Imported lamb from NZ more carbon neutral than home produced?

[oil barron]

I would love to see the carbon footprint of the ships and there cold storage bringing NZ lamb here. None of it will be running on renewable energy.

They don’t even run on clean diesel. As soon as they are In international waters the scrubbers get switched off and it’s straight bunker fuel and black smoke.

 

[nivilla1982]

I went to a political party meeting in 2005ish, the speaker was an MEP, Jim Nicholson Ulster Unionist (sat with the Conservatives in the chamber). He said in a disaster, Europe has about 2 weeks of food. (He wasn't specific in that did he mean the EU or the entire continent). He said food security should/will be moving up the agenda.

 

[Ffermer Bach]

I went to a political party meeting in 2005ish, the speaker was an MEP, Jim Nicholson Ulster Unionist (sat with the Conservatives in the chamber). He said in a disaster, Europe has about 2 weeks of food. (He wasn't specific in that did he mean the EU or the entire continent). He said food security should/will be moving up the agenda.

doesn't seem to have, if anything I feel it has gone down, the supermarkets seem to have all the plaudits while we are told we are causing global warming! We, as in ruminant animal farmers, not Almond farmers in California or Avocado producers .

 

[holwellcourtfarm]

There'll be a big range of carbon footprint in both countries with a big overlap. Those looking to "prove" their pre-conceived ideas will use the extremes of each to do it (worst British vs best NZ or visa versa). We CAN learn from the kiwis, not least that they focus on a few breeds that perform well and on eating quality.

The Board of Trade report utterly ignores all of the non- trade implications though: social structure, biodiversity loss etc.

 

[hally]

I would love to see the carbon footprint of the ships and there cold storage bringing NZ lamb here. None of it will be running on renewable energy.

Everybody mentions our sheds but no one mentions the carbon footprint of building and running these gigantic ships

 

[delilah]

I would love to see the carbon footprint of the ships and there cold storage bringing NZ lamb here. None of it will be running on renewable energy.

Shipping 1kg of beef from Australia emits 200g of co2, you would assume it's a similar figure for NZ lamb. That's just the ship, as others have said there's a lot more to it than that.

 

[Bury the Trash]

Shipping 1kg of beef from Australia emits 200g of co2, you would assume it's a similar figure for NZ lamb. That's just the ship, as others have said there's a lot more to it than that.

i think its not so cold for the lmb cuts , 0 or about , as its chilled not frozen subbtle difference thats works fine if its vac packed. i suppose that (vac pack )costs extra though
beef in bigger bits and is w ay lower temp well frozen so use a bit more power from the fridge genny.

mind you theres a lot of meat in a reefer.
i cant remember if Kiwi fruit is chilled as they will carry that as well. but not in the same cont. obvs.and another subject i guess.

 

[Bury the Trash]

And we need critical mass, to ensure infrastructure is there to support the farmers. Keeping animals in the East, you need vets who do large animals, marts, probably fencing contractors, silage contractors as well as farmers/farmworkers who like keeping animals. The same here in the west, many years ago, a lot of the farms grew some corn, but very hard to now without contractors with a combine willing to do small bits.

yes indeed, i forgot critical /optimal mass .....and very important to, abattoirs have one ...especially bigger ones.

 

[Top Tip.]

The kiwis and Aussies also use a different form of measurement to measure their footprint and they also allow offsetting which doesn’t happen here.

 

[spin cycle]

The kiwis and Aussies also use a different form of measurement to measure their footprint and they also allow offsetting which doesn’t happen here.

thats what i've read somewhere....just can't remember .... IIRC they're allowed to offset against their grassland which we're not

total farce

anyhoo...i fatten most of my lambs on grain.....can't see the issue

BTW i calculated that my grass/trees/hedge sequestration more than offset my farms emissions......also.....why are we being told we have to net zero when we already are.....what govt is asking is for us to cut co2 so they can use our grass/trees/hedge sequestration for nations calculation.....tell you what...THEY CAN FECK OFF

 

[Bury the Trash]

thats what i've read somewhere....just can't remember .... IIRC they're allowed to offset against their grassland which we're not

total farce

anyhoo...i fatten most of my lambs on grain.....can't see the issue

BTW i calculated that my grass/trees/hedge sequestration more than offset my farms emissions......also.....why are we being told we have to net zero when we already are.....what govt is asking is for us to cut co2 so they can use our grass/trees/hedge sequestration for nations calculation.....tell you what...THEY CAN FECK OFF

I take it you don't like Kiwi fruit then

 

[spin cycle]

I take it you don't like Kiwi fruit then

i'm gonna be honest and say i'm right fecked off by having kiwi farming practices held as some kinda panacia.....BECAUSE.....it's a myth

actually don't get me started

with apologies to our kiwi members...nothing personal

 

[Bury the Trash]

i'm gonna be honest and say i'm right fecked off by having kiwi farming practices held as some kinda panacia.....BECAUSE.....it's a myth

actually don't get me started

with apologies to our kiwi members...nothing personal

well for one thing , We're ahead of them on the shedder front

 

[Highland Mule]

Thinking about it, imported lamb could be closer to carbon neutral than much of what's produced in the UK, but only because our lamb is carbon negative and theirs (with transport) isn't.

 

[betweenthelines]

The whole carbon footprint debate is so vague as to be pointless. It depends on how far back to you trace the footprint of something. Electric car is carbon neutral, but where does the electricity come from, is it better to build a new electric car and scrap a five year old petrol car, or to keep using the petrol car rather than build a new one?

Is Welsh grass fed lamb better, carbon wise, than lambs fattened on catch crops? As in another thread, is it better to shoot dairy bred bull calves, or are they a "carbon freebie" if fattened up?

What if you use a contractor to do your silage? Is that good as you don't own the gear, or worse because the contractor's gear is overpowered for your acreage, or is it better 'cos his gear is covering more acres overall?

Then there's the soya question. Would it be grown just for the oil, so is it good that animals utilise the "waste product" or bad because it might not be grown if that "waste product" wasn't given a value as animal feed?

 

[kiwi pom]

Most of this, I'm greener, more sustainable, more environmentally friendly than you stuff is probably mostly nonsense, who knows if the figures actually stack up, its just a new marketing tactic.
You're hearing about NZ lamb because NZ farmers are working hard to get their product into other countries. Farming here would be finished overnight if other countries refused our product. Farmers are very conscious of that so its push, push, and use every edge you can. At the moment everything is marketed to be 'green' so that's what they are doing.
UK farmers don't really need to worry about that because you have a huge local population to feed.

 

[Bury the Trash]

Most of this, I'm greener, more sustainable, more environmentally friendly than you stuff is probably mostly nonsense, who knows if the figures actually stack up, its just a new marketing tactic.
You're hearing about NZ lamb because NZ farmers are working hard to get their product into other countries. Farming here would be finished overnight if other countries refused our product. Farmers are very conscious of that so its push, push, and use every edge you can. At the moment everything is marketed to be 'green' so that's what they are doing.
UK farmers don't really need to worry about that because you have a huge local population to feed.

well actually we do really need to worry about marketing , very much so.

 

[kiwi pom]

well actually we do really need to worry about marketing , very much so.

Yes you do or you will get pushed out by those that do market their produce better, particularly if they win the 'green' battle, but how hard are UK farmers working on it?
That's my point, it hasn't really been a concern until recently because of feeding the UK population but now if they see an alternative, they might go for it, especially if they think they're helping the planet.
Farmers are all competing against each other at the end of the day.

 

[Bury the Trash]

Because the plan is to afforest vast tracts of the UK. Have to remove the current land use. Simples. Do not try to rationalise any comments, it will hurt your brain.

thats just a johny come lately argument.

first lamb was sent here in 1870's by sail ...
...... mind you it was frozen (coal fired )

 

[Bury the Trash]

Yes you do or you will get pushed out by those that do market their produce better, particularly if they win the 'green' battle, but how hard are UK farmers working on it?
That's my point, it hasn't really been a concern until recently because of feeding the UK population but now if they see an alternative, they might go for it, especially if they think they're helping the planet.
Farmers are all competing against each other at the end of the day.

but Im a (basic) practical farmer not a PR man. ahdb (that replaced the meat and livestock commission ) are supposed to do that ,they take a levy from us for their 'promotions'