Invasion bets

was it a few months ago we strayed into their waters, how would the uk react if they kept conducting military exercises on our doorstep

They have been in UK, Swedish, American and just about everyone's waters. We do the same. Been going on for years. The Americans had a sosus network of sensors on the seabed for this exact reason, you could triangulate their position and chase them with aircraft. Been done for decades.
 
If the West had been more interested in what Putin wanted rather than what Greta Thurnberg or Mrs Boris Johnson wanted then this wouldn’t be happening we can deal with the child murdering Saudis but the Russians ‘gosh no they’re horrid’ . No all they want to do is just get on all sell their natural resources but like Australia really. It’s time we all woke up got back to work after the two year Covid holiday and try to reset.

Yeh, when the Saudis or Chinese are assassinating their former countrymen on your soil let us know.
 

Widgetone

Member
Trade
Location
Westish Suffolk
Interesting to know that over 50 percent of the "hard coal" Germany uses for steelmaking etc comes from russia.

And that gazprom owns 1/4 of German gas storage capacity.
Might possibly help explain the German airspace being closed to fly military supplies into Ukraine. Also the German admiral who resigned after saying there was no threat - he was only trying to heat his homestead!
 

Lowland1

Member
Mixed Farmer
Yeh, when the Saudis or Chinese are assassinating their former countrymen on your soil let us know.
Well they have been chopping up journalists in Turkey ( Saudis) and apparently the Chinese have been bribing MPs . So maybe they aren’t poisoning their enemies in Cathedral cities but they aren’t much better. I’d say you’d get a bit more religious and personal freedom in Russia than Saudi Arabia or China.
 

Muck Spreader

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Limousin
The presence of Russian troops within Moldova and Belarus is well documented, in effect forming most of a ring around the Ukraine when you include Crimea and the Russian border.

It is also likely that clandestine Russian troops/agents are currently collecting intelligence from within Ukraine.
There are thousands of Russian troops already fighting alongside pro Russian militias in the Donbas region of Ukraine.
 

Danllan

Member
Location
Sir Gar / Carms
Russia is looking after itself - after being shafted by the USA post glasnost and the Oligarchs - with that wealth being "Invested" in London etc.

Shame the same cannot said of the UK, USA, Germany and France - to some extent working against each other.

It does not wash that Russia is the great evil. I certainly don't support any UK lives being lost in a war created by politicians - again.

It's Russian Gas and Russian Military base. Did you expect 5 Billion Euros to vapourise the Crimean base ? More the fool you.
Are you telling us that you genuinely believe Russia to be acting in good faith regarding Ukraine, really?

There can be no doubt that a large majority of ethnic Russians in Eastern Ukraine will welcome Vlad over and, possibly, a very small number of Ukrainians too. But if you in any way try to put it across that the vast majority on Ukrainians are anything other than vehemently opposed to Russia interfering in their country, you are either entirely ignorant or dishonest.

I've never mentioned a base, no idea why you mention it. I have seen British lives lost due to politicians, right in front of me, I don't like it, and I knew others who died after my time. I would much rather we don't lose any, ever, but that isn't realistic. I will say that if Russia - meaning Putin, for now - is not stood up to and actively opposed, it will keep pushing, and pushing. (As I have written elsewhere before, dictators can not risk a conflict in which they will come of worst, it always means the end of them. Putin is no fool, and will not do anything if he thinks there is a real chance of being genuinely opposed.)

And that apart from the fact that we should help aspiring democracies whenever possible, both as a matter of general principle and of enlightened self interest.

Of course the UK, USA and a plethora of other Western Nations had no influence or interference at all on the rest of the world, the majority of those Nations now leave much of the rest of the world to get on with life, with the notable exception of the USA and to a lesser extent the Brits.
Careful now, a fellow could be forgiven for thinking you've fallen for Jacinda's hard line in re China and other dictatorships - hard line as in NZ will tow it, no matter how hard... (y) :(
 

stewart

Member
Horticulture
Location
Bay of Plenty NZ
Careful now, a fellow could be forgiven for thinking you've fallen for Jacinda's hard line in re China and other dictatorships - hard line as in NZ will tow it, no matter how hard... (y) :(
I have no issue with the line that NZ takes with China, John Key took a similar line and still has a close relationship with China. I do have an issue with Jacinda, the worst Prime Minister this country has ever had.
 

Danllan

Member
Location
Sir Gar / Carms
I have no issue with the line that NZ takes with China, John Key took a similar line and still has a close relationship with China. I do have an issue with Jacinda, the worst Prime Minister this country has ever had.
JK was around before China started on the so-called 'wolf warrior' policy and before it started trying to bully Oz. One could very probably be forgiven for writing that he certainly knows which side his financial bread is buttered... :unsure:

We agree with regard to JA. :(
 
Are you telling us that you genuinely believe Russia to be acting in good faith regarding Ukraine, really?

There can be no doubt that a large majority of ethnic Russians in Eastern Ukraine will welcome Vlad over and, possibly, a very small number of Ukrainians too. But if you in any way try to put it across that the vast majority on Ukrainians are anything other than vehemently opposed to Russia interfering in their country, you are either entirely ignorant or dishonest.

I've never mentioned a base, no idea why you mention it. I have seen British lives lost due to politicians, right in front of me, I don't like it, and I knew others who died after my time. I would much rather we don't lose any, ever, but that isn't realistic. I will say that if Russia - meaning Putin, for now - is not stood up to and actively opposed, it will keep pushing, and pushing. (As I have written elsewhere before, dictators can not risk a conflict in which they will come of worst, it always means the end of them. Putin is no fool, and will not do anything if he thinks there is a real chance of being genuinely opposed.)

And that apart from the fact that we should help aspiring democracies whenever possible, both as a matter of general principle and of enlightened self interest.


Careful now, a fellow could be forgiven for thinking you've fallen for Jacinda's hard line in re China and other dictatorships - hard line as in NZ will tow it, no matter how hard... (y) :(


Am I writing something only for you to come up with your own interpretation.

No.

Then you argue what you have said is incorrect.

Okay.

I'll repeat simply - Russia is acting in it's own interests. Trying to justify everything in terms of some Ukranians who have been bought by the EU ? I guess only some people in the EU care about that.

I don't care whether you mentioned a base or not. I did. It's extremely relevant. You'd not expect the USA to back down would you, are Russian's some weird alien species who don't care about their military bases ?

This is a political conflict created by Western Polticians.

No I'm not playing to the tune of Western Politicians interpretation of "Democracies". You only have to look at Afghanistan, Libya and Iraq to see the waste and destruction some "Things" call democracy.

In my world the people that created this mess should be in jail.
 

stewart

Member
Horticulture
Location
Bay of Plenty NZ
JK was around before China started on the so-called 'wolf warrior' policy and before it started trying to bully Oz. One could very probably be forgiven for writing that he certainly knows which side his financial bread is buttered... :unsure:

We agree with regard to JA. :(
JK is still around and still working closely with China. He certainly does know where his financial bread is buttered, being a past currency trader in London it goes with the territory.
 

BrianV

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Dartmoor
Putin had hoped that amassing troops would bluff/persuade Nato to stay out of Ukraine, the problem is the West have taken this bluff far too seriously & started to back up Ukraine with arms & before long troops, if the West isn't very careful it will put Putin into a situation where he cannot back down without losing face in his country so he will have little alternative than to start to carry out what was originally a bluff.
It is a complete re run of the gulf war where Bush & Blair thought they could bluff/force Saddam Hussein to back down, when he didn't they had no alternative but to attack or go home with their tail between their legs,I fear Putin is not the sort to put his tail between his legs!
 
Location
Devon
Putin had hoped that amassing troops would bluff/persuade Nato to stay out of Ukraine, the problem is the West have taken this bluff far too seriously & started to back up Ukraine with arms & before long troops, if the West isn't very careful it will put Putin into a situation where he cannot back down without losing face in his country so he will have little alternative than to start to carry out what was originally a bluff.
It is a complete re run of the gulf war where Bush & Blair thought they could bluff/force Saddam Hussein to back down, when he didn't they had no alternative but to attack or go home with their tail between their legs,I fear Putin is not the sort to put his tail between his legs!
The only two people who want a war with Russia is the weak President of the USA and the even weaker PM of the UK.

If Boris does not get a war asap he will be out of No 10, esp given tonight it turns out that he had one if not two party's to celebrate his birthday when at the time he had made such gatherings illegal for everyone else in Britain!
 
Approximately how many troops and armoured vehicles does Vlad have in the region?


I say let him come. Establish air superiority and then bomb the living fudge out of them. Smash him harm enough and the negative sentiment might even do Vlad a lot of political damage at home.

They tried their luck in Syria and Mattis had them hammered flat. Let them try again. You might think President Biden is a weak man, but you can be sure as sin that the Pentagon ain't.
 

oil barron

Member
Location
Aberdeenshire
Approximately how many troops and armoured vehicles does Vlad have in the region?


I say let him come. Establish air superiority and then bomb the living fudge out of them. Smash him harm enough and the negative sentiment might even do Vlad a lot of political damage at home.

They tried their luck in Syria and Mattis had them hammered flat. Let them try again.
So go to war with Russia is your suggestion.
 

BrianV

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Dartmoor
Approximately how many troops and armoured vehicles does Vlad have in the region?


I say let him come. Establish air superiority and then bomb the living fudge out of them. Smash him harm enough and the negative sentiment might even do Vlad a lot of political damage at home.

They tried their luck in Syria and Mattis had them hammered flat. Let them try again.
Never going to happen, Biden hasn't the heart & Europe is far too dependent on Russia for fuel, the West are playing a very dangerous game for the Ukrainians because if Putin is forced to carry out his threat the West will huff & puff but do absolutely nothing!
 

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