Monbiot's TV show.....Apocalypse Cow: How Meat Killed the Planet

[Pilatus]

I vote to boycott them and make them keep eating their nuts and beans.

I like your thinking

 

[Lazy Sod]

Monbiot said you use energy to split a water molecule to produce hydrogen to make this new super food.

If it was that easy to split water into hydrogen and oxygen, why aren't we all driving hydrogen powered cars?

 

[Treg]

This one?

That video definitely needs to be sent round to all the schools.

 

[Poorbuthappy]

That video definitely needs to be sent round to all the schools.

A lot of good info in there, but quite hard to listen to.

 

[Muck Spreader]

Soya is the only compleat plant protein, so if you are not eating meat, its the best thing to eat, its easily made in to a mince subitute,and its cheap TVP. 500g could feed a family of four at least three meals. Its been around for years. If people were really interested in veganism sales would go up.
It is mostly sold in the basic ranges section of supermarkets,

Tesco Wholefood Soya Mince - Tesco Groceries

Dried soya mince made from textured soya protein.

www.tesco.com

Its funny no one mentions it, because it either not trendy, or their is no added value money to be made from it, unless its hydrated and frozen and sold a vegatable mince. Or perhaps it because it undermines the vegan arguement that eating plants causes less damage because to feed the planet cheaply production would have to increase. Its production would also be more difficult to control, not like patented fake meat.

You would be most unwise to eat soya based products other than very occasionally or where it's used in a condiment. It is linked controversially in some cases, to a whole host of neurodegenerative diseases as well as various cancers and skeletal problems.

 

[Muck Spreader]

Slightly off topic.
Nuts and Beans must be part of a vegan diet that Monbiot is promoting , yet I assume many Vegans are allergic to Nuts and Beans,
hopefully that will mean some of them will get seriously ill from their diet, and if at deaths door be only to pleased to eat a convential diet that includes meat.

The Sacramento valley in California produces 80% of the worlds Almonds and is being destroyed by them. The above and below ground water is seriously depleted and the soil is becoming toxic from sprays. Apparently, it takes one gallon (US) of water to produce one almond, one Walnut takes 5 gallons and one tomato take 3.3 gallons. Makes Beef and lamb look pretty reasonable.

 

[honeyend]

The Sacramento valley in California produces 80% of the worlds Almonds and is being destroyed by them. The above and below ground water is seriously depleted and the soil is becoming toxic from sprays. Apparently, it takes one gallon (US) of water to produce one almond, one Walnut takes 5 gallons and one tomato take 3.3 gallons. Makes Beef and lamb look pretty reasonable.

Thats so mad I had to have a quick google,

Water-indexed benefits and impacts of California almonds

California almonds have been the focus of recent media scrutiny because of the large amount of water required to grow individual nuts and, by extensio…

www.sciencedirect.com

In the last series of Amazons Goliath the plot was based on stealing water go grow almonds through underground pipes.

 

[SteveHants]

Anyone posted this yet? https://realfoodcampaign.org.uk/geo...w-is-this-the-truth-about-the-future-of-food/

 

[Muck Spreader]

Thats so mad I had to have a quick google,

Water-indexed benefits and impacts of California almonds

California almonds have been the focus of recent media scrutiny because of the large amount of water required to grow individual nuts and, by extensio…

www.sciencedirect.com

In the last series of Amazons Goliath the plot was based on stealing water go grow almonds through underground pipes.

Looks like the figure I got was an underestimate. Madness.

 

[Sheeponfire]

I agree, it’s good business to take advantage of the opportunities that you’re presented with. I would suggest that it isn’t necessarily much good for that land in the long term, or for the patchwork of small fields, surrounded by wildlife corridors, that make the British countryside so beautiful and such a diverse environment. I guess it depends how short term your attitude is, as regards the land & countryside.....

If subs get removed overnight then I’m sure rents will fall. However, they won’t fall low enough, fast enough, for most of the tenants that are on 3 year review cycles.
The average sub to UK farm businesses is supposed to be something like £26k iirc, and most livestock benchmarking figures show that the average beef & sheep farm is lucky to break even with that sub included. If sub disappears, how many tenants could stand a loss of £26k for 3 years Potentially, before arguing like hell to get (maybe) a 10-20% rent reduction from their landlord, then another 3 years of losses before the next battle?

Or should we just throw them all out, along with the ancillary industries they support, in order to let the ‘efficient’ young guns in to harvest what fertility & infrastructure they’ve left behind?

Well said neilo... I could not have put it better myself...

The young guns often forget about the long term investment implications....

 

[delilah]

Anyone posted this yet? https://realfoodcampaign.org.uk/geo...w-is-this-the-truth-about-the-future-of-food/

Published by The Real Food Campaign.
Once again, the "loony left", the "do-gooders", the "eco-freaks", doing UK agriculture's job for it, whilst the "proper farmers" do no more than whinge to each other on here and submit the odd cringe-worthy complaint to ofcom.

 

[delilah]

Our message is very much along those lines but as an internationalist organisation I doubt very much you’d get FoE to fully endorse it.

And I still think you rather overestimate my importance.

FoE are your greatest ally. It's OK, we will get there in the end .
In the words of Belinda Carlisle: We want the same thing .

 

[puppet]

The Real Food Campaign is hardly known to most people so the influence is not great to the wider population. Channel 4 and the BBC are currently very biased against red meat but I don 't see them showing many programmes to support it. I am sure there are some out there.
98% of people are not vegan so we do not need to convince them. The reason we whinge to Ofcom is to prevent the current meat-eaters being influenced by poor evidence or horror stories

 

[delilah]

The Real Food Campaign is hardly known to most people so the influence is not great to the wider population. Channel 4 and the BBC are currently very biased against red meat but I don 't see them showing many programmes to support it. I am sure there are some out there.
98% of people are not vegan so we do not need to convince them. The reason we whinge to Ofcom is to prevent the current meat-eaters being influenced by poor evidence or horror stories

The NFU and AHDB have communications budgets that absolutely dwarf that of the Real Food Campaign. Show me a response from either organisation to Mr Monbiots programme that comes within a million miles of that one.

They can't do it. Why ? Because, unlike the Real Food Campaign, they are involved but not committed.

https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/words-dont-come-easy.302237/

 

[JP1]

Seems our Welsh referee farmer has set Twitter alight

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1213132941058093056

Replying to
@GeorgeMonbiot
You really don’t have a clue have do you. The world is in trouble because of stupid comments like this and not because of farming. The farmers have protected the countryside and wildlife for generations. You want to save the planet start addressing the real issues
4:20 PM · Jan 3, 2020·Twitter for iPhone
230
Retweets
1.8K
Likes







George Monbiot
@GeorgeMonbiot
·
Jan 3

Replying to
@Nigelrefowens
Alternatively, you could watch the programme and form your opinions when you know what it is you're commenting about.




Nigel Owens MBE
@Nigelrefowens
·
Jan 3

And u could also do the same. Non biased fair reporting wd help. Not like the recent programmes on meat & agriculture which was heavily based on south America & USA and not on the sustainable farming of Wales and Uk. We all have a part to play but at least let’s be honest & fair

I know it's Off Topic but at every step I just see the towering chasm between Monbiot and Nigel Owens and what their respective key drivers are

 

[Jerry]

I know it's Off Topic but at every step I just see the towering chasm between Monbiot and Nigel Owens and what their respective key drivers are

View attachment 852916

He has gone up hugely in my estimation since I started following him on Twitter.

another one worth a follow for slightly different reasons is James Wong. He’s a botanist and very science driven but has debunked a lot of the vegan crap as well

 

[Old McDonald]

Seems PM was right about the bees

'Like sending bees to war': the deadly truth behind your almond milk obsession

Bees are essential to the functioning of America’s titanic almond industry – and billions are dying in the process

www.theguardian.com

What a load of rubbish. I am a former beekeeper and currently grow almonds, so have some knowledge of both bees and almonds. I do not use or make powdered almonds mixed with a lot of water, also incorrectly known as almond "milk". Fortunately there are several hundred hives within flying distance of me and bees are active all year round here, even in mid winter on sunny days. There are flowers available throughout the year too the white heather is currently in bloom – slightly earlier than usual as I expect to see it just leading up to Burns’ Night.

The article is by a foremost “environmentalist” who is very much on the same wavelength as Monbiot – anti-farming (including commercial beekeeping because the honeybee outcompetes wild bees) and an advocate of “wild places”. The two foundations financing the Guardian’s year long The Age of Extinction series of articles are also “environmental” foundations.

There is no mention in the article of colony loses during pollination of almonds. There is mention of tracheal mites, varroa and colony collapse disorder, all of which have seriously affected the beekeeper Arp. No losses attributed by him to his pollination of almonds though. At around about $US200 a hive for an average contract of about four or five weeks, that is quite an income in a short space of time. Can any of you match it with anything you farm? If you were paying $400 an acre to have your crop pollinated would you spray insecticides that kill your pollinators? It should also be noted that the number of colonies in the USA is reasonably static over the last few years.

She mentions glyphosate – the usual anti Monsanto stance of environmentalists, as if almond growers would be using it on the trees, and at blossom time, as being widely used. The inclusion of a 20 acre organic block as if it was some magical area that the bees would not leave is just appalling bad journalism when she has already stated that bees travel miles from the hive.

 

[Bobthebuilder]

I see subway have jumped on the vegan band wagon with their latest advertising [emoji85]

 

[Old McDonald]

The Sacramento valley in California produces 80% of the worlds Almonds and is being destroyed by them. The above and below ground water is seriously depleted and the soil is becoming toxic from sprays. Apparently, it takes one gallon (US) of water to produce one almond, one Walnut takes 5 gallons and one tomato take 3.3 gallons. Makes Beef and lamb look pretty reasonable.

I had not seen this when I made my previous post. Here are some disjointed quotes from something I published back in 2011:

The CIWF report referred to earlier, trying to persuade us all to become vegetarians, provides information from Cornell University that states it takes 100,000 litres of water to produce one kilo of beef.

Oddly enough the same table gives chicken at “only” 3500 litres of water per kilo.

Other information I have seen has potatoes as low as 30 litres per serving.

To be fair the Cornell data puts potatoes at 500 litres per kilo and not the lesser amounts of other reports I have seen, but that is still only one two hundredth of the amount claimed for beef.
.............................................

I did mention Disraeli and statistics.

 

[Ted M]

Quick fag packet calculations assuming all our water goes to the cattle (which it doesn't, we have 2 households using as well) we use approx 36.5 litres per kg/dw produced.
Not much I can do about what falls out of the sky