Growth Regulator Requirement, Timing and Rate

[DrWazzock]

For winter wheat and barley, what is there to know?

I apply Chlormequat chloride under the direction of an agronomist, but with catchy weather and delays I wish I knew more about the importance of timing, especially when the latest time to apply without causing damage.

 

[Flat 10]

I suspect I know less than you but I seem to recall a split dose is more reliable than a single dose. CCC won't hurt the crop for a while but there is some concern re residual levels in the grain so they don't like it on after GS33 I think though I'm not sure. You need acidifier if you are in a hard water area too(I know you have your own way of doing this). Other products such as Canopy, Moddus etc have a different mode of action and a stimulant/rooting claim which I find do a good job and are more reliable in cold weather they can also be applied later I think though I always use low rates. I avoid Terpal like the plague which you can apply very late. I hope this helps........

 

[JNG]

I suspect I know less than you but I seem to recall a split dose is more reliable than a single dose. CCC won't hurt the crop for a while but there is some concern re residual levels in the grain so they don't like it on after GS33 I think though I'm not sure. You need acidifier if you are in a hard water area too(I know you have your own way of doing this). Other products such as Canopy, Moddus etc have a different mode of action and a stimulant/rooting claim which I find do a good job and are more reliable in cold weather they can also be applied later I think though I always use low rates. I avoid Terpal like the plague which you can apply very late. I hope this helps........

Why are you so against Terpal?

 

[franklin]

I am fine with Terpal. I dislike Moddus.

 

[Chalky]

Very hard to be too savage with CCC- cheap & effective management tool. In the Schleswig Holstein growing system of the 70's, the germans would apply CCC as each node was laid down(ie as each leaf emerged). There are what were Mandops products(now Taminco) that still have a GS39 ticket- so rather says it all.

I like moddus/tempo- great to carry a can & give last field of tank load needs a bit more help than straight CCC- nice low volumes. Don't be too heavy handed- if you think it needs more than CCC can offer, ideally split between 30 & 32(along with CCC)- rather than a fire brigade big hit at 32.

Moddus & CCC very efficient on barley at early timings.

I use cerone late on if needed- cheaper than terpal- as long as you don't go mad with the rate, or apply at much more than 70 deg, doeas a good job. Usually 0.25-0.4 l/ha. The job should really be done by then, just making sure if the crop is a big one.

 

[Brisel]

1. READ THE LABEL. It will list the cut off dates but these vary between products with the same ingredients.
2. Either listen to your agronomist or do BASIS, or both.

Chlormequat works best if applied early in stem extension & better still in a split dose with the first at GS30.late tillering. It doesn't work well in cold conditions. Moddus can be quite harsh on the crop so I don't use more than 0.1 l/ha but as posted above it works in cooler weather & has a different mode of action. I haven't used Canopy but I understand it can also rattle the crop a bit. Terpal is your get-out-of-jail product. If the crop still looks leggy then you can use it at GS33 - booting depending on crop, label etc. If you use chlormequat on winter barley then you must follow it up with Terpal later as the crop will "bounce back" by lengthening straw between the later nodes.

All growth regulators can reduce yield in the absence of lodging but I doubt there are many of us who wouldn't apply any to a winter cereal with any kind of yield potential. With CCC at around £1.60/litre it's very cheap insurance IMO.

 

[franklin]

With big combined and lots to do, there is nothing worse than flat crops. ccc then canopy on barley then terpal I think this year. ccc then fcc plus moddus on wheat. Atlantis in spring has done a good job too. Grr

 

[Brian]

CCC does not work below 10C but you can add Li700 which will make it work down at 8C. Always spray on a rising temperature at this time of year and not early evening as temperature is falling assuming temperature drops below 10C at night. Personnally I always think CC works best as a split dose at 30/31 and 32. If the temp is marginal for CCC use probably better to switch to 0.1 of Moddus.
Agree with everything Brisel says above about Terpal esp in Barley.

 

[Flat 10]

Why are you so against Terpal?

I feel the crop runs into a wall so would rather make sure and get done early. I would only use Moddus canopy etc at about 25% rates.

 

[shakerator]

i have some what at GS32 it as just had 0.6 canopy along with the CCC

This field has huge background fertility that is only just coming to light!

Can anyone recommend the ideal rolls royce / fire brigade treatment from GS32 onwards (far to many tillers, heavy biomass already)

 

[7800]

i have some what at GS32 it as just had 0.6 canopy along with the CCC

This field has huge background fertility that is only just coming to light!

Can anyone recommend the ideal rolls royce / fire brigade treatment from GS32 onwards (far to many tillers, heavy biomass already)

Go steady with the N, 0.5 to 0.75 terpal in 2 to 3 weeks then 0.75 to 1 terpal or lookalike first week may, judge rate on the day.

 

[DrWazzock]

Thanks, useful. I seem to recall, though in might be mistaken, that we had a disaster with a late application of Terpal many years ago on winter barley, leading to un filled heads.

Going with Chlormequat on winter barley this week. Racing away now.

 

[Flat 10]

Thanks, useful. I seem to recall, though in might be mistaken, that we had a disaster with a late application of Terpal many years ago on winter barley, leading to un filled heads.

Going with Chlormequat on winter barley this week. Racing away now.

That's why I didn't like it @JNG. Did that on a farm where I worked.

 

[JNG]

That's why I didn't like it @JNG. Did that on a farm where I worked.

Wow I had never heard of that before, been using it on winter barley for as long as I remember. Anyone any views as to how this may happen, stressed plant, late application after head emerges, too hot, too cold etc? Do people feel canopy is a little more plant friendly if a bit of late PGR is required?

 

[Flat 10]

Thought I would resurrect this thread for this spring- what are peoples plans?
I think 2 x 0.1 Moddus + split CCC on hybrid barley- trying to avoid late Terpal.
WW third rate canopy + split CCC
spring barley nothing.
Not sure whether I should substitute canopy for some moddus product but if I do 2 doses doubt I will save much.
Anybody any views on the relative merits of canopy and moddus?
Also might try a smidge of moddus on a trial area of spring barley to see if it helps tillering /rooting.

 

[franklin]

Agronomist is pushing Canopy fb CCC.
I am sticking with CCC but with 0.1 moddus twice.

Pricewise, they are the same. Unsurprisingly.

Canopy seems kinder than moddus, but I dont find it nice to mix.

 

[Flat 10]

Agronomist is pushing Canopy fb CCC.
I am sticking with CCC but with 0.1 moddus twice.

Pricewise, they are the same. Unsurprisingly.

Canopy seems kinder than moddus, but I dont find it nice to mix.

I have not noticed a problem mixing Canopy. Overlaps if its cold and dry always get tickled up by even third rate canopy. We haven't used much moddus on this farm since our winter barley (Pipkin) was nearly killed by it in the first year of its recommendation when no-one knew to use low rates....

 

[Gong Farmer]

I think 2 x 0.1 Moddus + split CCC on hybrid barley- trying to avoid late Terpal.

Bounceback!!!!

 

[robbie]

I hate pgr's I think it's playing with fire to use anything that "regulates growth" my winter barley and wheats that are looking rather lush will get a litre of CCC and a then a dry spell in may will do the rest of my regulating.

Spring barley won't get anything and never has if I need to incourage tillering ill roll it twice.

 

[Flat 10]

Bounceback!!!!

You don't think I'd have done enough with the Moddus? Never much suffered from bounce back years ago when we grew malting winter barley. Think CCC works much better if water acidified first. If it looks like bouncing back I can always do something about it.