DD turnips into permanent pasture without glyphosate

[Andyt880]

I am thinking of getting 4 acres of old grass land Direct drilled with turnips after second cut silage.
Winters are wet here and land wouldn’t be the lightest but this would be one of my driest fields in winter. Never grazed a forage crop over winter here before.

I am wondering would I get away with not burning off the grass if I got the turnips in as soon as the grass is lifted off the field? My thinking is if there was a grass bottom in it then it should carry a lot better in wet times, but maybe the grass regrowth would smother out the turnips?
It would likely need a few runs with a grass harrow before drilling to get the old thatch out of the bottom a bit.

 

[Kevtherev]

Won’t be that successful as the grass will smother the turnip seedlings and compete for nutrients unfortunately.

 

[Andyt880]

Another thought I had was spraying the grass off with a weak mix of glyphosate, would it die off enough to let the turnips establish and then green up again later and maintain the soil cover?
The field will be ploughed and reseeded the following spring so not worried about getting rid of all weeds etc at this stage

 

[Two Tone]

My neighbour has similar thoughts of planting Stubble turnips after a 1st cut of Italian Ryegrass silage that is on the deck now.
My thoughts are that he ought to let the grass green up again before he puts Roundup on it or it won’t work.

What sort of rate of 360 Roundup do you think he should use?

He wants to DD it into the grass.

Could he DD it, then spray it up to a week later?

Any ideas @Warnesworth ?

 

[neilo]

My neighbour has similar thoughts of planting Stubble turnips after a 1st cut of Italian Ryegrass silage that is on the deck now.
My thoughts are that he ought to let the grass green up again before he puts Roundup on it or it won’t work.

What sort of rate of 360 Roundup do you think he should use?

He wants to DD it into the grass.

Could he DD it, then spray it up to a week later?

Any ideas @Warnesworth ?

Turnips would be germinating in a few days with the bit of moisture in the soil, so he wouldn’t want to wait for a week. Ok the day after drilling though.

 

[neilo]

Another thought I had was spraying the grass off with a weak mix of glyphosate, would it die off enough to let the turnips establish and then green up again later and maintain the soil cover?
The field will be ploughed and reseeded the following spring so not worried about getting rid of all weeds etc at this stage

It would depend on the grass. If it’s all young reseeded grasses and annual meadow grass then a low rate will kill them. If it’s couch & bent grasses then it would take a stiff rate to kill them.

As @Kevtherev posted, the regrowing grass will compete for nutrients and smother out the turnips. Spray it off and you will still get a few weed grasses coming in the bottom I expect.

 

[Badshot]

Roundup it or it will fail.
The turnips won't out compete the grass.
Some mega fast rape or kale might to an extent though.
I'd still kill the grass, it'll green up anyway from the seed bank.

 

[Derrick Hughes]

My neighbour has similar thoughts of planting Stubble turnips after a 1st cut of Italian Ryegrass silage that is on the deck now.
My thoughts are that he ought to let the grass green up again before he puts Roundup on it or it won’t work.

What sort of rate of 360 Roundup do you think he should use?

He wants to DD it into the grass.

Could he DD it, then spray it up to a week later?

Any ideas @Warnesworth ?

8f oz acre , it works on grass seed but not tried on turnips or rape

 

[tr250]

@Andyt880 im presuming this is to create a break so it’s temporary grass to go into gs4 or similar? I’d glyphosate after drilling

 

[Courier]

Best use the Gly. 5 or 6 days before mowing ... Needs to be green to absorb.

Used to do this after second cut with paraquat 24 hours after direct cut silage before going to the Royal Show - Works well for late summer forage grazing - Or into the autumn / winter.

 

[Andyt880]

It would depend on the grass. If it’s all young reseeded grasses and annual meadow grass then a low rate will kill them. If it’s couch & bent grasses then it would take a stiff rate to kill them.

As @Kevtherev posted, the regrowing grass will compete for nutrients and smother out the turnips. Spray it off and you will still get a few weed grasses coming in the bottom I expect.

I’d say the grass is 40/50 years old in it so I’d say it’s all weed grass. It is a slow growing grass but very thick in the bottom, you wouldn’t see any bare soil like you would in a young ley

 

[Andyt880]

@Andyt880 im presuming this is to create a break so it’s temporary grass to go into gs4 or similar? I’d glyphosate after drilling

I’m thinking of it as a break crop before reseeding the old pasture and to give me some wintering for ewes over winter. Not sure what gs4 is. In NI here, things a bit different here to say the least.

 

[Derrick Hughes]

I’d say the grass is 40/50 years old in it so I’d say it’s all weed grass. It is a slow growing grass but very thick in the bottom, you wouldn’t see any bare soil like you would in a young ley

If your going for a full kill defo spray before mowing ,mow low you will have some bare soil

 

[neilo]

I’d say the grass is 40/50 years old in it so I’d say it’s all weed grass. It is a slow growing grass but very thick in the bottom, you wouldn’t see any bare soil like you would in a young ley

We have a lot of that here, but slowly sorting some of it. It does carry stock well when it’s wet though, unlike reseeded ground, so it has a value.

It will want a full rate of 5-6L/ha of glyphosate (in rainwater/conditioned water, not hard/mains) ime, and some will still try to come back. If I want a clean kill I put full rate on as above, then leave a month, before applying another 2L to finish off the regrowth.

 

[Courier]

An alternative would be to use a 90 degree bladed rotovator (Not the SPEED Blades) and chop the grass off between it's growing point and the root system at around 25mm (1 inch) deep then direct drill into the firm ground beneath the little bit of tilth.
I used to do this with an 80" Howard rotavator on a DB780 using appropriate gear selection.

 

[exmoor dave]

I’d say the grass is 40/50 years old in it so I’d say it’s all weed grass. It is a slow growing grass but very thick in the bottom, you wouldn’t see any bare soil like you would in a young ley

With a crop of forage rape put in last august, into old PP, where the drill over ran on to unsprayed grass, the brassica did come up and looked quite good & quite promising, but it got to about 3" high and just stayed like that till we grazed in march

 

[Andyt880]

We have a lot of that here, but slowly sorting some of it. It does carry stock well when it’s wet though, unlike reseeded ground, so it has a value.

It will want a full rate of 5-6L/ha of glyphosate (in rainwater/conditioned water, not hard/mains) ime, and some will still try to come back. If I want a clean kill I put full rate on as above, then leave a month, before applying another 2L to finish off the regrowth.

Yes it certainly does carry well. I will be going for the full kill after the turnips before reseeding with grass. At this stage I would like to keep as much of the old grass as possible with out stunting the turnips. Hopefully it would keep it from becoming a mud bath when grazing later

 

[Andyt880]

With a crop of forage rape put in last august, into old PP, where the drill over ran on to unsprayed grass, the brassica did come up and looked quite good & quite promising, but it got to about 3" high and just stayed like that till we grazed in march

Do you think the grass chocked the rape on the unsprayed bits?

 

[Andyt880]

Also just to add, I’ve never had a crop direct drilled before, never grazed brassicas in winter and I’m also fairly new to growing brassicas so all other advice is welcome.
I intend leaving a few bales of silage in the field when I’m sowing it to save trying to get it into them during winter.

 

[neilo]

Also just to add, I’ve never had a crop direct drilled before, never grazed brassicas in winter and I’m also fairly new to growing brassicas so all other advice is welcome.
I intend leaving a few bales of silage in the field when I’m sowing it to save trying to get it into them during winter.

What will you be grazing it with? I never feed bales to sheep on crops as it just gives them an area to congregate and get plastered. They stay much cleaner, and do less poaching, if they just have crop.

It might be different if you have light land, but certainly not here.