off!
Been dd since 2012 and even now I compare my crops to others all through winter till May and think they are poor then they seem to take the nuclear option and grow like bonkers, perhaps I should give up selling hay to horsey folk all winter and go skiing instead and save myself all the mental torment 😁
 

Jolly

Member
Location
West Midlands
Having being the champion triple R resistance rye grass grower 4/5 years ago in my area I do feel we have turned a corner now. Tried cover crops with some success but a pain in the spring when trying to plant .Spring cropping has worked here reducing seed return.We do grow some winter crops using pre em and early post em products but after that nothing else works .Have also applied Avadex from the drill which has helped.Spring planting mainly done with a Mzuri to conserve moisture also used the Vad in autumn prepared land which has worked well .Being constantly told that I need to grow WW for best margin spend ££££££ on it doesn’t work here just leaves you with a big bill .Low disturbance subsoiler , carrier and round up works here might go DD when I’m confident enough !
 

ajd132

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Suffolk
Any kind of soil movement is a big no no. We tried really shallow and it was a waste of time. It made the problem so much worse. If you have done anything to the surface at all you have basically woken up all those seeds that are there, and put many into a lovely seed bed rather than just lying on the surface. So you then have to wait for them to grow, which means waiting for rain, and then it doesn’t stop and you have an inch of slop laying on the top so you end up with a crap crop that can’t compete!
We have quite a mixed bag but we are 100 times better than 3/4 years ago. Going back into osr has meant we have taken abit of a step back.
Probably about 4ha we will actually loose yield on. Annoying smatterings otherwise.
 

Warnesworth

Member
BASE UK Member
Location
Chipping Norton
The reason BG is bad is because everyone got panicky and started drilling earlier last year.
They all thought they'd cracked it and got drilled up before it rained.
It's very evident now that was not a good thing round here.
I think its also down to a lot not getting pre-em. A lot went drilling but the drill got to far ahead of the sprayer.
 

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