Cogent

[Holsteinfriesian90]

I think this is a travesty!! There are going to be some bloody good bulls get the chop.
Doubt they’ll sell them but some of those bulls could prove a very good buy and worth a lot of £££ in 3 years time when everyone is chuffed with the offspring.
I don’t actually think this is progress.

I agree its a shame.

 

[jerseycowsman]

I use viking genetics.
Right now they have
23 holstein bulls on the plan - zero are proven
19 scandinavian red bulls - zero proven
9 jersey bulls - zero proven
and 10 red holsteins, also zero proven.
So the national company in Denmark don't sell proven bulls to danish farmers any more.
They do keep the old bulls around, as thats what they can sell on the export market they say.
The bulls we use nationally are usually between 10 and 15 month old, then a new and better comes along.

It will be intersting to see if the masterplan holds up. They promise close to 4 index points improvement/year with this plan, which is a lot.

i don't have much faith in the Danish jersey. We have used some Danish, they have been ok. In our herd a Danish sired animal is 3 times more likely to be in the lame paddock and twice as likely to get mastitis.
It doesn't inspire me much that there seems to be no breeder knowledge used in Danish breeding, the cows are just numbers and breeding seems to be treated a bit like painting by numbers!
In my view, genomics should take out some of the guesswork for young bulls, but I have no hesitation in using proven bulls time and again if they provide what I'm looking for

 

[Stinker]

I think genomics is a great tool for AI companies to help select future bulls but I don't see why farmers need to forced to use them. Make no mistake selling genomic bulls is far more profitable than selling proven bulls and that's why they are forced down our throats.

 

[More to life]

I think genomics is a great tool for AI companies to help select future bulls but I don't see why farmers need to forced to use them. Make no mistake selling genomic bulls is far more profitable than selling proven bulls and that's why they are forced down our throats.

Supply and demand,there will be plenty of proven bulls available if farmers continue to buy them but I think that ship has sailed.

 

[Grassman247]

I only buy proven bulls, used to shop with LIC but found some very dodgy udders with some of there bulls. Have now moved to Norweigen red with geno UK who are now part of genus but the cross cattle coming through are just superb.

Having worked for 12 months on a farm in New Zealand where they had genomics forced on them and seeing the state of there cows I’ll never touch them. 50% of the herd were absolute rubbish and the owners were not impressed one bit.

 

[Homesy]

I only buy proven bulls, used to shop with LIC but found some very dodgy udders with some of there bulls. Have now moved to Norweigen red with geno UK who are now part of genus but the cross cattle coming through are just superb.

Having worked for 12 months on a farm in New Zealand where they had genomics forced on them and seeing the state of there cows I’ll never touch them. 50% of the herd were absolute rubbish and the owners were not impressed one bit.

Be very very wary about using Norwegian Reds. Genus are using country of origin figures not interbull. Just compare these two linears of Gopollen
http://www.genusbreeding.co.uk/?bulls=gopollen

http://www.holstein-uk.org/animaldata/animal/factsheet/39365042

 

[jerseycowsman]

I only buy proven bulls, used to shop with LIC but found some very dodgy udders with some of there bulls. Have now moved to Norweigen red with geno UK who are now part of genus but the cross cattle coming through are just superb.

Having worked for 12 months on a farm in New Zealand where they had genomics forced on them and seeing the state of there cows I’ll never touch them. 50% of the herd were absolute rubbish and the owners were not impressed one bit.

We used some LIC bulls to try to push our fat up a bit. They did push up the fat, but they were worse for mastitis and lameness, and once they got in calf they would shut up shop and dry off

 

[Cows 'n grass]

We used some LIC bulls to try to push our fat up a bit. They did push up the fat, but they were worse for mastitis and lameness, and once they got in calf they would shut up shop and dry off

Is your breeding almost entirely North American now then?

 

[jerseycowsman]

Is your breeding almost entirely North American now then?

A little Australian, a little Danish, then the rest is American and Canadian (Canadian very important for reigning in the American water producing factories!) and a lot of our own bulls

 

[Cows 'n grass]

A little Australian, a little Danish, then the rest is American and Canadian (Canadian very important for reigning in the American water producing factories!) and a lot of our own bulls

It seems to be working for you (although the top photo looks a bit close to having a photoshopped top line)

I just had a quick glance at the Semex website, Vivaldi looks like the type of bull I'd happily use but he's basically Danish being Lix X Impulse.

I've 50 to calve by this chap next spring.

 

[jerseycowsman]

It seems to be working for you (although the top photo looks a bit close to having a photoshopped top line)
View attachment 605858
I just had a quick glance at the Semex website, Vivaldi looks like the type of bull I'd happily use but he's basically Danish being Lix X Impulse.

I've 50 to calve by this chap next spring.
View attachment 605878

He's a handsome fella! He'll leave frames, deep bodied and slightly sickled legs (good suspension for all that walking!).
That's the problem these days, you just don't know if they've been photoshopped or not. But she was in her 9th there, should have been 10th if she hadn't had a year off for embryo work, we were lucky to have her! Bloody arthritis finished her off in the end.
Have those boys you took home in your car got any milking daughters yet?

 

[Cows 'n grass]

No, they would have worked for the first time in spring 16 so I have some calves from them but I wouldn't know which because I would have been running 4 or 5 bulls. One developed a slightly misshapen foot so I stopped using him. The other, who was out of your 515, was a cracking looking bull so typically I found him upsidedown in a ditch back in the summer.

 

[sidjon]

No, they would have worked for the first time in spring 16 so I have some calves from them but I wouldn't know which because I would have been running 4 or 5 bulls. One developed a slightly misshapen foot so I stopped using him. The other, who was out of your 515, was a cracking looking bull so typically I found him upsidedown in a ditch back in the summer.

Does seem jersey's can find as many ways to die as Sheep then​

 

[jerseycowsman]

No, they would have worked for the first time in spring 16 so I have some calves from them but I wouldn't know which because I would have been running 4 or 5 bulls. One developed a slightly misshapen foot so I stopped using him. The other, who was out of your 515, was a cracking looking bull so typically I found him upsidedown in a ditch back in the summer.

Bugger!
Let me know what you think to the cobalts when they calve in

 

[Cows 'n grass]

Does seem jersey's can find as many ways to die as Sheep then​

They're also virile like rams. I ran 80 heifers with one bull a few years back. He got just about all of them in calf in 6 weeks and still had the energy to try and kill you if you went within 500yards.

 

[sidjon]

Sounds about right, was he also digging holes all over the shop like our buggers do.