are new tractor over priced

kiwi pom

Member
Location
canterbury NZ
In 1970 you could buy a new ih 414 for the price of 8 calves, now have to sell 80 calve to buy a 140hp tractor does a lot more work but does it do 10 times the work? Probably does but with a massive reduction in labour units.

Just a thought.

Makes you wonder what all the farmers were doing with the huge amounts of money they made back then?
Although when I was a kid in the seventies and eighties every farmer I knew said there was no money in the job:scratchhead:
 

7610 super q

Never Forgotten
Honorary Member
Makes you wonder what all the farmers were doing with the huge amounts of money they made back then?
Although when I was a kid in the seventies and eighties every farmer I knew said there was no money in the job:scratchhead:
Spent it. Many more employed in Ag back then, it wasn't a competition to see who could farm the most land with the least amount of people like it is now.. Land rent was probably higher in real terms. Interest rates 17%. Even small farmers changed tractors every 5 years.
There's the old joke that when farmers receive more money for their produce, they just find more expensive ways to produce it. Some truth in that I think. Nothing wrong in that. the Ag supply industry benefits.
 

Drpapanak

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Worcestershire
I bought an X reg tractor 20 years ago, MF 6270, aircon, semi powershift, power shuttle, eco pto , electric hydraulics and I regard it as the best tractor on the farm, I have said several times on this forum that I’d buy an MF 6200 series in prefeference to anything on the market today, I certainly have no need for the fancy screens and electric spools that it seems to be getting harder to avoid which add to the build cost and judging by some threads on here are expensive to fix, meanwhile I’m yet to have a problem with a mechanical spool which would no doubt be a cheaper fix if it did go wrong.
our w plate 6290 is still going strong
 
What do you actually need a tractor to do, I'm sure folks in the machinery section on here could come up with some cheaper solutions for you.
I always think this is an interesting question. I have an IH434 we bought new in 1970 and it is way overspecced. It has 8 gears and a 2 speed PTO, when it has probably only used 3 gears in the last 30 years and no-one ever realised for decades what the PTO gear did. It also has a sophisticated for the time draught control system which has never been used once in 50 years and is still covered in paint. It even has headlights and indicators which I don't ever remember using on the road. At the time, that was what you got with a medium tractor so you just accepted it, but it all had to be paid for, with one eye on the trade in, but of course it soon fell in value so it wasn't worth trading in. :)
 

Goweresque

Member
Location
North Wilts
Or are you happy also buying ten year old technology for thousands of pounds too?

I'd be happy with 20 year old technology. Hell, 30 wouldn't be an issue. A tractor is not rocket science. Its a just big engine coupled to a big gearbox. We'd got that sorted 25 years ago, everything since is just extra expense for little or no increase in efficiency.
 

Highland Mule

Member
Livestock Farmer
I'd be happy with 20 year old technology. Hell, 30 wouldn't be an issue. A tractor is not rocket science. Its a just big engine coupled to a big gearbox. We'd got that sorted 25 years ago, everything since is just extra expense for little or no increase in efficiency.

I wasn't actually referring to agri tech, but general "stuff" technology. I agree to a point, but wouldn't want to go back to a 14" CRT telly for £500, motorolla brick phone (£1,000) and 486 computer (£800).

Just realised my landy is coming up to 20, my loader tractor is 25 and quad is 16. Time marches on and waits for nobody.
 
I definitely think new tractors are overpriced. Then again every time I want to sell something it’s too cheap and every time I want to buy it’s too expensive.

Grandpa bought the last new tractor on the family farm in 1953, still have it. He also bought the last new pickup in the family in 1947, still have it. I’m no fan of buying new unless you can absolutely justify it. It takes some serious productivity to pay for new iron. I feed a decent amount of dairy animals with just 2 tractors.

My dad and his brother get along fine on about 600 acres of crop ground and 600 acres of grazing/hay with the newest tractor being a 1976. And by get along I mean they don’t make any money, but they don’t lose any either.

A new tractor wouldn’t really gain them much other than something new to cuss at. Neither have ever driven a power shift transmission.
I would like to farm like it is 1975 but i can’t. So i keep on the treadmill. A day on a 4000 is o.k for a change but it’s not something i would want to do everyday it’s not good for your hearing you suck up a lot of dust and your back and knees will hurt. I was looking at my t7040 last night new in 2019 and thinking it’s a lot of tractor compared to a 4000. And thinking about house prices in 1975 usually just one family member worked and people were able to buy a house if they wanted now with both husband and wife earning home ownership is a dream for a lot of people.
How did you get a 19plate T7040??? Thought they where long gone
 
In 1975 the average house price was £10,000 and a farm workers wage would have been £ 50 so 200 weeks work for a house today the average house price is close to £ 200,000 and the average wage won’t be much more than £400 so about 500 weeks work to buy a house. I know there are some variables like areas of the country etc but it seems we are all working harder for less. It’s time for a revolution.
Wouldn’t have a clue about 1975 figures but I believe the average wage is now about 27k , and I’m sure you’ll be about right with the 200k average house price.
Of course averages hide a lot, I’m sure there will be plenty on far less than average wage just as it’s not difficult to get a house in the 100 to 120k price range or for that matter finding one below 100k that wants a bit doing to it, I’m sure 1970’s man would have been quite happy doing a bit of DIY at the weekend.
Lifestyles and expectations have Changed and it all comes at a price.

The same has happened with tractors, I remember asking a mate what he thought of this here air conditioning he’d got in his new tractor, today I wouldn’t buy one without nor would I want one without a power shuttle or some sort of semi powershift gearbox. These things were all available 20 plus years ago now, most of the stuff that’s been added since however I would regard as unnecessary
 

Lowland1

Member
Mixed Farmer
Spent it. Many more employed in Ag back then, it wasn't a competition to see who could farm the most land with the least amount of people like it is now.. Land rent was probably higher in real terms. Interest rates 17%. Even small farmers changed tractors every 5 years.
There's the old joke that when farmers receive more money for their produce, they just find more expensive ways to produce it. Some truth in that I think. Nothing wrong in that. the Ag supply industry benefits.
And there you have it. One man can now do what six or more did then. When we had five or six on the farm we needed enough to pay five or six salaries. Now only one is doing it he is not going to get the same money as five or six people and the one expensive 200 hp tractor does the same as four Ford 4000’s so there is less money in the supply chain as well. Problem is if we all can make a living off 50 acres some clever man will work out that if he had 100 acres he will make twice as much. Not much anyone can do but keep on the treadmill.
 
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I wasn't actually referring to agri tech, but general "stuff" technology. I agree to a point, but wouldn't want to go back to a 14" CRT telly for £500, motorolla brick phone (£1,000) and 486 computer (£800).
I was reading somewhere that technology goes through stages of cost vs. usefulness and the nack is jumping in at the right moment. When I was young, I was overawed by the technology of computers, Concorde, the Harrier and man on the moon. It seemed that we would simply build on our progress to advance faster and faster into the universe of Space 1999 where anything was possible. In reality, my life is still firmly rooted in 1899 as the technology hit the limits of what was useful.
My 486 computer is still sitting fully functional in the loft because it didn't quite live up to its promise. The cheaper Windows 98 model was nearly there and actually had loads of features I never used, and this laptop is like my IH434, it came with umpteen million unnecessary features that I will never even discover or use, and I will use all that power to simply send typed messages on here and look at Bald Rick's ooohhh... posts :)
 

Highland Mule

Member
Livestock Farmer
I was reading somewhere that technology goes through stages of cost vs. usefulness and the nack is jumping in at the right moment. When I was young, I was overawed by the technology of computers, Concorde, the Harrier and man on the moon. It seemed that we would simply build on our progress to advance faster and faster into the universe of Space 1999 where anything was possible. In reality, my life is still firmly rooted in 1899 as the technology hit the limits of what was useful.
My 486 computer is still sitting fully functional in the loft because it didn't quite live up to its promise. The cheaper Windows 98 model was nearly there and actually had loads of features I never used, and this laptop is like my IH434, it came with umpteen million unnecessary features that I will never even discover or use, and I will use all that power to simply send typed messages on here and look at Bald Rick's ooohhh... posts :)

Yep, and progress is slowing, I think. I'm sure I read somewhere that Moore's law has finally been broken.
 
I expect the price of parts and labour here would knacker it, all good if you can do it yourself though, i remember partly rebuilding a 6400 in a previous life and that cost 12k ish and it was still fairly rough tbh, so you'd be looking at a fair bit more, but it depends how much the tractor cost to start. @REStracTORATION would probably be more clued up tbh.
Thanks
The little tractors you can go through easy enough the cost outweighs their value, saying that its not always about the cost more what you end up with....

The larger tractor does cost a fortune to overhaul but if that cost against buying new, the restored version will return many years trouble free service can be offset in a way

Its happening and we are seeing new enquiries in this avenue

People are mostly fed up of all the bull crap that attached to newer complex models
 

texelburger

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Herefordshire
My father in the 70's said a combine was the price of a 3 bed semi in Hereford.Today that still is true.3 years ago we bought a Lexion 630 which would be,roughly,the price of a semi from a nice area of Hereford City.
 
My father in the 70's said a combine was the price of a 3 bed semi in Hereford.Today that still is true.3 years ago we bought a Lexion 630 which would be,roughly,the price of a semi from a nice area of Hereford City.
Out of interest, how much would a 3 bed semi rent out for in Hereford and how much would it cost to get a contractor to do your combining?
 

Goweresque

Member
Location
North Wilts
My father in the 70's said a combine was the price of a 3 bed semi in Hereford.Today that still is true.3 years ago we bought a Lexion 630 which would be,roughly,the price of a semi from a nice area of Hereford City.

Which shows that the price of machinery has kept up with the thing that has risen the most in the Uk in the last 50 years, property. Everyone says that houses cost too much, in relation to incomes, which have also risen significantly in real terms over the same period, so what does that say about machinery costs, when farm incomes have stagnated for 30 years?

I was thinking this morning as I unloaded my last few hay bales for the year that this farm I own and run now was farmed as arable 30 years ago with a Case/DB 1694 pulling a 4 furrow Dowdeswell reversible, and an Accord 2.5 Combi power harrow drill. One man did all the cultivations and planting with them. The combine was a Deutz-Fahr 13 foot header, and all the other tractor work (rolling, harrowing grain carting) was done with sub-100hp tractors. There was a Collins teleshift that lifted as much grain as my JCB does today. Now there can be over 500hp in the very same fields at one given time. Yet the work all got done 30 years ago, just as it does today.

IMO subsidies have allowed farmers to use far too much horsepower than the productive capacity of the land permits, mainly to the benefit of John Deere Inc and AGCO, among others.
 

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