Invasion bets

[ollie989898]

Never going to happen, Biden hasn't the heart & Europe is far too dependent on Russia for fuel, the West are playing a very dangerous game for the Ukrainians because if Putin is forced to carry out his threat the West will huff & puff but do absolutely nothing!

Yeah, right. The USA and their NATO allies are crawling all over the region, you can bet SF teams are already on the ground. The sky is probably black with surveillance aircraft mapping the positions of all Russian ground forces.

Here: USA not even giving a hoot by having their assets on flightradar24!

 

[fudge]

If he invades a foreign power, then yes. It's not like the USA haven't smashed Russian forces before- they did it in Syria.

This is a lunatic suggestion…….. My only fear is that by some chance Boris Johnson reads your post and makes you Foreign Secretary.

 

[ollie989898]

You might think your safe behind your keyboard, but those ships off the Irish coast are not there hunting lucky charms.

Just as well Vlad didn’t take the same approach when we invaded Iraq or Lybia.

'Ships off the coast of Ireland'- who cares? Every day I've been alive the UK has been under the nose of Russian strategic missiles. What is he going to do, slap Dublin with cruise missiles?

 

[ollie989898]

This is a lunatic suggestion…….. My only fear is that by some chance Boris Johnson reads your post and makes you Foreign Secretary.

The Americans smashed a whole load of Russian forces in Syria. They tried to strong arm the USA who had some forces in the area, they promptly got smashed. There is recordings of the survivors on the phone explaining that they got smashed.

What is your plan then? Sit back and let Putin do what the heck he likes? What's to say Belarus, Lithuania or the like aren't next on the list?

 

[teslacoils]

If he invades a foreign power, then yes. It's not like the USA haven't smashed Russian forces before- they did it in Syria.

Even my most rootin' rootin' American relatives don't want to see US involvement in Russia.

I'll say this again- under the Minsk "agreement", the Donbas was going to be given autonomy. Russia is giving out Russian passports aplenty in the region. It's a rerun of Crimea.

There will be some western jaw-jaw but you wont see NATO, or any NATO countries firing a shot.

 

[fudge]

The Ukraine is not a member of NATO and I am not the POTUS. We must honour our NATO commitment s but extending them to the Ukraine cannot be done without the unanimous support of NATO members. Promising help to the Ukraine that won’t be delivered is totally wrong.

 

[ollie989898]

Even my most rootin' rootin' American relatives don't want to see US involvement in Russia.

I'll say this again- under the Minsk "agreement", the Donbas was going to be given autonomy. Russia is giving out Russian passports aplenty in the region. It's a rerun of Crimea.

There will be some western jaw-jaw but you wont see NATO, or any NATO countries firing a shot.

There won't need to be any overt NATO presence on the ground, just lots of military aircraft overhead. To be honest, with the sheer volume of anti-tank weapons the West has now funnelled into Ukraine the Russians will have a tough old time of it the second they select forward gear.

 

[ollie989898]

The Ukraine is not a member of NATO and I am not the POTUS. We must honour our NATO commitment s but extending them to the Ukraine cannot be done without the unanimous support of NATO members. Promising help to the Ukraine that won’t be delivered is totally wrong.

The Ukraine is not a member of NATO you say?



Yeah, and neither was Kuwait...

 

[fudge]

The Ukraine is not a member of NATO you say?



Yeah, and neither was Kuwait...

That turned out well didn’t it?

 

[BrianV]

GB Fuel type power generation production

GridWatch | Live statistic of UK National Electricity grid by type of generation | Solar PV power Generation | Coal Stations output in Gigawatts | Wind Output Gigawatts | Nuclear energy output |Biomass power generation Output

gridwatch.co.uk

Do you think Europe really want to endanger gas supplies with a fight with Russia!

 

[Danllan]

Putin had hoped that amassing troops would bluff/persuade Nato to stay out of Ukraine, the problem is the West have taken this bluff far too seriously & started to back up Ukraine with arms & before long troops, if the West isn't very careful it will put Putin into a situation where he cannot back down without losing face in his country so he will have little alternative than to start to carry out what was originally a bluff.
It is a complete re run of the gulf war where Bush & Blair thought they could bluff/force Saddam Hussein to back down, when he didn't they had no alternative but to attack or go home with their tail between their legs,I fear Putin is not the sort to put his tail between his legs!

Vlad would rather back off any day than actually be defeated - dictators can't lose a conflict and survive, and he knows it.

Approximately how many troops and armoured vehicles does Vlad have in the region?


I say let him come. Establish air superiority and then bomb the living fudge out of them. Smash him harm enough and the negative sentiment might even do Vlad a lot of political damage at home.

They tried their luck in Syria and Mattis had them hammered flat. Let them try again. You might think President Biden is a weak man, but you can be sure as sin that the Pentagon ain't.

Not any where near realistic yet; but it wouldn't be surprising to see the Ukrainian Air Force expanded and resupplied significantly.

So go to war with Russia is your suggestion.

See above.

The Ukraine is not a member of NATO and I am not the POTUS. We must honour our NATO commitment s but extending them to the Ukraine cannot be done without the unanimous support of NATO members. Promising help to the Ukraine that won’t be delivered is totally wrong.

Entirely right. There has to be unanimity for it to be a NATO operation.

But, what happens if Ukraine applies for and NATO unanimously grants immediate membership...?

...Do you think Europe really want to endanger gas supplies with a fight with Russia!

This is the key question; but if Vlad 'accidentally' does something to a European member of NATO, or - as I mention above - to a newly joined Ukraine, the European members of NATO will have an absolute obligation to do so. And that is when things come to a real head...

If Ukraine does join NATO and another member will not turn out if it is attacked, that is the end of NATO as we know it. And that is the probable reason why some European members of NATO will veto any application from Ukraine.

 

[stewart]

Approximately how many troops and armoured vehicles does Vlad have in the region?


I say let him come. Establish air superiority and then bomb the living fudge out of them. Smash him harm enough and the negative sentiment might even do Vlad a lot of political damage at home.

They tried their luck in Syria and Mattis had them hammered flat. Let them try again. You might think President Biden is a weak man, but you can be sure as sin that the Pentagon ain't.

The glaring problem with your scenario is the West are unlikely to gain air superiority against the Russians when dealing with them directly, they are on home territory. In the unlikely event of all out war, once the body bags start coming back to Washington there will be calls to pull the troops out, once they start coming back to Moscow there will be calls to send in more troops.

 

[oil barron]

The glaring problem with your scenario is the West are unlikely to gain air superiority against the Russians when dealing with them directly, they are on home territory. In the unlikely event of all out war, once the body bags start coming back to Washington there will be calls to pull the troops out, once they start coming back to Moscow there will be calls to send in more troops.

And there is no way Vlad would let the war stay in his home turf. If we engage it would be full on dirty war in the Uk and whoever else is involved

 

[ollie989898]

The glaring problem with your scenario is the West are unlikely to gain air superiority against the Russians when dealing with them directly, they are on home territory. In the unlikely event of all out war, once the body bags start coming back to Washington there will be calls to pull the troops out, once they start coming back to Moscow there will be calls to send in more troops.

Ok, how many fighter aircraft do the Russians have?

Aerial tankers?

AEW aircraft?

It's already starting:

NATO sends reinforcements and U.S. puts troops on alert as Ukraine tensions rise

NATO said on Monday it was putting forces on standby and reinforcing eastern Europe with more ships and fighter jets, in what Russia denounced as Western "hysteria" in response to its build-up of troops on the Ukraine border.

www.reuters.com

MOSCOW/BRUSSELS, Jan 24 (Reuters) - NATO said on Monday it was putting forces on standby and reinforcing eastern Europe with more ships and fighter jets, in what Russia denounced as Western "hysteria" in response to its build-up of troops on the Ukraine border.

The U.S. Department of Defense in Washington said about 8,500 American troops were put on heightened alert and were awaiting orders to deploy to the region, should Russia invade Ukraine.


Tensions are high after Russia massed an estimated 100,000 troops in reach of its neighbour's border, surrounding Ukraine with forces from the north, east and south.

Russia denies planning an invasion and Moscow is citing the Western response as evidence that Russia is the target, not the instigator, of aggression.

President Joe Biden, pushing for transatlantic unity, held an 80-minute secure video call with a number of European leaders on Monday from the White House Situation Room to discuss the Ukraine crisis.


Biden told reporters "I had a very, very, very good meeting" with the Europeans, which included the leaders of Germany, France, Italy, Britain and Poland. He said there was "total unanimity."

 

[ollie989898]

And there is no way Vlad would let the war stay in his home turf. If we engage it would be full on dirty war in the Uk and whoever else is involved

The Ukraine isn't his turf.

What is he going to do, exactly? Fight Western Europe?

 

[ollie989898]

That turned out well didn’t it?

The US kicked Saddam out of Kuwait fine. Lots of people said it couldn't be done... would be a re-run of Vietnam, etc etc etc...

 

[stewart]

Ok, how many fighter aircraft do the Russians have?

Aerial tankers?

AEW aircraft?

It's already starting:

NATO sends reinforcements and U.S. puts troops on alert as Ukraine tensions rise

NATO said on Monday it was putting forces on standby and reinforcing eastern Europe with more ships and fighter jets, in what Russia denounced as Western "hysteria" in response to its build-up of troops on the Ukraine border.

www.reuters.com

MOSCOW/BRUSSELS, Jan 24 (Reuters) - NATO said on Monday it was putting forces on standby and reinforcing eastern Europe with more ships and fighter jets, in what Russia denounced as Western "hysteria" in response to its build-up of troops on the Ukraine border.

The U.S. Department of Defense in Washington said about 8,500 American troops were put on heightened alert and were awaiting orders to deploy to the region, should Russia invade Ukraine.


Tensions are high after Russia massed an estimated 100,000 troops in reach of its neighbour's border, surrounding Ukraine with forces from the north, east and south.

Russia denies planning an invasion and Moscow is citing the Western response as evidence that Russia is the target, not the instigator, of aggression.

President Joe Biden, pushing for transatlantic unity, held an 80-minute secure video call with a number of European leaders on Monday from the White House Situation Room to discuss the Ukraine crisis.


Biden told reporters "I had a very, very, very good meeting" with the Europeans, which included the leaders of Germany, France, Italy, Britain and Poland. He said there was "total unanimity."

Fighter aircraft? aerial tankers? AEW aircraft I haven't got a clue, it would be more than enough to take the septics on. It will never come to that anyway, the West hasn't the stomach for it and Putin is too canny, it's like watching a draughts player take on a grand master at chess.

 

[stewart]

The US kicked Saddam out of Kuwait fine. Lots of people said it couldn't be done... would be a re-run of Vietnam, etc etc etc...

There is a world of difference between Saddam and Putin, not even in the same league.

 

[ollie989898]

Fighter aircraft? aerial tankers? AEW aircraft I haven't got a clue, it would be more than enough to take the septics on. It will never come to that anyway, the West hasn't the stomach for it and Putin is too canny, it's like watching a draughts player take on a grand master at chess.

I don't think you quite understand the size of US military spending. It's obscene. They field something like 3000 fighter aircraft.

Russia barely spends much more than the UK.

 

[ollie989898]

There is a world of difference between Saddam and Putin, not even in the same league.

I don't see any difference.