Growing and keeping your own grass

[Sam Partridge]

My issue is we have a lot of people locally looking at it like it's doing nothing and walking through it. Ideally I want some animals on there after it's cut and i want it farmed a bit more (with me learning about grass and grazingf as I go).

Currently, its been on a favour basis and i'm being paid in favours (field topped etc) but as you say I have none of the hassle, but also I have none of the say. We are looking at toppers currently so we can at least try.

This year, no fert, nothing put on it, and I haven't enough livestock myself to graze it after so the field (I think) is being underused and under cut.

What did you decide in the end? have you done anything yourselves this year? there is money to made in small bale hay, its hard work, and not just physical, but its the product with the most added value and by selling direct to end user you keep all the income not paying some middle man or merchant. I think people are confusing making profit with making a living off 30 acres. You won't be able to live off the profit but 4 years out of 5 it should pay well for your time

 

[Dry Rot]

You never hear 'foggage' mentioned these days. True north will have to buy some expensive equipment if he wants to make hay. Contractors are fine but I've never been able to get one when I've needed, except for cutting and baling and that's variable.

 

[True North]

What did you decide in the end? have you done anything yourselves this year? there is money to made in small bale hay, its hard work, and not just physical, but its the product with the most added value and by selling direct to end user you keep all the income not paying some middle man or merchant. I think people are confusing making profit with making a living off 30 acres. You won't be able to live off the profit but 4 years out of 5 it should pay well for your time

Nothing as yet this year.
We are looking at cutting and getting a small baler. Off to look at some kit this week because if we don't do it now in our 40s we never will and that would be a shame not to even try.

We both have careers, more just for us to manage it as best we can and not be waiting on others and maybe not been happy with end result or our lack of input. I can sell it easily enough I reckon.

@Dry Rot that is indeed the worry with contractors. Theres plenty about but we'd be bottom of the list I know

 

[True North]

You could get some native beef cattle, and graze them behind electric fence, they would sort out the grass and weed, less capital outlay, something to talk to in the evening after work, and just a few minutes a day. Before I started daily move grazing this field was a nightmare of thistles docks and stingers. (still a fair few stingers, but the cocksfoot grows crazy tall). I tried spraying for years but they keep coming back. No fertiliser, just FYM from time to time. Buy in some hay for the winter if you need. View attachment 1122215

Seriously if I thought I could handle cattle I would love to do this. Currently getting to grips with sheep. Looks great.

Did wonder about fattening up some young calves - getting them on the grass and then off.

 

[True North]

You could get some native beef cattle, and graze them behind electric fence, they would sort out the grass and weed, less capital outlay, something to talk to in the evening after work, and just a few minutes a day. Before I started daily move grazing this field was a nightmare of thistles docks and stingers. (still a fair few stingers, but the cocksfoot grows crazy tall). I tried spraying for years but they keep coming back. No fertiliser, just FYM from time to time. Buy in some hay for the winter if you need. View attachment 1122215

What electric kit did you use for the cows? I need some of that to do some rotational grazing here too.

We've dock and some ragwort but far less now topped and grazed. Could be tempted by some calves honestly, got so much pleasure from looking after the sheep (dagging out being the exception).

 

[True North]

£474 hectare. Eligible on Improved PP.

I have arable clients with an odd pasture field which usually gets a cut for hay or silage and then a sheep man in winter. Will just forget about the sheep man in winter in future.

So this is what i've been looking at, improving pasture. But because i'm not managing the grass, and not cutting it etc, I don't feel I have any say on what goes on and how to go forward on this with the current arrangement.

This year, no fert or manure, but they'll take all the grass and do all the work. I'd like to apply for different schemes and try max out what I can reasonably manage.

 

[Sam Partridge]

Nothing as yet this year.
We are looking at cutting and getting a small baler. Off to look at some kit this week because if we don't do it now in our 40s we never will and that would be a shame not to even try.

We both have careers, more just for us to manage it as best we can and not be waiting on others and maybe not been happy with end result or our lack of input. I can sell it easily enough I reckon.

@Dry Rot that is indeed the worry with contractors. Theres plenty about but we'd be bottom of the list I know

Mowing could be done by contractor but it still has to be done with enough time to make it all. You want to be in charge of turning and baling for sure and make sure you leave time to be able to gather them in in the dry. Like someone said before, get advice on when is best to turn and bale. The time taken to make hay all depends on conditions. Late june and july with grass going over hay can be made in under 3 days in hot sunny conditions, the faster you make it the more colour it keeps which will make it sell better. We just made some in under 2 days, hot sunny windy conditions, turned it 4 times. People will say we were turning for fun but when you only get 3 day windows you have to crack on.

 

[True North]

Stick it all into SFI winter seed for birds. Draw the sub. Let someone take a cut in late May. Enjoy a bottle of beer. Isn’t that what SFI is about.

Not been cut yet. I'd have to tell get someone to seed it as well presumably unless i can get the sheep to walk it in.

 

[True North]

Mowing could be done by contractor but it still has to be done with enough time to make it all. You want to be in charge of turning and baling for sure and make sure you leave time to be able to gather them in in the dry. Like someone said before, get advice on when is best to turn and bale. The time taken to make hay all depends on conditions. Late june and july with grass going over hay can be made in under 3 days in hot sunny conditions, the faster you make it the more colour it keeps which will make it sell better. We just made some in under 2 days, hot sunny windy conditions, turned it 4 times. People will say we were turning for fun but when you only get 3 day windows you have to crack on.

Yeah we could do that ourselves with the weather I reckon.

So this is what i've been looking at, improving pasture. But because i'm not managing the grass, and not cutting it etc, I don't feel I have any say on what goes on and how to go forward on this with the current arrangement.

This year, no fert or manure, but they'll take all the grass and do all the work. I'd like to apply for different schemes and try max out what I can reasonably manage.

And then graze it over winter myself maybe.

 

[True North]

You never hear 'foggage' mentioned these days. True north will have to buy some expensive equipment if he wants to make hay. Contractors are fine but I've never been able to get one when I've needed, except for cutting and baling and that's variable.

This is the issue we are facing, cost and hassle scenario isn't it.

 

[Dry Rot]

Nothing as yet this year.
We are looking at cutting and getting a small baler. Off to look at some kit this week because if we don't do it now in our 40s we never will and that would be a shame not to even try.

We both have careers, more just for us to manage it as best we can and not be waiting on others and maybe not been happy with end result or our lack of input. I can sell it easily enough I reckon.

@Dry Rot that is indeed the worry with contractors. Theres plenty about but we'd be bottom of the list I know

Getting a contractor to put hay into round bales should not be that difficult. Balers are so fast these days that they do my few acres on the way to someone bigger. It's what I do. I can could manage the mowing and tedding but since the last harvest left me with torn muscles, I've decided I can't now. Grazers have let me down and at 83 I am reluctant to buy stock....and I don't want to move. Sod the government's 'free lunch', i don't believe them!

 

[Rod Dumbreck]

Seriously if I thought I could handle cattle I would love to do this. Currently getting to grips with sheep. Looks great.

Did wonder about fattening up some young calves - getting them on the grass and then off.

I can see why you would say that, but cattle take about one tenth of the labour input of sheep, you can walk amongst them without they scatter all over, and one strand of electric fence keeps them confined very easily. And I can see why you would try calves first, but I would worry that it would put you on the wrong road,. A couple of suckler cows would be winding back all that overgrown grass, and making milk for their calves, which you can sell as stores or keep on. Yearlings are like delinquent teenagers and more likely to give you the run around.

 

[Dry Rot]

I can see why you would say that, but cattle take about one tenth of the labour input of sheep, you can walk amongst them without they scatter all over, and one strand of electric fence keeps them confined very easily. And I can see why you would try calves first, but I would worry that it would put you on the wrong road,. A couple of suckler cows would be winding back all that overgrown grass, and making milk for their calves, which you can sell as stores or keep on. Yearlings are like delinquent teenagers and more likely to give you the run around.

But don't I need a race or a crush or something for all that testing and dosing? I am in a similar position to True North. Letting summer grazing could be the answer for me if I find the right person).

 

[Rod Dumbreck]

But don't I need a race or a crush or something for all that testing and dosing? I am in a similar position to True North. Letting summer grazing could be the answer for me if I find the right person).

I have to admit that we have invested in a new crush, and being mobile it was fairly pricey, but I sold my old mobile crush for a profit, which is nearly a first for me. I don't think we should be asking vets our anyone else for that matter, to deal with animals in less than safe way, but that doesn't mean bells and whistles. Testing (TB) has to happen but thats every 4 years, and we don't worm our cattle, and the hoof trimmer brings his own.

 

[glasshouse]

This is the issue we are facing, cost and hassle scenario isn't it.

Have u got a hay shed?

 

[Dry Rot]

Have u got a hay shed?

Rounds can be lined out on pallets and then covered with DPM, but it's another hassle.

 

[glasshouse]

Rounds can be lined out on pallets and then covered with DPM, but it's another hassle.

Aye right

 

[True North]

Have u got a hay shed?
[/QUO

A good sized barn and front of mistal for bales.

 

[True North]

I can see why you would say that, but cattle take about one tenth of the labour input of sheep, you can walk amongst them without they scatter all over, and one strand of electric fence keeps them confined very easily. And I can see why you would try calves first, but I would worry that it would put you on the wrong road,. A couple of suckler cows would be winding back all that overgrown grass, and making milk for their calves, which you can sell as stores or keep on. Yearlings are like delinquent teenagers and more likely to give you the run around.

So what would you say to starting with cows/calves - not at all or a certain type/age?

 

[Rod Dumbreck]

So what would you say to starting with cows/calves - not at all or a certain type/age?

Getting a couple of in calf cows is a fairly easy way to start .