Exactly .
Fred Dibnah laddering a chimney
- Thread starter Clive
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davedb
Member
- Location
- Staffordshire
Plenty of rock climbers don’t use a harness and haven’t got a ladder, I’m not saying I’d do what Fred did but at the end of the day it was his choice he wasn’t goin hurt anyone if he did fall off it’s not like he had employees doing it the same way as him
Hilly
Member
- Location
- Scottish Borders.
Have you even been up a ladder ? I doubt it , yet you criticise a dead man who spent a life time up a very big ladder and never had an accident , their is a stupid man involved here and he ain’t called Fred . Now be a good boy and away and iron your corduroys tomorrow is school day.
falling 400ft would have hurt more so good job you were a tractor driver and not Fred’s apprentice !
- Location
- Scottish Highlands
The laws are different for recreation than for profession, and even then most climbers don’t go very high if they’re free climbing.
As for not hurting anyone - perhaps not physically, but he was married, I think, plus some poor sod would have had to mop up the mess he left behind.
HSE have no jurisdiction over sole traders .
probably hurt less
Hilly
Member
- Location
- Scottish Borders.
If their were more like Fred the world would be a better place for sure.
- Location
- North Wales
Fred was doing that climbing, 30-40 years ago when hse wasn't heard off and people have the audacity to say he was taking risks.
That's how life was back then, it was a job. He must have been pretty good at it as he got on telly and didn't die from it. You can't tar his actions then by today's rules.
There weren't any harnesses when they built the chimneys and there weren't any harnesses when he dismantled them. It's a different world we life in today. He would have filled in no end of paper work before dressing in his hi Viz and hard hat in today's world.
That's how life was back then, it was a job. He must have been pretty good at it as he got on telly and didn't die from it. You can't tar his actions then by today's rules.
There weren't any harnesses when they built the chimneys and there weren't any harnesses when he dismantled them. It's a different world we life in today. He would have filled in no end of paper work before dressing in his hi Viz and hard hat in today's world.
- Location
- Scottish Highlands
Who told you that ?
(It’s wrong, by the way. There are no exemptions for sole traders whatsoever. A very select group of self employed are exempt from some HSE law, but that group specifically excludes Agriculture and Cobstruction.)
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- Location
- Scottish Highlands
The court case I quoted earlier was from 1947. HSE was founded 1975. IOSH was formed 1945. Swami harnesses have been around since the 1960s and other styles before that. Common sense has been around a lot longer.
Seriously, why would you not use a harness and rope when doing that sort of work? Maybe he just missed their ready avaiłability, but nobody should countenance doing similar work without one now.
Hilly
Member
- Location
- Scottish Borders.
Maybe he knew he didn’t need a harness , which he didn’t.
- Location
- Scottish Highlands
Legally, since 1947, we have been obliged to do all that is reasonably practicable to reduce risks to ourselves and others.
Actually, my mistake. It was 1949.
- Location
- North Wales
Was wearing a harness a legal requirement?
- Location
- Scottish Highlands
See my response immediately above. HSE law is rarely that prescriptive.
Hilly
Member
- Location
- Scottish Borders.
He knew he didn’t need one so didn’t need one.
- Location
- North Wales
But was he or not breaking the law for not wearing a harness?
- Location
- Scottish Highlands
I don’t have access to all the facts, and I’m not a judge, but I’d say he probably was breaking the Health and Safety at Work Act (assuming it happened post 1974 when the act was introduced). But standards were poorer then, and I wouldn’t criticise him for what he did - I just couldn’t countenance it being done now.
Would you be able to argue confidently in court that he’d taken all reasonably practicable measures to reduce the risks, when he didn’t have a harness? I certainly wouldn’t.
its always the same along comes mr health and safety and the thread gets ruined
startinghandle
Member
I am sure if Fred could read this he would say can't people find better things to do
also I know a young guy that works for environmental agency who has to follow strict rules when using chainsaw and other equipment but when he uses chainsaw for his weekend firewood business he doesn't use any safety equipment and I am sure a large number on this site do not follow safety procedures and I am one of them as I wrote here back in the summer
also I know a young guy that works for environmental agency who has to follow strict rules when using chainsaw and other equipment but when he uses chainsaw for his weekend firewood business he doesn't use any safety equipment and I am sure a large number on this site do not follow safety procedures and I am one of them as I wrote here back in the summer
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