- Location
- Western Washington
Perfect.
Overseeding
- Thread starter Sid
- Start date
Sprog
Member
- Location
- South Shropshire
By October all over field
Sprog
Member
- Location
- South Shropshire
A lot has survived
- Location
- Ceredigion
Overseeded into a zero clover ley last August
Two passes with Tine Harrrow and Rolled
grazed all winter with sheep and just taken 2cd cut from .
Was cut to low realy
Two passes with Tine Harrrow and Rolled
grazed all winter with sheep and just taken 2cd cut from .
Was cut to low realy
d williams
Member
Put a break of rape or your kale in??
- Location
- Ceredigion
Overseeded 6 weeks ago
Grass got ahead of it last week so had to cut it, thought I had lost it but the clover is starting to come through , both look thiner than they are
Two passes with Tyne Harrow
was extremely dry when I harrowed it so did not lift as much soil as I wanted and also failed to get it rolled as it rained heavy soon after, that did not help things, as its so important to Roll it
Grass got ahead of it last week so had to cut it, thought I had lost it but the clover is starting to come through , both look thiner than they are
Two passes with Tyne Harrow
was extremely dry when I harrowed it so did not lift as much soil as I wanted and also failed to get it rolled as it rained heavy soon after, that did not help things, as its so important to Roll it
- Location
- Owaka, New Zealand
Clover loves sun on the soil, it's a lower to mid succession species, like the weeds.
The downside of managing for more grass is the lower proportion of clover, but the stock do better and we don't have a drought as the "more grass" is working better than the management for clover was capable of doing.
I think overall economically I'm better off to fly clover seed on and hope, than overgraze the pastures to a higher protein /legume percentage - this will be different to a dairy farm, as we are dairy support.
It would be likewise quite different if we were summer-safe, but clover-dominant pastures indicate too-short recoveries multiplied by lots of hope and rain-dances
- Location
- somerset
40+ years ago, a break crop between a grass to grass reseed, and that was when you could use all sorts of nasty, but efficient, sprays, to take out the nasty bugs. The problem was, it killed the good ones as well !
Today, there isn't a lot you can do against those nasty bugs, and we al quite happily do grass to grass reseeds, without a break crop.
On a slightly different subject, soil ph. We usually try and take 1 or 2 cuts of grass, before drilling maize, its our rotation. This year, we have lost about an acre of maize, drilled 4th june, to leather jackets and/or rooks, the rest of the 12 acre field is fine, 5 foot +.
That acre, is on a bank that we know is low ph, co-incidence ? We knew we should have limed, and intended to, but contractor used a bit to much on other fields, timing etc, didn't get done, and another lesson learnt.
But it does illustrate the importance of ph, it can/will effect germination of new seeds. Read somewhere, the amount of liming done, has dropped considerably over the years, probably matching farm produce price.
We soil test, for NVZ, you are required to do each field, once every 4 years, look out Welsh farmers ! But the results coming back, for us, especially on ph, don't seem to agree with traditional tests.
There are fields here, we know/think are low ph, and have been limed over the years, that now test ok. Is this because the old test tube tests were inaccurate, or the new ones are ?
Over recent years N use has dropped, a reaction to NVZ, and recently price.
Ammonia Nitrate is acidic, has lower usage, negated the low ph ? I haven't got a clue, on that.
Our low ph soil, are usually the most sandiest. I have always been told, redshank grows best on acid soils, here, it grows readily on the sandy soils, which we think are low ph, co-incidence ?
We have 2 small banks, half acre, that are low ph, one tested 4.5ph, but the rest of the fields are fine, so ......... What l will say, cattle graze those two patches, right down to the roots, by choice.
- Location
- Ceredigion
I'm not convinced myself it is Leatherjackets without seeing it or even a picture
Rolling sometime after when its Germinating after a fair bit of rain would not do it any good either
- Location
- somerset
we don't roll maize, correctly or not.
pretty certain it was rooks/grubs, that patch was black with them, been in grass for 7 yrs, , so l/jackets likely attracted the rooks, that then ate the seed !
By drilling late, it allows for 1 or 2 cuts of silage beforehand, we find once it starts to grow, it doesn't stop, and 'out grows' rooks/pests.
We started growing maize, 1970, no anti bird additive then, the deterrent was a gun, bangers and scarecrows, which were inefficient. So we had to 'string' the ground, bamboo canes and string, cousin reckoned the last year we did it, 60 acres. There wouldn't be the labour, or time, to do that again, or even the inclination.
But, no bird deterrent, that stringing was the effective way ! No pest additive, that will go as well. Will make growing it a bit different. The other big 'thing' about maize, it was a late nov/dec/jan harvest window, now its much more sociable crop. Messing about with sheets, in weather with frosts, ice and snow, was sheer #########
- Location
- Ceredigion
Sorry I was referring to the previous one on leatherjackets not yours
You getting all this rain about
- Location
- somerset
yes
10ml in june
162 in july
and grass is growing.
Being a normal farmer, we moan about the weather, all through the dry spell, we had enough grass, we graze longer covers, so pre-mowed them, to max amount of yield. Worked very well.
However, the rain now, has led us to a shortage of grass ! We have 50 acres of grass to silage, 4th cut, and its to wet to cut.
Because we pre- mowed most of our grazing platform, once the grass started to regrow, all nice spring like grass, cows have hoovered it up to quickly ! That silage ground, should be available for grazing now #######
one can never get things perfect
ollie989898
Member
Bit of doxstar on it would sort it- cheap going really it's just that most people can't be arshed.
- Location
- South Molton
- Location
- Ceredigion
- Location
- somerset
the biggest problem with the herbal/diverse leys, is weed control, l don't think there's a spray available, would love to be corrected on that.
At present, we glyphosate pre DD. In theory, by DD'ing we should only disturb the very top bit of soil, thereby not bringing weed seeds to the surface, to plague us.
Doesn't seem to work that well, annual weeds are easy, just top them off, but not for docks and thistles.
Or, we can glyphosate, DD with grass, spray with pas+tor, or something similar, and add the 'extras' after.
Over seeding is most successful drilling into an open sward, as we all know. So over seeding into a vigorous grass ley, isn't perhaps the ideal, but the best we can do.
One thing l have been surprised at, since including herbs, the cows will happily eat docks, even the seeds, you just get left with brown stalks. That's a double edged sword, dock seeds pass through the cow, and over seed themselves, complete with a growth medium, shite.
Anything else, is just regular topping, to tidy up, or spot spraying.
So, what advice does our resident agronomist, @ollie989898 or someone else, think is the 'ideal' way to get a clean(ish) diverse/herbal ley ?
We 'farm' two bits of land, and have done for 25+ years, cut only, no fert, and free, over that period of time, we have seen the weeds increase, then decrease, naturally, to a point where you could say its 'clean', yield followed the same curve, 1 smallish cut, to now we get 2 or 3 reasonable cuts.
Just not keen on going through the same weed curve, in the leys.
- Location
- South Molton
Oh it does depend on the rest of the ley.
Cutting Chicory when it's ready would be detrimental to later maturing plants. Then it's about compromises
- Location
- South Molton
Another long post, but completely missed the point about the actual weed you are concerned about controlling