Covid 19.. Milk price impact?

[frederick]

Stilton has dropped 30% not 60%

In our neck of the woods pasty sales have dropped 80%!

Glad you think that the s/markets and processors don't control the milk market, Sid. Just google "MMC milk price fixing £116 million fine" to see that they have a history. The only difference is that now they're working the system to keep prices low.

As a Dairy processor's Customer Service Rep what they do on a Friday-they visit every supermarket in their area NOT supplied by them and report back on the prices!

I think you will find the price fixing they were guilty of was working together to pass on a price rise to dairy farmers. They were found guilty of ripping off the general public not farmers.

 

[som farmer]

after the mess, caused by c19, is sorted, are any lessons learnt ? Personally, I think there are to many buyers, which the major retailers, use to their advantage, playing one against another, keeping the price down. If there were less buyers, could that lead to 'more resistance, to bid low' ? Or, could they be trusted to keeper prices up ? Always bearing in mind, other than fresh milk, or special cheeses, milk is a global commodity, with a base price, which we have to acknowledge, retailers could always use imports, as a weapon, to keep prices low. It has to be acknowledged that the dairy trade, is disjointed. Much has been said about the MMB, who were only milk brokers, not manufacturing much at all, bit before my 'active' time, so I may be wrong, they were a monopoly, and when the monopoly was removed, the buyers cherrypicked, the rest went to a co-op, the rest is history. So, MMB is gone for good. forced to split, etc, one has to admire the acumen, of the major buyers, even if we despise it !

 

[Tarw Coch]

Please bring it back. I can’t wait to have the lowest milk price in Europe.
Again......

I’m alright Jack?
Some of our producers are probably already there at the moment, whilstit would seem you are on one of the best uk prices.

I can’t help but think that if we had the mmb at the moment there would be far less of a crisis for some, we’d all be in it together and no one would be facing any real hardship.
Not that the mmb is coming back its just a thought.

 

[bar718]

Most of these daries which have problems could have solved them buy only signing up 80-90% of there needs and getting Arla or First Milk to do their balancing.

And both would have the capacity to handle the surplus.

Who would pay for this balancing facility. Who would pay for a dairy to stand idle if there was no need for it but it might be needed by another company at a later day.
What would the coops do if the dairies you talk about suddenly didn’t want that extra milk, who would stand the loss for them having to sell it at a lower price to another processor or would that be their problem ?

 

[rusty]

Farmer owned Coop screws up things for farmers.

So much of what I see about Arla seems to be about them acting against the interests of their members/owners.

How are Arla acting against the interest of their owners? I am very happy to be supplying them in this current climate with an average milk price of 31 p for the 12 months.

 

[lazy farmer]

I’m alright Jack?
Some of our producers are probably already there at the moment, whilstit would seem you are on one of the best uk prices.

I can’t help but think that if we had the mmb at the moment there would be far less of a crisis for some, we’d all be in it together and no one would be facing any real hardship.
Not that the mmb is coming back its just a thought.e ppl

Alright jack?. Why is it we only except the capitalist system when it’s working in our favour? There have been times in the past when we have been paid 8p for A quite large proportion of our Milk. Far below its intrinsic value at the time.
I certainly didn’t call for the reinstatement of the MMB. we did what many have done on here. Adapted. The market never stays Sedentary for long.

 

[Surface Tension]

I think you will find the price fixing they were guilty of was working together to pass on a price rise to dairy farmers. They were found guilty of ripping off the general public not farmers.

Afterwards the OFT reported that they could find no evidence that price rises had been passed on to the farmers.

 

[bar718]

Afterwards the OFT reported that they could find no evidence that price rises had been passed on to the farmers.

Well they didn’t look very hard did they then.

 

[Surface Tension]

Well they didn’t look very hard did they then.

OK, so where is this evidence?

 

[bar718]

OK, so where is this evidence?

I have neither the time or energy to be bothered with answering this. If that’s what you want to think then fine by me. Talk to any milk buyer and this is used as a perfect example of price fixing, even though it was all done in good faith but I can assure you the fines were felt big time by the various companies and it is something that will never be repeated.

 

[Tarw Coch]

Alright jack?. Why is it we only except the capitalist system when it’s working in our favour? There have been times in the past when we have been paid 8p for A quite large proportion of our Milk. Far below its intrinsic value at the time.
I certainly didn’t call for the reinstatement of the MMB. we did what many have done on here. Adapted. The market never stays Sedentary for long.

Not exactly true, I have never felt happy at times knowing other producers have been getting a fraction of the milk price I have.
The positive of the mmb was that the milk price was divided up equally amongst all producers, although I do realise it’s never coming back.
I am fortunate to have never had to experience some of the worst of the milk prices so in a way I’m alright Jack but as I say I’m not comfortable when others are getting considerably less.
It seems you are comfortable to ride the roller coaster and having experienced the lows I’m sure you’re glad to see the highs.
I can’t help thinking that most on the industry would be better off with a more stable milk though.

 

[Surface Tension]

I have neither the time or energy to be bothered with answering this.

OK, no worries, you had the time and energy to get involved in the discussion but don't have the time or energy to back up your statement even though you seem to claim it would be easy to find.

 

[lazy farmer]

Not exactly true, I have never felt happy at times knowing other producers have been getting a fraction of the milk price I have.
The positive of the mmb was that the milk price was divided up equally amongst all producers, although I do realise it’s never coming back.
I am fortunate to have never had to experience some of the worst of the milk prices so in a way I’m alright Jack but as I say I’m not comfortable when others are getting considerably less.
It seems you are comfortable to ride the roller coaster and having experienced the lows I’m sure you’re glad to see the highs.
I can’t help thinking that most on the industry would be better off with a more stable milk though
.

I am still quite idealistic in my little centrist utopian world. But two things spring to mind. Firstly I think the overall milk price would be lower if we were all paid out of one pot. Secondly I can’t find any evidence of greater stability in the past, having the MMB did not shield the uk industry from market forces.

 

[som farmer]

I am still quite idealistic in my little centrist utopian world. But two things spring to mind. Firstly I think the overall milk price would be lower if we were all paid out of one pot. Secondly I can’t find any evidence of greater stability in the past, having the MMB did not shield the uk industry from market forces.

the present system requires a good kick into touch, and remodelling, but, unless someone forces change, it isn't going to happen, its to much on the buyers side. For us to thrive, we have to reduce our COP, because, other than shortages, there is no incentive, by retailers for change. Again, our price is linked to global price, regardless of amount traded, or price, or even fairness, the big retailers use that price as a lever. The best hope for change, is for the number of processors, to reduce, and then, hope, they have some leverage, to influence price, whether they would, is doubtful.

 

[Cowabunga]

I've had my April milk payment today and it is near enough 12p/l.
The last time I had that price was in May 1980.

That is exactly 40 years ago. Needless to say that this is heartbreaking.

 

[Alex72]

the present system requires a good kick into touch, and remodelling, but, unless someone forces change, it isn't going to happen, its to much on the buyers side. For us to thrive, we have to reduce our COP, because, other than shortages, there is no incentive, by retailers for change. Again, our price is linked to global price, regardless of amount traded, or price, or even fairness, the big retailers use that price as a lever. The best hope for change, is for the number of processors, to reduce, and then, hope, they have some leverage, to influence price, whether they would, is doubtful.

You maybe right, but we’ve a lot less processors now than we had a few years ago.

Muller took over liquid division of Dairy Crest to take out competition (described as a weak player by Muller at the time). Did that make any difference?

If taking weak players out of the market place worked, it would’ve been sorted out after DFOB etc.

Way forward must be for processors to have more added value products that the consumers are willing to pay extra for and to have a more diverse spread of products so milk can be diverted from liquid to cheese, butter, powder etc.

 

[betweenthelines]

Afterwards the OFT reported that they could find no evidence that price rises had been passed on to the farmers.

My post on the subject was to point out that most large processors have "form" for working together to manipulate milk prices. A monopoly by any other name is still a monopoly.

 

[som farmer]

You maybe right, but we’ve a lot less processors now than we had a few years ago.

Muller took over liquid division of Dairy Crest to take out competition (described as a weak player by Muller at the time). Did that make any difference?

If taking weak players out of the market place worked, it would’ve been sorted out after DFOB etc.

Way forward must be for processors to have more added value products that the consumers are willing to pay extra for and to have a more diverse spread of products so milk can be diverted from liquid to cheese, butter, powder etc.

quite a few of the lesser players, they just quote to get business, and drop the price, no morals, and big pension pots, and bonuses. Quite right about added value products, this mess was caused by lack of.

 

[betweenthelines]

I have neither the time or energy to be bothered with answering this. If that’s what you want to think then fine by me. Talk to any milk buyer and this is used as a perfect example of price fixing, even though it was all done in good faith but I can assure you the fines were felt big time by the various companies and it is something that will never be repeated.

Well, my information is that at least one Processor couldn't pay the fine quick enough as they thought £6 million was getting off lightly. Perhaps the man made a wise decision as it didn't dent their profits.

 

[Tarw Coch]

Well, my information is that at least one Processor couldn't pay the fine quick enough as they thought £6 million was getting off lightly. Perhaps the man made a wise decision as it didn't dent their profits.

Haven’t a clue who this man who was wise might have been but if he’d got a lot of farmer suppliers, say 2,000 for example that would be the equivalent of £3,000 per farm and if they averaged 1 million litres production it would be the equivalent of 0.3ppl across all milk bought over a year, not that much in the grand scheme of things and probably an amount that could be held back without farmers even realising, it would hardly make a massive difference in their standing in the milk price league table.

BTW, didn’t one buyer turn evidence over to the monopolies commission in return for immunity from prosecution?