Barn conversion heating / hot water

[Doing it for the kids]

At £15 an hr in labour (it's less) about 1-2 bales worth of RHI income a week on average.

I can easily burn 35 a week.

At 9.2p / kWh I can assure you the figures here are very healthy, that's before the 3p I then re charge to tenants.

 

[akaPABLO01]

At £15 an hr in labour (it's less) about 1-2 bales worth of RHI income a week on average.

I can easily burn 35 a week.

At 9.2p / kWh I can assure you the figures here are very healthy, that's before the 3p I then re charge to tenants.

It's ok to be in denial of the amount of lost time invested in the running/maintenance of the system.

The top up from tenants definitely helps but I'll hazard a guess that your kW of heat costs at least 5p

 

[Doing it for the kids]

I have three accountants in my family.

We meter electric and heat consumption to every building on the farm. I know exactly how many bales we use. Cleaning time goes on a time sheet.

Based on the heat used in the farm house alone, we save, @30p / litre on oil about 7k.

It's really easy to do the figures which is backed up by the bank statements.

You obviously won't take this as fact, that's up to you. Neither of us need convincing though as those days have pretty much gone now

 

[akaPABLO01]

I have three accountants in my family.

We meter electric and heat consumption to every building on the farm. I know exactly how many bales we use. Cleaning time goes on a time sheet.

Based on the heat used in the farm house alone, we save, @30p / litre on oil about 7k.

It's really easy to do the figures which is backed up by the bank statements.

You obviously won't take this as fact, that's up to you. Neither of us need convincing though as those days have pretty much gone now

Yup, only time biomass works is free fuel and cheap labour.

Stacked against oil though at what 4p, probably works out equal considering its volativity market wise.

My point isn't dwelling in the past, its firmly stating in current times farmers are best focusing on ground source heat pumps and air for best value.

With digging alone savings on install can be as much as 10£k minimum.

Ground source is the now.

 

[Doing it for the kids]

I agree ref heat pumps.

My point was in previous years biomass was good when RHI was so generous.

We have been agreeing with each other broadly on this thread, as we do in most others

My straw boilers are still one of the best investments we have made though

 

[akaPABLO01]

I agree ref heat pumps.

My point was in previous years biomass was good when RHI was so generous.

We have been agreeing with each other broadly on this thread, as we do in most others

My straw boilers are still one of the best investments we have made though

Possibly the best investment you've made thus far.

 

[Doing it for the kids]

Correct

 

[f0ster]

I have a few customers paying £170 per ton for pellets.

 

[Doing it for the kids]

I have a few customers paying £170 per ton for pellets.

Ok, what's that a ton - 4000? 4500 kWh?

 

[e3120]

Ground source is the now.

Does the cap not take the shine off a bit? What do you know about the 'shared ground loop for multiple properties qualifying for domestic' that came out of the last consultation - worth thinking about?

 

[tullah]

Your figures are a figment of an illusion with straw. Tell me, how many hours/days are wasted annually maintaining your boiler?

My Contractor to bale is £2.50 per round 4'6" bale weighing 185kgs. That's a straw cost of 1.35 p per kilo. Then there's cost of carting and stacking. A kilo of straw will give me 2.1kwh.

In addition to straw cost is the man using tractor and time loading 4 bales a day out of the barn into the boiler plus all boiler maintenance, the opportunity cost of the barn used to store the straw and management record keeping etc etc. etc. It hasn't all been roses here.

 

[Doing it for the kids]

My Contractor to bale is £2.50 per round 4'6" bale weighing 185kgs. That's a straw cost of 1.35 p per kilo. Then there's cost of carting and stacking. A kilo of straw will give me 2.1kwh.

In addition to straw cost is the man using tractor and time loading 4 bales a day out of the barn into the boiler plus all boiler maintenance, the opportunity cost of the barn used to store the straw and management record keeping etc etc. etc. It hasn't all been roses here.

All valid points, which boiler are you running? Guessing you are bailing wheat straw ? I am getting over 2.5 kWh / kg mostly. The straw sheds get used for storage after the first month or two so cost is split. Bale loading takes less than 10 minutes. Yes it's all time but can't guarantee the same quarterly cash from farming now can we plus house is warm as can be!

What are you using the heat for? Drying grain, heating a house and selling on to tenants all make massive differences as we need the heat.

If you want to cut costs and can burn it, swop to grade a timber, just about to do that on another unit, getting an artic load (100 m3) for about £230 delivered!!

 

[ffukedfarmer]

Definitely stick a wood burner in, and go LPG, Calor will put the tank in for free ( provided you sign up for 2 years ) and gas boilers are 1/2 the price of oil and you save £1k on an oil tank on top [emoji41]

What are your thoughts on underground LPG tanks? I was told that they are more expensive to maintain than above ground tanks due to the sacrificial anodes?!

I've had Calor round who offered a free tank, seems too good to be true.

 

[Adeptandy]

What are your thoughts on underground LPG tanks? I was told that they are more expensive to maintain than above ground tanks due to the sacrificial anodes?!

I've had Calor round who offered a free tank, seems too good to be true.

Yes, it's a bit surprising getting a free tank, although underground is £1500 around here when a customer had them round a few weeks ago. No problems so far in below ground tanks, only know of 1 leak and that was poorly protected pipework from the tank. I'd go below ground, when/if it does corrode, just get another free one [emoji6] plus, compared to oil, it's a lot easier to clean up if it does leak [emoji41]

 

[phillipe]

What are your thoughts on underground LPG tanks? I was told that they are more expensive to maintain than above ground tanks due to the sacrificial anodes?!

I've had Calor round who offered a free tank, seems too good to be true.

Put loads in lately ,it's a good deal from Calor,free tank ,90 quid a year rent ,gas fixed at 31p a liter,allied with a shiny new boiler and good insulation ,in a 4 bed 200year old house 300 quid last year for gas for water and heating

 

[f0ster]

what is the difference between a vehicle supply lpg tank and a domestic supply lpg tank, I thought it is where the gas/liquid is taken from, for vehicle use is the liquid taken from the bottom of the tank with a compressor where as for domestic use the vapour is taken from the top of the tank?

 

[ffukedfarmer]

Yes, it's a bit surprising getting a free tank, although underground is £1500 around here when a customer had them round a few weeks ago. No problems so far in below ground tanks, only know of 1 leak and that was poorly protected pipework from the tank. I'd go below ground, when/if it does corrode, just get another free one [emoji6] plus, compared to oil, it's a lot easier to clean up if it does leak [emoji41]

Put loads in lately ,it's a good deal from Calor,free tank ,90 quid a year rent ,gas fixed at 31p a liter,allied with a shiny new boiler and good insulation ,in a 4 bed 200year old house 300 quid last year for gas for water and heating

Thank you

Do underground tanks still need to be certain distance from the boundary?

 

[Adeptandy]

TBH, it's not something I think about as Calor, Flogas fit them it's there responsibility to site them correctly and to regulations [emoji4]

 

[phillipe]

Thank you

Do underground tanks still need to be certain distance from the boundary?

i just ring the calor rep and turn and up and discuss where it can be put,if you go on calor website it gives you a rough guide

 

[phillipe]

TBH, it's not something I think about as Calor, Flogas fit them it's there responsibility to site them correctly and to regulations [emoji4]

but we dig the hole as such