- Location
- Chipping Norton
Too much water, for starters.
Glyphosate wetter
- Thread starter DaveGrohl
- Start date
I couldn't get hold of any last time I tried, for speed of action it takes some beating.
Also use Firebrand which is cheaper and improves speed of kill but not as fast as Li700.
Whereas validate is just an oil wetter ( ie surface tension breaker) without the water conditioner
- Location
- Kenilworth
I’ve had some amazing results using Xchange and Li700.
But as you say, can’t seem to get hold of Li700.
warksfarmer
Member
Since we went back to 200l for all applications we are doing a far better job. 200l at 9km/hour red flat fans
Validate had Lecithin like Li700 this is the penetrant that gives it the rapid uptake.Whereas validate is just an oil wetter ( ie surface tension breaker) without the water conditioner
Whereas validate is just an oil wetter ( ie surface tension breaker) without the water conditioner
Validate and Li700 acidity the water which sorts the problem of cation hydrolysis of the glyphosate by another method.
ollie989898
Member
As I understood it, Li700 (not so sure about validate so would have to check), did the water conditioning (contained proprionic acid or certainly smelled likeit did), was a sticker/penetrant AND drift retardant all in one. I always thought it had to go into the tank first.
Whereas validate is just an oil wetter ( ie surface tension breaker) without the water conditioner
Validate is an acidifier, non ionic wetter, methylated oil and drift retardant. Different levels of ingredients to Li700.
Sorry for being geeky but I was lucky enough to have a training day hosted by @drummabruharhar at DeSangosse a while ago with a few other TFF members. I don't get any commission from them but it helped me understand how to get a spray where it needs to be to work best. Branded products usually contain all the adjuvants needed to help so generics need bit of help sometimes.
ollie989898
Member
In the past, before they were all reformulated because tallow amine was banned, I would have said the posh brands of roundup were the bees knees. I remember someone spraying off some grassland and not 20 minutes after the sprayer left the field it absolutely hammered with rain for several hours. Client rang me to ask for more product to repeat the application, I said all we can do is wait and see. Within 2 weeks the lot was clearly dying, not just the grass but the docks and dandelions as well. I was impressed, I think it was a Barclay product like Rattler or similar, not just ac cheapo 360.
Fast forward a bit and I had a client who direct drilled some beans in. The field was clean apart from a little bit of charlock that ran through the middle. Naturally he used a pre-em herbicide but because the charlock was there he asked if he should put some glyphosate in also. Good idea I said and left it at that, didn't think any more of it. Client applied the product and sure enough that charlock wasn't even fazed one bit. I forgot to ask if he had any adjuvant to put with it. That weed stayed in crop all season. The glyphosate clearly didn't get into the target one jot. And that was the post reformulation sort.
Now I wouldn't dare use any glyphosate product without adjuvant if it was me. If the stuff can't topple a bit of (small) charlock over, a perfectly flat and meaty target, heaven knows what sort of efficacy you can get from normal practice on farms where they use low water wolumes, high speeds or whatever else people get up to.
Fast forward a bit and I had a client who direct drilled some beans in. The field was clean apart from a little bit of charlock that ran through the middle. Naturally he used a pre-em herbicide but because the charlock was there he asked if he should put some glyphosate in also. Good idea I said and left it at that, didn't think any more of it. Client applied the product and sure enough that charlock wasn't even fazed one bit. I forgot to ask if he had any adjuvant to put with it. That weed stayed in crop all season. The glyphosate clearly didn't get into the target one jot. And that was the post reformulation sort.
Now I wouldn't dare use any glyphosate product without adjuvant if it was me. If the stuff can't topple a bit of (small) charlock over, a perfectly flat and meaty target, heaven knows what sort of efficacy you can get from normal practice on farms where they use low water wolumes, high speeds or whatever else people get up to.
no fine.
it works well with generic despite what ive posted before, im just not sure that its any better than the companion gold ive used before that ...theyre all much of a much ness ir.
good timing conditions and patience are the other necessary ingredients....goes without saying
ollie989898
Member
Shame the guy from De Sangosse isn't here any longer to give the technical rundown.
I thought The farm marketplace sold Validate? Might have imagined it though.
I thought The farm marketplace sold Validate? Might have imagined it though.
- Location
- Chipping Norton
I thought the whole point of contacts is low water rates to ensure AI concentration per droplet. You then have to get the droplet to adhere...
SilliamWhale
Member
So what is everyone advising to use then? This crops all the time and I never seem to hear of a go to product.
It depends on what you want to help. Hard water locks up glyphosate amongst others. Soft water is better. Rain water is best. Adjuvants vary depending on what you want to do.
SilliamWhale
Member
Ok what would you use for soft water
Still haven't found a LI700 supplier. Has it disappeared from the market? I've e-mailed DeSangosse but no reply as yet. It's not long ago that LI700 was the go-to recommendation on here, why have people migrated to Validate particularly, apart from being told "it's similar" by a rep?
FYI we sprayed a stubble on Sun with 5 l/ha of generic only and on Wed it was looking decidedly pale. We've never used water conditioners or such like and we have hard water from a borehole.
EDIT:
Just had e-mail back from DeSangosse. LI700 not available any more in UK so that's that.
FYI we sprayed a stubble on Sun with 5 l/ha of generic only and on Wed it was looking decidedly pale. We've never used water conditioners or such like and we have hard water from a borehole.
EDIT:
Just had e-mail back from DeSangosse. LI700 not available any more in UK so that's that.
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