Grant to help with cost of diverting footpath?

[Filthyfarmer]

I feel sure someone will object. Money well spent otherwise.

I think you are right, every area has one. Our local serial objector stopped/objected to any alteration because he could !!
He's dead now and his son has taken over the crusade..........

 

[milkloss]

Some moron from the Isle of Wight will object saying they walk it regularly and moving it will fundamentally ruin the enjoyment of the footpath.

 

[Landrover]

In my view if people object they should bear some kind of cost for dealing with objection to deter those objecting for no good reason.

I totally agree with this, especially planning objections apart from the official bodies that can object there should be a fee for commenting on an planning application, it would stop the nimbys with nothing better to do that object to planning applications!

 

[Boysground]

Something has or is changing in legislation according to the council. I don’t think their objections will necessarily be upheld as elf n safety has more clout. At least one local path I know of has been successfully diverted round a farmyard.
I guess it’s a case of how lucky do I feel but I resent taking all the risk and cost for what really is a public benefit. As far as I’m concerned. I’m satisfied that I’ve done what I can with the permissive path diversion and as long as I close it for one day a year it cannot become permanent though I’d hardly care if it did as I’d prefer people to use it.

I have a permissive path like that not really worth the hassle of me shutting it.

Have another which has been in the wrong place for decades, I know it’s wrong, the council know it’s wrong, they can’t afford to sort it i don’t want it moved so after the last meeting we are both keep our heads down.

Bg

 

[robs1]

I would just make it difficult to use the proper path with good signs to your preferred route. Most sensible people will use your route, idiots will use the real one just because they can and will be the ones to object, .
We have a cross field path and I just don't cut the hedge back so makes it difficult to use everyone uses the better round the field way, council footpath warden is happy as I let people walk round the outside of most fields, all but two of our fields have paths, always get the odd knob but most walkers tell them off

 

[Nearly]

One former neighbour applied to move a footpath from a grass paddock around the cowsheds into an arable one. One d**kh**d on local facebook group tried to drum up objections to the move, tagging the ramblers etc. I waded into the 'discussion' asking where were the objector and ramblers assoc. when the dog walker was killed on that footpath 6 months previously.
The footpath move went ahead.

 

[theboytheboy]

Is there one?
All we want to do is divert a public footpath round instead of it going the middle of our farmyard. Everybody thinks it’s a good idea for health and safety and to provide a pleasanter walk. The problem is the council want £3125 plus a bit and we can’t really afford it esiecially as there’s always the slight risk that somebody will object, costs escalate and we lose all the payment for nothing.
So in my mind the diversion is a “public good” so where’s the public money for the public good and why should I as a private business be stumping all the cost and taking all the risk to deliver this public good?

I've been making this argument for years now.

I will happily create additional footpath length, with a better surface, no gates, stiles etc if I can divert the one through our yard.

Health and safety is not considered a good reason as far as I could see last time I looked. Our council are not taking diversion requests at all at present.

I really believe there could be miles more better quality footpaths created if the incentive to landowners was to be able to divert cross field footpaths and ones running through yards etc.

Win win for all apart from the ludites

 

[som farmer]

we had a footpath through our buildings, not really a problem, hardly ever used. That was, until the local footpath official decided to get involved.

she was a right #####, just stirred everything up. Including telling us, we would have to take buildings down, that had been up for 40+ yrs, as they crossed the footpath. Some heated conversations followed, and she was told to ####off.

next move, she returned with her manager, who was perfectly sensible, and, after he had told her to go and sit in the car, out of the way, we agreed an alternative route, around the buildings, and temporary foot path signs erected, before we officially applied to move it.

that's when the 'fun' started, the 'new' route, had to be much better than the old path, or the ramblers would object, they would oppose anyway. The costs were escalating dramatically.

so l did nothing, signs were up for temp path. And l found a legal loophole, where it should have been referred to parliament, before the 1955 definitive foot path maps were done.
Basically, parliament was named as executors of an estate, back in pre ww1, when the male side went off to war, none came back, therefore parliament had to agree it.

the only argument they had against that, was a claim the yards were not gated

and never heard another thing.

 

[Kidds]

As said earlier, it is money well spent.
You may get along with everyone now but what to do when for some unexpected reason the traffic massively increases and you no longer get along with them all?
If you come to sell it will be worth more without the path through the yard.
I also begrudged paying for it but don't regret it in the slightest.

 

[zero]

A neighbour used to have a foopath through his yard which was just big enough to fit a tractor and rotor spreader in. He decided it wanted diverting round the back of his buildings so just moved the stile to the other side of his barn.
The overall footpath line was roughly the same and nobody has ever noticed or complained..

 

[Doing it for the kids]

Been in identical situation 5yrs ago. Dad moved the path which was semi adopted but unofficially.

The risk you have is then creating two public rights of way.

Took us 5 yrs and 5k but well worth it

Can you make a permissive path around your yard, then install a nice sign that says "please use the permissive route for h&s and to improve your walk"

Hopefully most people would take you up on the offer, and at minimal cost to yourself?

 

[som farmer]

on vehicle rights of way, across another farmers fields.

l know of two farmers, who seriously fell out over one. Anyway, the field in question owner, went back through all his deeds etc, there was a right of way, specified through the 8ft gate.

not often you see a field gate, with a reinforced concrete wall either side, with an exact 8ft opening. Just a pity they fell out over it.

 

[essexpete]

I think you are right, every area has one. Our local serial objector stopped/objected to any alteration because he could !!
He's dead now and his son has taken over the crusade..........

Can't emphasise enough, you are in danger of creating 2 FPs unless you close the permissive once a year. The fee for moving a PRO in this area was 3k ten years ago. The council would not spend the money on land they owned, just created a 2ndry route. Clearly not a concern in public used woodland.
Can you speak to the local ROW officer, then speak to the nearest rambling group and get a feel for the situation? The walking people are not going to stump up for the process, they have a ROW. Perhaps you could get a site meeting with Officer and Ramblers representative?

 

[warksfarmer]

Is there one?
All we want to do is divert a public footpath round instead of it going the middle of our farmyard. Everybody thinks it’s a good idea for health and safety and to provide a pleasanter walk. The problem is the council want £3125 plus a bit and we can’t really afford it esiecially as there’s always the slight risk that somebody will object, costs escalate and we lose all the payment for nothing.
So in my mind the diversion is a “public good” so where’s the public money for the public good and why should I as a private business be stumping all the cost and taking all the risk to deliver this public good?

Problem is you've got the council wanting some money basically and they dont care if it fails or costs you loads more. They also dont care if there is an accident in your yard and somebody is hurt even though as the body that looks after footpaths they should put the general public's safety first but that would not earn them any money and they sit there knowing that it will be you being prosecuted not them.
Its a lose-lose situation for you so stay as you are and make the sign bigger and maybe put a big heavy gate (unlocked of course) where the proper footpath is so people will take the easy route every time. Put an information board up of what they 'might' see on the diverted route as well as telling them you've put a bench for them to take a rest etc.

 

[nick...]

I’d ask the council for an on-site meeting.I did this about 4 years ago and had a foot path run beside a hedge and then on 90 degree bend left then another right and carry on up a track.local busy body complained to council that footpath should go over land for about 50 yards till it joined farm track again.council were very helpful and had no issues with this.if it had continued across field I’d be left with a triangle bit,50 yards long and about 10 wide.
nick…

 

[getting on]

@Defra Farming
Can you consider this in future policy where this is a clearly identifiable public good in diverting a path around a farmyard?

The Lincolnshire footpaths officer told me there is legislation coming down the track which will allow farmers to divert footpaths around farmyards. This is based on health and safety and no expense. He said keep your eyes open.

 

[nick...]

The Lincolnshire footpaths officer told me there is legislation coming down the track which will allow farmers to divert footpaths around farmyards. This is based on health and safety and no expense. He said keep your eyes open.

Nice to hear some common sense for once
nick…

 

[NLF]

I wasn’t sure about contacting the ramblers or whether it was best to let sleeping dogs lie. I get on fine with everybody who walks through but if the leadership are political they might have some kind of agenda. Although if that is the case then it’s better to know now I suppose rather then when I’ve spaffed £3k

Definitely contact the local ramblers and explain what you want to do. Best to get them onside first or at worse discover if they are likely to object before you spend any money. We have moved footpaths and usually found the ramblers supportive.

The problem in our area has been an organisation called the Open Spaces Society. They are a tiny group of people who object to everything.

If someone objects it goes to an inquiry. If you hire a solicitor to represent you it will set you back another 2-5k though you could represent yourself. Talk to the CLA or NFU. I have always found them helpful.

If the diversion is sensible it will get passed at the enquiry.

 

[DrWazzock]

Problem is you've got the council wanting some money basically and they dont care if it fails or costs you loads more. They also dont care if there is an accident in your yard and somebody is hurt even though as the body that looks after footpaths they should put the general public's safety first but that would not earn them any money and they sit there knowing that it will be you being prosecuted not them.
Its a loose loose situation for you so stay as you are and make the sign bigger and maybe put a big heavy gate (unlocked of course) where the proper footpath is so people will take the easy route every time. Put an information board up of what they 'might' see on the diverted route as well as telling them you've put a bench for them to take a rest etc.

Spot on. We are seen as a cash cow and I dare say they are a bit slack at the moment. It can stay as it is. Why should I take all the financial risk and cost?

 

[warksfarmer]

Spot on. We are seen as a cash cow and I dare say they are a bit slack at the moment. It can stay as it is. Why should I take all the financial risk and cost?

These people are a nightmare. I had a footpath officer tell me in writing that a footpath was to rough and that if anybody injured themselves we would be liable. She was ignored but wouldnot drop it. Eventually she was removed from her position but I believe still within the council elsewhere.