Covid jab - is it compulsory?

[bobk]

not what I was told at the time - it was about vaccinating to protect others by reducing spread, if you don't get it (or reduce chances of getting it) you cant give it to others can you

if its about protecting me I will not bother in the future, as I keep saying (quite factually) the risk to me is tiny, there are far more things likely to kill me than covid

Indeed , but the herd immunity theory has been blown out the window since xmas

 

[SilliamWhale]

Indeed , but the herd immunity theory has been blown out the window since xmas

There is no other option but herd immunity, what else do we have? Every other virus we've ever had has petered out to become part of the circulation

 

[bobk]

There is no other option but herd immunity, what else do we have? Every other virus we've ever had has petered out to become part of the circulation

Herd immunity doesn't work with this virus

 

[SilliamWhale]

Herd immunity doesn't work with this virus

Do you not think?

 

[bobk]

Do you not think?

Plenty getting infected 2 and 3 times .

 

[SilliamWhale]

Plenty getting infected 2 and 3 times .

Yeah but look at the level of testing and level of scrutiny going on. We've never done this level of micro managing before. Every cold is "covid"

 

[bobk]

Yeah but look at the level of testing and level of scrutiny going on. We've never done this level of micro managing before. Every cold is "covid"

Mine wasn't , don't want that again

 

[Highland Mule]

I said the odds of a child dying were stupidly small (which they indeed are)

PLEASE stop misquoting me

the stats show ZERO risk to under 9yr olds -

 

[Clive]

I still see no mention of me suggesting or ever saying "1 in a Billion" @Highland Mule ?

You are wrong and you need to apologise for your ridiculous miss-quote

 

[Clive]

Indeed , but the herd immunity theory has been blown out the window since xmas

not sure that's correct but i'm no virus expert - fact was this was never going to go away and was always going to be juts another in a long list of viruses we have to live with and very sadly watch some die of

 

[Clive]

Sorry Clive, but that’s a disingenuous. You didn’t quote but you did claim. You claimed that the risk was (from memory) one on a billion - clearly fabricated hyperbole and not factual. I called you out at the time and you conceded it was wrong. If I had time I’d go back to search but right now I’m lambing and calving so will have to pass.

This post requires apology, remember that thread about knowing when to admit you are wrong ? You have published in public that I claimed something (quite ridiculous). That was not the case and although in a previous post you found amusing I may not be able to spell Libel I do know what it looks like

I will accept your apology and we can move on (topic)

I have not commented on Covid much at all really, it's not a subject I claim to know a lot about, I can see the government and media reactions have a lot of bad consequences that we will all live with for years and I was vocal about schools closing as I felt that was utterly inexcusable at the time and now think it was definitely necessary given the risk / tiny effect its had on children . I got vaccinated as soon as was posible, not because I ever felt at risk but out of concern for others and I believed vaccination would help and het things back to normal as soon a posible

I have never feared Covid (and have had it 3 times without issue now ) but have been in fear of the consequences of how its been dealt with ever since the first day of the first lockdown

 

[Highland Mule]

If I had time I’d go back to search but right now I’m lambing and calving so will have to pass.

This post requires apology, remember that thread about knowing when to admit you are wrong ?

Your search system is poor, I can’t find the quote and as I wrote earlier I am somewhat busy with lambing and calving so haven’t time to look through all your or mine posts but I remember quite clearly you claiming a stupidly low number. As I wrote before, I called you out at the time and (my memory is less clear but I seem to recall) you conceded it wasn’t a real number.

I’ve also found very quickly one place where you claim the risk is zero to one group, something you accused me of misquoting you over too. So feel free to apologise for that accusation at your earliest.

As you wrote, time to move on.

 

[Highland Mule]

this really is no big deal for 99.99999999 % of the population.

I’ve found the quote. My memory was out by one order of magnitude, but as I wrote in post 421 it was a ludicrously low number with no substance.

Your apology will be accepted when given and I’m going back to checking my ewes.

 

[primmiemoo]

The only data I have ever given consideration to is UK as thats where my children live and go to school, what % of children under 10 died of covid in the UK ? and I mean ones that didn't already have serious or significant health issues get run over by a bus within 28 days of their positive result ?


now tell me how many have late diagnosis of serious illness due to not seeing a GP sooner ? or have long term mental health issue ? or will suffer academically ? or who didn't get fed properly at home ?


schools and GP's should never have been closed

UNICEF does consider the UK in its remit. Children are children, and all that.
The decision to close schools was based on first principle ~ curbing transmission of virus brought about by movements, without which breaking point pressure would have been put on hospitals. When brought in, nobody knew the novel virus's pattern beyond events in those countries hit first.

What has happened in education since since has been political, and very much highlights weaknesses both in the existing system, and the political ethos of the present government towards education. Some oik who had charge of Education until last year got knighted recently. His decisions on what happened in schools on his watch are behind many current academic issues. Many of the rest stem from social weaknesses in family and community.

So, so many of those deeply saddening outcomes for wider health at individual level stemming from this pandemic are because of a legacy of poor staffing levels, and long-term underinvestment in health ~ right down to a lack of affordable housing for medical staff coming into the NHS. The NHS wasn't completely overwhelmed, but it has come close. It's still under pressure. Can't just wipe everything off and start again, like a failed crop.

Of course, I suppose to some, looking out for number one tribalism has had a big spotlight shone upon them... They'll probably vote for more of the same when it comes to.

 

[primmiemoo]

There is no other option but herd immunity, what else do we have? Every other virus we've ever had has petered out to become part of the circulation

Oh come on! You're more intelligent than that.

 

[SilliamWhale]

Oh come on! You're more intelligent than that.

What? You know that now Covid is a nasty cold. It will soon become less of a nasty cold, next time I get it the probability will be it will be less severe than last time as immunity builds.

What do you think we should be doing? Masks don't work, social distancing doesn't work, lockdowns at best do more harm. Vaccines are of benefit maybe but that benefit doesn't last requiring repeated injections which is quite experimental.

What is it you are wanting to happen? Why do you think big government can solve it? Why is there still no increase in health capacity if you think the govt think it's as terrible disease as you do?

 

[Clive]

I’ve found the quote. My memory was out by one order of magnitude, but as I wrote in post 421 it was a ludicrously low number with no substance.

Your apology will be accepted when given and I’m going back to checking my ewes.

that is not “ one in a billion are at risk”. - again you misquote me

Covid has been no big deal for the vast majority and almost inconsequential medically for children the age of my own - what % have died from covid that wouldn’t have died of something else ? …….. a truly tiny percentage is the answer

my post looks to have been pretty perceptive given its timing early in the pandemic when we knew a lot less than we do now - closing school was a big mistake and totally unnecessary it has turned out and the media were presenting stats to scare people / cause unnecessary over reaction

risk to british children is and always was utterly inconceivably small

 

[Highland Mule]

that is not “ in a billion are at risk”. - again you misquote me

Covid has been no big deal for the vast majority and almost inconsequential medically for children the age of my own - what % have died from covid that wouldn’t have died of something else ? …….. a truly tiny percentage is the answer

So if it’s “no big deal” for “99.99999999%” of the population, what number in a billion are at risk then, it must be less.

Just accept that what you wrote them was a ludicrously low number with no basis in fact, as I stated in post 421:

a ludicrously low number that had no basis in fact and I corrected you on it. I’d do the same again, as reality is always preferable to hyperbole. Whilst I agree that some media reporting has shown a lack of understanding of the basis of risk, it’s nowhere near as bad as that seen on here in my professional opinion.

 

[Northernlights]

that is not “ one in a billion are at risk”. - again you misquote me

Covid has been no big deal for the vast majority and almost inconsequential medically for children the age of my own - what % have died from covid that wouldn’t have died of something else ? …….. a truly tiny percentage is the answer

my post looks to have been pretty perceptive given its timing early in the pandemic when we knew a lot less than we do now - closing school was a big mistake and totally unnecessary it has turned out and the media were presenting stats to scare people / cause unnecessary over reaction

risk to british children is and always was utterly inconceivably small

In my own area about 10% of the people I know who have contracted the virus end up with long term issues .As well as my accountant with 25% less lung function my factor got it from his kids at Christmas and was very ill in spite of 3 vaccinations. When I met him in February he still had extreme fatigue issues and looked as white as a sheet. This is someone who was a keen mountain biker. No one is going to convince me that is not a bit of a lottery as to how an individuals body reacts to it.
Once the GPs return to full face to face consultations will I believe all risks with getting it are over.Surely GPs are all young enough to get the virus multiple times and not have any after effects.

 

[primmiemoo]

What? You know that now Covid is a nasty cold. It will soon become less of a nasty cold, next time I get it the probability will be it will be less severe than last time as immunity builds.

What do you think we should be doing? Masks don't work, social distancing doesn't work, lockdowns at best do more harm. Vaccines are of benefit maybe but that benefit doesn't last requiring repeated injections which is quite experimental.

What is it you are wanting to happen? Why do you think big government can solve it? Why is there still no increase in health capacity if you think the govt think it's as terrible disease as you do?

Covid isn't a nasty cold. We're just lucky that, with our individual immunity trained by vaccination or by being fortunate enough not to be harmed by having encountered Covid without having been vaccinated, this currently dominant variant seems less troublesome than its predecessors. It's still killing people. With luck there won't be a new variant that isn't like that, but it isn't guaranteed.

The pandemic is not over. SARS-CoV-2 has consequences for health for everyone who catches it. Vaccines continue to be vital to reduce negative effects of catching covid. Just a few weeks of leeway brought about by further vaccination could make all the difference to somebody's quality of life. Roll on needle-free administration of vaccination. It's only manufacture of the means of delivery that's holding it back.

What is so difficult to understand about the need for individual citizens to exercise personal responsibility for their own health and not to compromise that of those around them? What's so difficult to understand about the need for individuals as an electorate to weed out those in government who put their own and their mates' business interests first, and the welfare of the population well below that? In an ideal world, health provision per head of population would be small, brilliantly precise, and extremely agile, because the population takes care of itself at individual and social level. Easycare humans, if you will.