Volunteer to coordinate your local Good Friday Protest

soapsud · Feb 1, 2024

ploughman1963 said:
Our identities are well known - a couple of clicks on any keyboard and youd have more info about any of us than most people would want to see of themselves. Ive had my username on here since TFF started and on BFF since around 2007 - changing that feels like getting rid of a piece of 'me' to be honest - I am on twitter under my own name and a bio on the BFU website so no attempt to hide identity here.

The farming world is small enough that most know of each other?
I'm here for ideas and seeing events being discussed. Anonymity means some are freer to say what they mean. Most of us have businesses and I wouldnt want mine affected by saying something stupid on here - which I'm happy to do as there's no backlash that could affect my business only feedback to improve my thinking.

kiwi pom · Feb 1, 2024

Henarar said:
NFU is not a union

Probably needs a rename then

ploughman1963 · Feb 1, 2024

kiwi pom said:
Probably needs a rename then

needs root and branch reform!

JP1 · Feb 1, 2024

kiwi pom said:
Probably needs a rename then

We’ve already told you they take no notice of members or non members

Still Farming · Feb 1, 2024

tullah · Feb 1, 2024

Hanspree said:
Do farmers have the fight to protest anymore.
We dont have the support of the public anymore as they have been turned against us by animal rights and environmentalists.
We are constantly been blamed for destroying the planet by people with their mouths full while their planning their next flight on holiday the other side of the world, with nobody standing up for farmers.
I was at the fuel protests and FFA but I’m afraid farmers are literally just that fed up with been battered with red tape and regulations that are saying rubbish to it, let people do without food and putting everything in SFI.
Most of the general public are the ones dictating and inspecting us in order to justify themselves.
The way the NFU handled the red tractor farce just shows who they really represent, THEMSELVES. Maybe all anger should be directed at them for leaving us in this impossible situation.

The reason I'm a BFU member is that they are the only union who act for farmers and are hell bent on doing away with Red Tractor. If it had t been for The BFU then the corrupt RT would never have made the news.
Anything else they achieve for me is a bonus.

kiwi pom · Feb 1, 2024

JP1 said:
We’ve already told you they take no notice of members or non members

So we agree, as a non-member you get no say

Which is what I said upthread and you disagreed with.

I'm generally against unions as I said and that would extend to the BFU getting too big or powerful.

By the way, I look forward to the day when the NFU and RT no longer exists.

JP1 · Feb 1, 2024

kiwi pom said:
So we agree, as a non-member you get no say

Which is what I said upthread and you disagreed with.

I'm generally against unions as I said and that would extend to the BFU getting too big or powerful.

By the way, I look forward to the day when the NFU and RT no longer exists.

We won’t fall out but no we don’t agree

You said before non members can’t seek speak out about the NFU

kiwi pom · Feb 1, 2024

wrenbird said:
This is what most people don’t understand. The NFU is, and never has been a ‘union’, and was never intended to be one.
When it was initially set up, by large, wealthy landowners in the east of England, somebody had the temerity to suggest that perhaps ordinary working, even tenant, farmers could join, or even (heaven forbid!) farm workers. The founder members were apoplectic with anger over this idea, these sort of people would not be welcome.
At its inception it was intended to be a kind of trade association/exclusive club for large landowners (not the people at the sharp end who actually get their hands dirty).

Can tenants and their landlords join the BFU? Contract farmers and the landowners who call themselves farmers?
I don't imagine farm workers can?

Grass And Grain · Feb 1, 2024

kiwi pom said:
If you're not in the union, you have no say in what they do end of.

I'm generally against unions (although I was in one for ten years) but believe they do have their uses. I think a farmer's union in the UK is destined to fail because the membership is too diverse, even if it's just farmers (whatever they are) who can join. It's also why I think in time the BFU will struggle because just being a member of a union does not mean they will do what you want and resentment sets in.

But thinking you have a say while not being a member is silly. You can criticise them all you want, but you have no say in what they do, so it's fairly pointless.

NFU do (part) own Red Tractor, and Red Tractor affects both NFU members and non members. I suppose technically non members don't have a say, but morally they maybe do?

Certainly when it comes to the second assurance review, I don't think farmers need to be NFU members to comment.

However, you have a good point that non members don't have a say in the NFU. We've sort of taken that to the opposite extreme, because lots have resigned membership, so they've technically no say, but thousands becoming non members is maybe having more of a say/effect than remaining a member!

SteveHants · Feb 1, 2024

Grass And Grain said:
NFU do (part) own Red Tractor, and Red Tractor affects both NFU members and non members. I suppose technically non members don't have a say, but morally they maybe do?

If they pay for RT by being assured, of course they do, surely?

Kiwi Pete · Feb 1, 2024

soapsud said:
NFNF is fear-mongering which activists like @delilah obviously don't believe will assemble the £ paying middle classes. The LWA has increased its end of year returns by £100,000 over the last few years. It's small potatoes compared to the Soil Association which totals over the tens of millions.

Economics will drive this. Politics is a poor second. Food will go up in price and broadacre diesel heads will get rarer. Livestock will be reduced to guerrilla farming in the uplands.

Yes that's the glaring issue with fearmongering narratives and slogans, some of us refuse to live in fear.

Especially after the last few years of BS being rolled out as "fact", people are either still completely captivated by it - or distancing themselves from the sources of it and calling it out.

As you suggest economics will do what they do.
If a few grand of compliance costs are threatening viability then you have bigger problems with your business than you think

soapsud · Feb 1, 2024

JP1 said:
We won’t fall out but no we don’t agree

You said before non members can’t seek speak out about the NFU

It's like the old joke:

What do you say to someone with two black eyes?
Nothing. They've already been told twice already.

Panicnow · Feb 1, 2024

kiwi pom said:
Something I was wondering (because obviously I can't be in either union) As the BFU seems to have been created on here, do members then discover who everyone who has joined actually is, or is it still just user names?
Seems a bit secretive to me. NFU leaders are known to the public and take a lot of stick from farmers and the public (especially on here)
Are the leaders of the BFU well known?

Any start up is obscure for a while, If you want to be part of it, you have to be part of it!

The "Leaders" of the BFU are just like you, but they have put their head above the parapet! Put your head up too, and you are one of the "Leaders"

The act of faith is essential, sorry that's how it works!t

Panicnow · Feb 1, 2024

Hfd Cattle said:
While I agree with the sentiments , I feel that morally it's only right that NFU members can be justified in picketing or demonstrating outside NFU ivory towers .
I'm not a member and therefore they could quite justified in saying to me " why are you here complaining about what we do when you aren't a member,"
Surely it's the responsibility of disgruntled NFU members to lobby and protest at what their own organisation is failing to do .

In other words .... with all the dissatisfaction going on at Everton football club ,it's their own crowd that are protesting about it not the Anfield or Old Trafford.

I'm I favour of protesting but it's very very important that
A, we have a clear agenda
B, The general public are clear what it's about
C, Got to well organised .

I'm not convinced the general public ,by and large , will be sympathetic with £250,000 tractors clogging up the roads with out really understanding why .

The agenda is clear, farming, for food, is not economically viable in the UK or the EU, and will result in the long term in high food prices or hunger.

Panicnow · Feb 1, 2024

£250,000 tractors are part of the problem! By all means take them on protests, and complain that they are over priced and "rented" as John Deere et al, will brick them if they don't get serviced by their over priced engineers... another part of the farmers being screwed by the oligarchies!

Henarar · Feb 1, 2024

JP1 said:
We’ve already told you they take no notice of members or non members

yet by their very name claim to represent them according to amongst others @Sid

Panicnow · Feb 1, 2024

Henarar said:
yet by their very name claim to represent them according to amongst others @Sid

Could we get them on deceptive marketing legislation???

neilo · Feb 1, 2024

Panicnow said:
Could we get them on deceptive marketing legislation???

Why? They do still represent more farmers than any other union/trade body/organisation.

You want to change that, then build an organisation that represents more farmers. To do that, you need to be all inclusive (so not just internet based) and do enough to make people want to join.

Henarar · Feb 1, 2024

Panicnow said:
Could we get them on deceptive marketing legislation???

Deer with no eyes

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