AHL2 - Winter Bird Food

[Derrick Hughes]

No Andy, you are misquoting purposes as aims. Here is a screen shot from the handbook. I have it in writing from RPA, aim is binding, purpose is not.


View attachment 1168492


Not that I have any intention of late drilled AHL2 myself.

Is barley classed as a small seed

 

[fieldfarmer]

You're correct, but I'd consider the two as interchangeable.

Deliver the purpose you deliver the aim, deliver the aim you deliver the purpose.

One can only assume the purposes have been provided to guide the applicant in what is likely to be expected in achieving the options aim.

So yes, you only have to deliver the aim, in doing so you will fulfill the purpose.

So if I were to aim for no insecticides but then have to use them can I still expect to be paid or penalised?
PS , I have not put any non insecticide areas on because here bydv is a big issue hence my question.

 

[Billboy1]

I think you have to fess up if you use them and you’ve failed in your aim ( no penalty )

 

[Zippy768]

So if I were to aim for no insecticides but then have to use them can I still expect to be paid or penalised?
PS , I have not put any non insecticide areas on because here bydv is a big issue hence my question.

I put it all on into No Insecticide. Will probably spraying WB at least, in which case I'll tell them.
Not much got sprayed this year cos of wet

 

[DrWazzock]

How many hectares of bird seed are people typically putting in?
I am intending 5 ha rotational on my 80 ha holding. Is this reasonable? I’m a bit concerned about rats but we will see. I would guess certain mixes will be less attractive to rats, particularly smaller seeds.
During that wet late harvest a while back we were plagued with rats as was the village which caused consternation, but it was a thick crop of spring barley not a mix of smaller seeds.
Less than 5 ha is hardly worth doing IMO considering setting up time, calibrating, cleaning out etc.

 

[DrWazzock]

And I can’t see it working here after winter barley!

 

[Andy26]

How many hectares of bird seed are people typically putting in?
I am intending 5 ha rotational on my 80 ha holding. Is this reasonable? I’m a bit concerned about rats but we will see. I would guess certain mixes will be less attractive to rats, particularly smaller seeds.
During that wet late harvest a while back we were plagued with rats as was the village which caused consternation, but it was a thick crop of spring barley not a mix of smaller seeds.
Less than 5 ha is hardly worth doing IMO considering setting up time, calibrating, cleaning out etc.

I've not seen any Rats in the AB9 that is predominately small seeds, I can imagine it could be an issue with Cereals.

I've heard of hundreds of hectares being put in on single holdings, there was an Estate I read abut in CPM or similar who had 250ha of AB9 in a Mid Tier agreement.

 

[farmerm]

Is barley classed as a small seed

"If you sow an annual mix, it can include a range of cereals, brassicas or other small-seeded crops."

Besides millet, what else would the "range of cereals" include if they had to be only cereals with smaller seeds than barley

 

[Great In Grass]

I've not seen any Rats in the AB9 that is predominately small seeds, I can imagine it could be an issue with Cereals.

I've heard of hundreds of hectares being put in on single holdings, there was an Estate I read abut in CPM or similar who had 250ha of AB9 in a Mid Tier agreement.

One of my suppliers recently received an order for 18 tonnes of seed from one holding and another for sowing 1800 acres which would have been cereals. I had some big orders too!

 

[Clive]

So if I were to aim for no insecticides but then have to use them can I still expect to be paid or penalised?
PS , I have not put any non insecticide areas on because here bydv is a big issue hence my question.

worth growing BYDV resistant varieties ?

 

[Clive]

I've not seen any Rats in the AB9 that is predominately small seeds, I can imagine it could be an issue with Cereals.

I've heard of hundreds of hectares being put in on single holdings, there was an Estate I read abut in CPM or similar who had 250ha of AB9 in a Mid Tier agreement.

Rats and mice were an issue here early days of no till because we created a great habitat for them - the problem disappeared as the raptor and other predator numbers increased

its just another example of how out of balance the way we farm has become - nature can fix issues itself if you let it

 

[Andy26]

So if I were to aim for no insecticides but then have to use them can I still expect to be paid or penalised?
PS , I have not put any non insecticide areas on because here bydv is a big issue hence my question.

This action’s aim is that you do not use plant protection products containing insecticide.

You would not be able to use IPM4 if you use insecticides.

That's an easy aim, its objective, AHL2 there is a degree of subjectiveness

 

[Clive]

I think you have to fess up if you use them and you’ve failed in your aim ( no penalty )

my understanding is at end of each year you have to declare "actuals" - you can cut some options by 50% so actuals could vary a lot year to year

as they are paying up front i'm not sure how the balance up the payment ? deduct from next year or ask for pay back ?

 

[Derrick Hughes]

Farms in Southern Australia sow mice bait as a routine before drilling barley

 

[Humble Village Farmer]

Owls eat rats, so you would be adding to the number of species benefitting.

 

[Clive]

Farms in Southern Australia sow mice bait as a routine before drilling barley

shows how much they have screwed up the natural balance of the environment then


perfect example of whats been wrong with the way we farm over the last 50years or so ....... screw thing up with a bag or bottle and then look for another bag or bottle to fix it !

the winners ? people who sell bags and bottles !

 

[Derrick Hughes]

Rats and mice were an issue here early days of no till because we created a great habitat for them - the problem disappeared as the raptor and other predator numbers increased

its just another example of how out of balance the way we farm has become - nature can fix issues itself if you let it

If you left farming ti nature half the population would starve,

 

[Clive]

Owls eat rats, so you would be adding to the number of species benefitting.

exactly what happened here - x4 owl species today plus several tyres of hawk in healthy numbers .......... none 15 years ago, mice, rates and moles no longer a problem

 

[Clive]

If you left farming ti nature half the population would starve,

not my problem


equally if you screw up nature / climate / planet we will ALL starve / cook or drown !

 

[DrWazzock]

I actually feel quite enthusiastic about it. Hopefully it will be acceptable for me to apply in July and start my SFI year in August. That way I can sensibly plan autumn drilling and land use yet still have the crop of bird seed “established” within 12 months of agreement start date.