can i direct drill wheat into sprayed off grass?

[chris a list]

Have just put the keys in the ignition of a small holding and have 30 acres of grass sprayed off waiting to go into wheat. Ground is feckin dry and hard (chalk farm) so ploughing will be tougher than normal. Have a moore unidrill which would be capable of puting seed in well if we have a couple of inches of rain.
I think i have time on my side right now and dont have to make a rushed decision.

if it doesnt rain what would you suggest?

or is direct drilling wheat into grass a negative?

thanks

 

[Andrew K]

How long since the grass was sprayed off?
I would go for it myself, add a little N maybe.

 

[chris a list]

grass sprayed off this wednesday and looks like an inch or more of rain due over next week so should be right in a week or so?

 

[Tom Sewell]

I'd give it a go! The structure of the soil after grass should be good and you'll travel well. Just make sure slot is closed well, if not roll and check for slugs. I bet it will yield well after a grass ley!

 

[tw15]

Give it a few days for the rain to soak in and it will be fine . You will need an extra 10 tons of crop yield from ploughing system just to cover costs of ploughing. Maybe best to sort out areas that are compacted around gateways and if ring feeder areas have been badly trodden.
Maybe best to run a subsoiler through those areas and roll back down then dd the whole field and a good roll jobs a goodun. Good luck with your new place .

 

[YorkshireAndrew]

We've a heavy land field due to come out of grass next year ( 4 year ley ) & I had the same thought about direct drilling , it'll be interesting to see your results @chris a list .

 

[Simon Chiles]

I wouldn't dd it unless you really know what you are doing and what the weather will be like for the next eight weeks. Most likely it will be a complete failure. I wouldn't plough it either for the above reasons. If anyone wants me to talk them through it PM me your phone no.
I had hundreds of acres fail in the first few years of dd even when I'd advised that it wouldn't work. However that was fifteen years ago and I think I've cracked it now.

 

[major ag]

If it's most likely to be a failure then why?
It would be interesting to know the reasons why it may or may not work.
Pm kills the thread somewhat.

 

[Simon Chiles]

If it's most likely to be a failure then why?
It would be interesting to know the reasons why it may or may not work.
Pm kills the thread somewhat.

Can someone put the link up to the two Simon's Theory as I can't find how to do it from my iPhone app.

Lot's of people still like to talk through the options, nothing secret about it or trying to kill a thread.

 

[Hartwig]

Can someone put the link up to the two Simon's Theory as I can't find how to do it from my iPhone app.

http://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/the-two-simons-theory.22172/

 

[SilliamWhale]

If it's most likely to be a failure then why?
It would be interesting to know the reasons why it may or may not work.
Pm kills the thread somewhat.

time is not on your side now at this time of year.

 

[chris a list]

well the weather was good here today so iv`e gone and started the job!! seems to be going in quite nicely. getting a good shatter of soil at seed depth and coulters are clearing foliage to the side nicely. There is a bit more trash in a lower part of the field ( about 4 acres ) and i`m tempted to cross stitch an extra 60-70 kg/ha through . For one to create more tilth and seed contact and secondly because i have plenty of seed.
or is that a bad idea?

 

[Clive]

well the weather was good here today so iv`e gone and started the job!! seems to be going in quite nicely. getting a good shatter of soil at seed depth and coulters are clearing foliage to the side nicely. There is a bit more trash in a lower part of the field ( about 4 acres ) and i`m tempted to cross stitch an extra 60-70 kg/ha through . For one to create more tilth and seed contact and secondly because i have plenty of seed.
or is that a bad idea?

Durban ?

If it gets wet get granular lime on it fast even if ph tests ok now

 

[chris a list]

very free draining so never a problem . As for durban , I have happily watched the rooks working the field over the last week and they seemed to be having fun. Not a rook or crow in sight today so they must have finished there fill and now am considering an application. Soils samples results came back yesterday and was told everything is good. And asked about leather jackets to be told that they will do the damage in the spring. Does that mean an appplication of pesticide would be better in the spring or now?

 

[Andy26]

very free draining so never a problem . As for durban , I have happily watched the rooks working the field over the last week and they seemed to be having fun. Not a rook or crow in sight today so they must have finished there fill and now am considering an application. Soils samples results came back yesterday and was told everything is good. And asked about leather jackets to be told that they will do the damage in the spring. Does that mean an appplication of pesticide would be better in the spring or now?

Apply Dursban in November, crop damage occurs Dec-April, need to apply when soil temperature is 5C and above when the larvae are active and near the surface.

 

[Simon Chiles]

If it gets wet get granular lime on it fast even if ph tests ok now

We've spoken about this, he's been dd'ing for years and it's very free draining land and also high pH as it's chalky soil so unlikely to become anaerobic and acidic.

 

[Will Blackburn]

Apply Dursban in November, crop damage occurs Dec-April, need to apply when soil temperature is 5C and above when the larvae are active and near the surface.

I've moved from applying dursban in November to at emergence, frit fly caused mayhem in one field last year and could have been responsible for 1st wheats after grass not thriving after emergence in previous years. So far establishment is the best I've ever achieved after grass leys. Also bunged 60kg/ha of N as urea on wheat after silage grass that was starved of N after 3rd cut, to alleviate lack of available N. This appears to have had a positive effect as there are no symptoms of shortage unlike previous years where wheat after silage leys was literally a pale shadow of wheat after grazed leys.

 

[SilliamWhale]

I think on reflection this was a decent year to drill wheat into grass as the warmth hung around.

 

[Will Blackburn]

I think on reflection this was a decent year to drill wheat into grass as the warmth hung around.

True but the hard ground delayed drilling by at least two weeks and with the theories above I was getting a little twitchy about drilling into grass in October on stronger ground.

For my system I need to break through 2nd wheats yielding better than 1st's after grass, and I think Autumn N and frit fly control rather than focusing on leatherjackets and NVZ style N applications may produce results.

 

[chris a list]

update . not sure how well they show the wheat but its there and looking pretty healthy so far
first picture (28/10/14) was drilled 19/10/14
second 2 taken today , cleaner stubble is on top headland that was grassed down this spring so not much clover.
3rd picture is on main work that has a fair covering of white clover.
looking to deal with grass weeds in spring i believe