Is there any way we can farm in the UK without subsidies?

[delilah]

Only solution I can see is to get SFI rehashed.

The only land to get an area payment should be permanent pasture.

Sorry, just realised that i'd not said it for a while. Must be slipping.

 

[Hilly]

The only land to get an area payment should be permanent pasture.

Sorry, just realised that i'd not said it for a while. Must be slipping.

Only …. Probably most of the uk

 

[spin cycle]

my mum is very ill in hospital...we farm as a partnership....we now have stewardship income to replace 75% of bps and rent reduction on our hired grazing just about cover the other 25%

our flock of sheep has halved because of land taken out for stewardship

looking at the 'rump' and should the 'worst' happen re mum I've been pondering

is there really any point in effectively trying to produce fat lambs in the hope a boatload of kiwi doesn't arrive and 'crash' the market?

I'm leaning towards 'no'....whilst bps was arriving I didn't give it a second thought

perhaps bps going is a good thing?...we can all look less 'romantically' at food production?

mind you most of my ground qualifies as arable so I'm fortunate I can get lucrative arable options....those with pp have been 'hung out to dry'

 

[delilah]

Only …. Probably most of the uk

https://assets.publishing.service.g...ucture-june-eng-lessfavouredareas-05jul22.ods

3,557,659 Ha in England.

 

[spin cycle]

if I was younger...just starting out ...i'd think about offering 'whole farm stewardship contacting '.....managing the whole process from option selection thru management and delivery....it would be a very cheap option for landowners and one person could cover a vast amount of land with less expensive machinery

bet someone somewhere has thought the same

 

[Bossfarmer]

Most of us will be able to farm in some way but hangers on such as landlords, agents, dealers, agronomists and Range Rover salesmen will have to adjust their expectations even more than we will.

Machinery dealers will do well once everyones tractors/kit is 10-15yr old theyll be flat out repairing things

 

[gone up the hill]

Surely this is just you personally subsidising your operation, rather than central government?!

I commend you for being such a good citizen as to be so keen to feed the nation you are willing to do it out of your own pocket!

I am not saying i would do either @Hill Ground but most smaller farmers will end up doing one or the other unless our own rules/ red tape are dropped to match inputs alongside much low farm gate input prices and higher output prices happening when subs are gone.


New Sub schemes are an utter waste of time as they stand and will not be worth entering!

 

[Henarar]

You must be in Scotland or wales

Must I ? oh dam even Wales is an hours drive away and I was going to cut some grass but still if you insist, what do you want me to do when I get there ?

Seriously though life isn't fair and when it comes to gov policy there will be winners and losers, its always been like that for instance My Dad got stafted when milk quota came in, yes speak up about it but if nothing is changed you just have to live with it

 

[Bossfarmer]

Pigs, poultry and horticulture are pretty much unsubsidised.
Intensive dairy has BPS as such a small % of turnover as it’s almost irrelevant.

It’s only really combinables and beef & sheep where subsidies count for much.

Which most of the country are?

 

[Bossfarmer]

Good farmers can….the rest of us mere mortals have no chance from pure farming.
Although I bet if you put a poll on this thread the majority would say they can manage without

Thats like saying the general public can MANAGE to live on £5/hr, yes they might survive on beans and toast they wont be getting far in life though

 

[7610 super q]

Is Wales going to be " Better off "than England, when we have to plant 10% of our land with trees, and take another 10% out for wildlife schemes ?
I won't be doing the above BTW. Quite looking forward not having anything to do with trying to claim dole money again.

 

[Bossfarmer]

Plenty do farm without subsidies . If your a tennant you give the landlord most of the sub Probably all of it and some more on an FBT

You dont have to buy the land though? The sub is nothing in comparison

 

[Henarar]

Prices will have to rise to meet the true cost of production

Will they though ? if your cost of production goes up but the farmer next doors doesn't and they carry on producing then why would the price go up ? if this countries cost of production goes up but the country next doors doesn't why would the price go up ?
I don't think there is any "have to" about it unless everyone's costs go up

 

[Top Tip.]

Pigs, poultry and horticulture are pretty much unsubsidised.
Intensive dairy has BPS as such a small % of turnover as it’s almost irrelevant.

It’s only really combinables and beef & sheep where subsidies count for much.

Pigs poultry and intensive dairy are indirectly subsidised through the combinable subsidy enabling grain production.

 

[midlandslad]

Machinery dealers will do well once everyones tractors/kit is 10-15yr old theyll be flat out repairing things

And the land agents will be busy getting for sale boards up all over.

 

[robs1]

Machinery dealers will do well once everyones tractors/kit is 10-15yr old theyll be flat out repairing things

Learn to do it yourself, we were quoted £12,000 for a new boom for our sprayer as you can't get inserts to take out the slack, have made them ourselves for under £300 including buying a new drill bit for the lathe to drill the right size hole . If you can't do these jobs find a local who can, that is another opportunity to earn a good living for someone, it's amazing the money that can be saved on bits and bobs by doing some research on the net.

 

[Magnus Oyke]

Plenty of opportunities to make money, farm shops, farming tourists etc, but everyone will bandwagon jump. Milk vending machines must have reached saturation point already....

Things are going to get real PDQ.

Diversification doesn't do anything to improve your cost of production, all it does is subsidise it. It may come to the point where the diversification enterprises are the core business and the farm only excists to provide legitimancy to the diversification projects

 

[kfpben]

Someone farming pigs or poultry on 100 acres will get the same payment as someone farming cattle or sheep and turnover is not profit

I get that but broilers are on a tiny area of land. There’s not many farming 1000 acres of poultry, plenty farming 1000 acres of cereals.

A friend of mine milks 300 cows on 280 acres, 11,000litre average. SFP at £95/acre is not that significant to the business.

 

[7610 super q]

Diversification doesn't do anything to improve your cost of production, all it does is subsidise it. It may come to the point where the diversification enterprises are the core business and the farm only excists to provide legitimancy to the diversification projects

I know. I've never really understood why folks take an off farm job, and try to run the farm at weekends either.
But........I just like living here, in a nice house, in a nice location, pottering about with classic tractors. That's my excuse for subsidising a frankly pathetic food producing business form my savings account..
It is dawning on me however, that the " Industry " is being controlled/ manipulated to keep prices artificially low. I'm OK with supply and demand, peaks and troughs, but do I want to carry on producing crops for a market with a glass ceiling ?
Every hobby has it's limits......

 

[Henarar]

I get that but broilers are on a tiny area of land. There’s not many farming 1000 acres of poultry, plenty farming 1000 acres of cereals.

I know a pig farmer that gets 5 times the BPS payment I do

A friend of mine milks 300 cows on 280 acres, 11,000litre average. SFP at £95/acre is not that significant to the business.

It is if the price of milk is down and that £26600 is the only profit they make