Should the NFU hold a OMOV referendum on Red Tractor?

Sid · Feb 14, 2021

steveR said:
See my response to an earlier post on this.

However in no way am I criticising you or your County colleagues, but maybe you should be getting out there via email and similiar means? You would be doing more than HQ.....

The NFU Group and Branch offices have extensive email lists that are available to you.

They are not available to anyone , those days are long gone, the staff can send an email on your behalf.

snarling bee · Feb 14, 2021

homefarm said:
Snarling Bee this is not meant to be a personal criticism and I admire anyone willing to give up their time for the benefit of others.

Meetings? Why is everything done at a NFU meeting? There are a hundred and one other ways they could have canvased members even before the internet.

I am a meeting person I see the same 20/40 people at every meeting I go to locally.
I have perhaps 100 local farmers I have never seen at a meeting.
Why does your opinion not count unless you attend a meeting?

I have been to NFU meetings as a none member, some very good speakers too, but nearly always the only verbal contribution in the room came from me and I was alone in questioning the wisdom of the NFU stance.

If good comments means nobody in the meeting stood up and disagreed then that would be my experience too.

However after the meeting in a one to one situation I too would get good comments on my views but no one ever backed me up in public.

The consultation an other meeting person tactic.

Why do we need such a longwinded process?

Post a copy of the mission creep with a simple yes/no reply slip to every RT member.

Seems to work for Ltd companies with shareholders.

Thanks for your comments.
I will not reply as it will only attract more criticism, it seems to be me vs everyone else at the moment and I've still got work to do. I've had enough.
The irony is I support the opposition of the RT mission creep. But but the abuse I've had today makes me wonder why I bother.

spin cycle · Feb 14, 2021

snarling bee said:
I might just do that. How many replies do you think I will get. 1% 5?
How many have replied to the the consultation?

Who on this thread and the other threads on RT have done the consultation and /or consulted their elected representatives on the NFU or RT. It would be nice to know.
You've all got time to vent your displeasure on here.

trouble is rt won't publish large parts of the consultation so even if you got 1% it would still be more value than rt's

i've voiced my displeasure to nfu but they'll ignore it

until rt and nfu modernise to become more transparent/accountable... 'on here' is the most accurate guide of feeling

turbo · Feb 14, 2021

snarling bee said:
Thanks for your comments.
I will not reply as it will only attract more criticism, it seems to be me vs everyone else at the moment and I've still got work to do. I've had enough.
The irony is I support the opposition of the RT mission creep. But but the abuse I've had today makes me wonder why I bother.

Keep up the good work and don’t let them grind you down,people like Clive are good at sniping from the sidelines but won’t go for the jobs because they have a belief that it’s a closed shop,from my personal point of view from being branch chairman it’s anything but a closed shop but you only get out what you put in

Steevo · Feb 14, 2021

theboytheboy said:
This might be worth suggesting to your superiors....

It seems a sensible idea to guage quickly how member's feel towards certain issues

Superiors

tullah · Feb 14, 2021

Secret ballots are the way to truly gauge opinion. Those that avoid them have an agenda of their own they don't want overturned.

Grass And Grain · Feb 14, 2021

snarling bee said:
Criticised if we have informative and interesting meetings, criticised if we don't. FFS, I can't win.
Perhaps we were discussing what assurance schemes they have over the water? Obviously you would not be interested.
We had over 40 members on the call, and some good comments afterwards.
Whatever I say, do or organise will be wrong for someone, especially in this hostile environment.
So have you done the consultation? I have only noticed one other on this forum admitting to having done so.
Anyway where is Crapweathershire?

Chin up. I guess you're taken your position (and the time involved) for very credible and selfless reasons.

Unfortunately, you're the one getting it in the neck on here because grass roots farmers feel they're not been represented. Seemingly NFU RT policy from the top is meaning you're getting grief, because the top brass policy is, I think, contrary to the majority of opinion. Minette etal won't dare come on here, so you're the man in the middle.

I've seen several people on here over past few weeks who say NFU aren't representing them, so they're resigning membership.

Don't think I've seen a single person say they're joining NFU because they like the NFU RT policy. That is a reasonable barometer. I'll rejoin if NFU change policy, dismantle RT and advise farmers to leave. My potential NFU subs are currently being wasted on RT membership. I really would rather be an NFU member than a RT member. I really, really would. But while NFU are refusing to represent what I feel is the majority of farmers, then I can't rejoin.

What do you honestly think to NFU possibly supporting our call on AIC to create a level plating field. Do you support the concept? Would you consider sending an email to AIC in capacity of your position? And ask NFU Cereals to do so?

NFU have been noticably absent in coming forward with any support, and it's not that members haven't highlighted the issue to them.

It's perfectly simple, AIC rules create more onerous market access requirements for UK grain vs imported. Seemingly NFU won't help.

If you email AIC for us tomorrow, I think you'll gain a lot of respect. Qe need NFU to back us, they keep saying they want a level playing field, well now is their big chance to help. Interested to hear your thoughts @snarling bee ?

Steevo · Feb 14, 2021

snarling bee said:
Look.
I think I hold the same views as many of the members locally. I certainly think I do on this issue.
Yes we have meetings, but do we have an interesting meeting with 2 USA farmers as we did recently or do we hold a meeting re Red Tractor? On line meetings are best short and sweet. When we had meetings in the back room of a pub you could have a speaker and an hour on business.
I have been on the phone this last week regarding RT and I will continue to do that, but I do farm as well. Today, a Sunday, I have a manure management plan to do for a RT inspection on the pigs tomorrow and the monthly article for the Farmer and Grower. Neither takes 5 minutes. I had a meeting on branch Monday evening I attended, and on one Friday evening regarding Rural Crime. I do have a family and a farm to run, like many.
If anybody else in Beds wants this job I will happily stand down, but in the meantime I will represent as best I can. BUT when the first I hear of members resigning over RT is either on this forum or with them having sent a letter to the group secretary you can understand why I am frustrated, especially as not one member has contacted me.
I wish I did have the time to ring every member to get their opinion, but I don't.
Anyway, things to do.

You are a credit to the NFU and to all farmers imo!!

It sounds like you have the right outlook on meetings, are in touch with members requirements of NFU and from your above post I would think your NFU branch must be up there with the best of them. There is a lot of group-think within the NFU, especially from the staff in my experience. Sadly they seem to suffer from towing the NFU line.

Steevo · Feb 14, 2021

I think many members are tired of not being listened to by NFU and have pretty much given up trying sadly. I think the more NFU engage with farmers and listen to them, the more farmers will engage with them back.

Taking my online poll comment previously led me to think.....

- It's important for NFU to know what their members think so they can represent them effectively
- It's also just as important for NFU to know what is important to the wider farming industry who are not members. This is partly because what is best for farming as a whole (not just members interests which may not represent a true across the board picture) is what is best for the NFU.....and most especially because those non-members might well become members in the future!

A poll of NFU members, and a poll of all UK farmers with a holding number would likely lead to totally different outcomes. Just because NFU members say one thing (said as an NFU member) it doesn't mean that that is actually what is best for the future of farming. Many successful businesses thrived as a result of someone from outside the business coming in with fresh eyes.

steveR · Feb 14, 2021

An Gof said:
I am quite surprised by this. Do you not hold County Management Meetings in Beds when these issues are discussed? You should be getting feedback from your whole County Team to help ensure that you are aware of members needs and concerns. Perhaps there are opportunities for you to make it known that you have a listening ear to best represent members views through the local/regional newsletters e-mails etc.

Nicely put, and sums up what I was going to suggest to my County Chair....

steveR · Feb 14, 2021

snarling bee said:
Look.
I think I hold the same views as many of the members locally. I certainly think I do on this issue.
Yes we have meetings, but do we have an interesting meeting with 2 USA farmers as we did recently or do we hold a meeting re Red Tractor? On line meetings are best short and sweet. When we had meetings in the back room of a pub you could have a speaker and an hour on business.
I have been on the phone this last week regarding RT and I will continue to do that, but I do farm as well. Today, a Sunday, I have a manure management plan to do for a RT inspection on the pigs tomorrow and the monthly article for the Farmer and Grower. Neither takes 5 minutes. I had a meeting on branch Monday evening I attended, and on one Friday evening regarding Rural Crime. I do have a family and a farm to run, like many.
If anybody else in Beds wants this job I will happily stand down, but in the meantime I will represent as best I can. BUT when the first I hear of members resigning over RT is either on this forum or with them having sent a letter to the group secretary you can understand why I am frustrated, especially as not one member has contacted me.
I wish I did have the time to ring every member to get their opinion, but I don't.
Anyway, things to do.

I would hope that Group Secs can and do pass on emails or letters to you... if not, then why not?

There are easier ways to communicate with a large number of members than phoning everyone

I can sympathise and empathise with your load having been in similiar roles in the past. But if you have a professional team behind you... use 'em!

steveR · Feb 14, 2021

snarling bee said:
I might just do that. How many replies do you think I will get. 1% 5?
How many have replied to the the consultation?

Who on this thread and the other threads on RT have done the consultation and /or consulted their elected representatives on the NFU or RT. It would be nice to know.
You've all got time to vent your displeasure on here.

The RT consulation is dreadful... It starts with the premise that RT is truly wonderful to all men, and goes from there!

I will see what the NFU's consultations brings to the table....

steveR · Feb 14, 2021

Sid said:
They are not available to anyone , those days are long gone, the staff can send an email on your behalf.

Which for the purpose of a County or Branch Chairman mailing the members, amounts to the same thing.

SilliamWhale · Feb 14, 2021

snarling bee said:
Then we can blame Clive when we don't like what is forced upon us.

Jokes aside, yes we should be able to vote people in and then they should have accountability as well.

SilliamWhale · Feb 14, 2021

snarling bee said:
Thanks for your comments.
I will not reply as it will only attract more criticism, it seems to be me vs everyone else at the moment and I've still got work to do. I've had enough.
The irony is I support the opposition of the RT mission creep. But but the abuse I've had today makes me wonder why I bother.

Most people do support the opposition of the mission creep. Fundamentally there isn't a huge amount between us farmers. There is however a big amount of difference between us and those in the high castle.

This is not directed at you, but I cannot understand why the chains of communication appear to be so lousy

jonnieboy · Feb 14, 2021

As a business we are not in the NFU and doubt we ever would be. @snarling bee fair play you have stuck your head up and engaged on here. You will never please everybody and will always get some flack because of the silence from above you in the union.
I have completed the Red Tractor survey as this is at the present moment my only way of registering my concerns with them.
We mainly supply a feed mill and take our cereals there and tip along side maize and other straights from the docks.
But we can’t tip without a passport and sticker, all we ask for is a level playing field.

kiwi pom · Feb 14, 2021

silverfox said:
I’m beginning to think you’re being paid as a consultant for red tractor

Not at all, in fact it sounds like it's going off the rails a bit but I do think if it goes processors and retailers will want something else and that something could be much stricter and more expensive.
You have good standards you should be proud of them, RT should be a good way of showing off those standards but it's not doing a great job of that.

The biggest thing the NFU and RT can do is push supermarkets to buy British first and only import if the same standards are met. For example if a supermarket sent a buyer to NZ with a large lamb order it could have an assurance requirement and it could audit random farms to make sure they comply or there's no deal (maybe they already do?). The same with Danish bacon and Irish Beef.

It would be harder to do with things like a boat load of soya or bread wheat but they should still be pushing for it.

manhill · Feb 14, 2021

Come RT officials, now heed the call
Don't stand in the doorway, don't block up the hall
Your hard working members are beyond your command
The old road is rapidly changing
If you can't understand then you better get out
For the times they are a'changing. (Bob Dylan for sprogs among us)

Bury the Trash · Feb 14, 2021

Not quite sure why we' re picked on, (mnaybe the perpetrators went to single sex bording schools from an early age or some other psychological issue) after all other parts of the World burn sugar cane , cut down forest for soya and palm oil , cut tails off older lambs spray with helicopters etc,etc,etc the list goes on.

I'm not saying that I want to do those things at all but if they were stopped abroad , yes like a level p,along field then their costs would be as or nearer ours instead of cheating at something else's expense.

Hfd Cattle · Feb 14, 2021

snarling bee said:
Thanks for your comments.
I will not reply as it will only attract more criticism, it seems to be me vs everyone else at the moment and I've still got work to do. I've had enough.
The irony is I support the opposition of the RT mission creep. But but the abuse I've had today makes me wonder why I bother.

I think the big problem here is you appear to be one who is listening but most of us have experience of not being listened to .
Sorry if I offended you but it was without intent. I tried hard while a member of NFU but soon found out I was wasting my time. I am genuinely glad if you feel that you are being able to make a difference and with that in mind I wish you were in my area . I think we would probably work well together .
I don't want position I just want fairness and common sense

Should the NFU hold a OMOV referendum on Red Tractor?

Should the NFU offer membership a OMOV referendum on their future involvement with Red Tractor?

Yes

No

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0 %

Up to 25%

25-50%

50-75%

75-100%

100% I’ve had enough of farming!

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