Not defending rt but that's a fairly serious accusations,have you any proof of this happening
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Farm Assurance - Poll
- Thread starter Wooly
- Start date
matthew
Member
- Location
- Cornwall, SW England
It's all about 'risk'. And from that, possible litigation.
The stock have to have so much room, so much straw, so much water ... but that is a paper exercise. No one ever measures. Some rarely look.
The rules on effluent and disposal of everything from plastics to fallen stock to spray cans, meds and movement are all covered in reams of documentation. Even any contractors who work for us have to have their inside leg measurement written somewhere on those RT reports.
So when a retailer gets a complaint, that can filter down to ....... us.
Except that it does not. It may filter down to the stock or grain which filled a 25 ton batch, processed on a certain day. If you're unlucky.
And how does the consumer know where that ghastly extruded fat which wraps around a certain retailer's RT beef joints comes from? I believe it used to be imported from France.
And all that paperwork hasn't protected the UK consumer from 'horsegate' or the current Brazilian rotten meat scandals.
The stock have to have so much room, so much straw, so much water ... but that is a paper exercise. No one ever measures. Some rarely look.
The rules on effluent and disposal of everything from plastics to fallen stock to spray cans, meds and movement are all covered in reams of documentation. Even any contractors who work for us have to have their inside leg measurement written somewhere on those RT reports.
So when a retailer gets a complaint, that can filter down to ....... us.
Except that it does not. It may filter down to the stock or grain which filled a 25 ton batch, processed on a certain day. If you're unlucky.
And how does the consumer know where that ghastly extruded fat which wraps around a certain retailer's RT beef joints comes from? I believe it used to be imported from France.
And all that paperwork hasn't protected the UK consumer from 'horsegate' or the current Brazilian rotten meat scandals.
- Location
- Ceredigion
Worse
Someone who is not assured shows he is intelligent and forward thinking not driven by the extra 1p he was promised as he knew it was a con. This type of farmer takes a pride in what he does
Tarw Coch
Member
- Location
- Bottom of Wats Dyke
I doubt wether there's any hard and fast rule, im sure there's good and bad on both sides of the FA fence.
- Location
- cornwall
Here's what Mr Handley thinks about red tractor, I tend to agree!
WESTERN DAILY PRESS 2/9/2017
FARMING SEPTEMBER 2 DAVID HANDLEY COLUMN
I’ve just had a glossy, 50-page, lavishly-produced booklet through the post, courtesy of Red Tractor Assurance.
When I have nothing better to do I will sit down and read it - though at first glance I can’t see a time coming within the next 20 years when there won’t be better things to do. Like polishing the number plate on the tractor, or checking the cat for fleas.
I was sent it because I am, apparently, a member of the Red Tractor Assurance Scheme though frankly, for all the good that that has done me I might as well be a member of my local WI. At least I could have learned flower arranging.
Anyway, its purpose apparently, is to inform me that every three years a team of farmers, retailers, vets and other industry “experts” (my quotation marks, not theirs) meets to review farm standards and ensure they come up to what the consumers want and expect.
All very commendable. Even though, as the covering letter goes on to explain, the newly-revised standards are going to require some people to change the way they run their farms.
I’m sure that won’t be a problem. Farmers, after all have plenty of time on their hands these days. And they are always ready to welcome with overflowing enthusiasm suggestion from non-farmers, such as vets, retailers and the all-important consultants (most of who based on personal experience, I wouldn’t consult about the time of day) on how to run their businesses more efficiently, more profitably and with all due attention paid to welfare.
Quite what the reaction would be if I marched into my local branch of Tesco, told the manager he was doing it all wrong and produced my own detailed plan for running his store I’m not sure. Any more than I can say how my vet would react if I wrote to him and told him he needed to run his business in line with customer expectations so here was a list of improvements.
As to the suggestions for reinforcing the assurance criteria I am confused. Advice to the effect that silage must be stored so as not to cause pollution and that a permanent supply of clean water should be provided via clean troughs would seem utterly superfluous.
But I am now told I have to carry out risk assessments of watercourses and non-target species before putting down rat bait. I should have a map of the farm showing where all the buildings are – presumably in case I forget. And I must neither tether my cattle all year round nor use anything but non-abrasive material for halters. Well if I did tether them all year round I wouldn’t be able to get them into the parlour. And what do they think I use for halters – barbed wire?
When the Red Tractor scheme was launched and we were all invited along we listened to the then Prime Minister telling us what a wonderful thing it would be and what fantastic benefits we would draw from it once we signed up to and abided by the assurance rules.
Twenty years down the line I’m still waiting. Large sections of the public still don’t know what the Red Tractor means – or if they do that it can be applied to imported food if produced to British standards - and as a marketing tool it is about as effective as sticking the smiley face of Count Dracula on a packet of black pudding.
Meanwhile after 20 years of doing damn-all Red Tractor Assurance has become yet another quango occupied by the “experts” who know less about farming than the people they are dictating their wonderful standards to.
I have a message for its new chief executive, Jim Moseley. Welcome to the gravy train. First class accommodation is at the front.
ends
WESTERN DAILY PRESS 2/9/2017
FARMING SEPTEMBER 2 DAVID HANDLEY COLUMN
I’ve just had a glossy, 50-page, lavishly-produced booklet through the post, courtesy of Red Tractor Assurance.
When I have nothing better to do I will sit down and read it - though at first glance I can’t see a time coming within the next 20 years when there won’t be better things to do. Like polishing the number plate on the tractor, or checking the cat for fleas.
I was sent it because I am, apparently, a member of the Red Tractor Assurance Scheme though frankly, for all the good that that has done me I might as well be a member of my local WI. At least I could have learned flower arranging.
Anyway, its purpose apparently, is to inform me that every three years a team of farmers, retailers, vets and other industry “experts” (my quotation marks, not theirs) meets to review farm standards and ensure they come up to what the consumers want and expect.
All very commendable. Even though, as the covering letter goes on to explain, the newly-revised standards are going to require some people to change the way they run their farms.
I’m sure that won’t be a problem. Farmers, after all have plenty of time on their hands these days. And they are always ready to welcome with overflowing enthusiasm suggestion from non-farmers, such as vets, retailers and the all-important consultants (most of who based on personal experience, I wouldn’t consult about the time of day) on how to run their businesses more efficiently, more profitably and with all due attention paid to welfare.
Quite what the reaction would be if I marched into my local branch of Tesco, told the manager he was doing it all wrong and produced my own detailed plan for running his store I’m not sure. Any more than I can say how my vet would react if I wrote to him and told him he needed to run his business in line with customer expectations so here was a list of improvements.
As to the suggestions for reinforcing the assurance criteria I am confused. Advice to the effect that silage must be stored so as not to cause pollution and that a permanent supply of clean water should be provided via clean troughs would seem utterly superfluous.
But I am now told I have to carry out risk assessments of watercourses and non-target species before putting down rat bait. I should have a map of the farm showing where all the buildings are – presumably in case I forget. And I must neither tether my cattle all year round nor use anything but non-abrasive material for halters. Well if I did tether them all year round I wouldn’t be able to get them into the parlour. And what do they think I use for halters – barbed wire?
When the Red Tractor scheme was launched and we were all invited along we listened to the then Prime Minister telling us what a wonderful thing it would be and what fantastic benefits we would draw from it once we signed up to and abided by the assurance rules.
Twenty years down the line I’m still waiting. Large sections of the public still don’t know what the Red Tractor means – or if they do that it can be applied to imported food if produced to British standards - and as a marketing tool it is about as effective as sticking the smiley face of Count Dracula on a packet of black pudding.
Meanwhile after 20 years of doing damn-all Red Tractor Assurance has become yet another quango occupied by the “experts” who know less about farming than the people they are dictating their wonderful standards to.
I have a message for its new chief executive, Jim Moseley. Welcome to the gravy train. First class accommodation is at the front.
ends
gone up the hill
Member
- Location
- Devon
Im no fan of David Handley but he is bang on the nail with this article.
Yes and I am sure @Guy Smith will agree
I wouldn't describe myself as a 'fan' of David Handley but I've met him a few times and quite liked the bloke.
- Location
- Romney Marsh
Answered like a Politician.........diverting from the facts about the distain of RT by your members !!
deleted user 837354
Member
How is it, that with farm assurance in existence, there are still hell hole farms in existence? Isn't that the point of farm assurance, to let the public know their product came from somewhere with enhanced environmental and animal welfare standards?
They have to make changes now and then I suppose to justify their vast salaries. Or should I say justify the salaries to them selves. In reality after 20 years the system should be in place for it to all but run itself and there is no excuse for stupid consultants, fancy job titles, or the ridiculous salaries handed out to these leeches.
Answered like a Politician.........diverting from the facts about the distain of RT by your members !!
Or maybe, like @Henarar , I havent lost my sense of humour
PS - I must work out how you add the little yellow face banging his face against the wall. It seems all the rage on here.
but do you agree with what he wrote above ?
Some of it but not all of it.
How about you?
As is the ashamed and embarrassed to have joined the Red Tractor scheme little yellow face...
he is not far out
If RT was sort after by consumers [and it could be] farmers would be falling over themselves to join and threads like this would read a whole lot different
Tarw Coch
Member
- Location
- Bottom of Wats Dyke
Just above where you write your reply there is a couple of rows of symbols, the bottom left one is a smiley face. Click on that and a range of them will appear at the bottom of the page, just click on the ones you want.
At least that's how it works on my phone.
- Location
- cornwall
I agree with a lot of what David says, the current RT seems more belittling every year and an insult to my intelligence. But on the other hand we do need something to back up our claims of having the worlds highest production standards
- Location
- Montgomeryshire
We do, it's called Cross Compliance. No need for anything more, nobody has demanded it, or is willing to pay extra for it.
