Robotic milking

[wasted years]

"A good lely guy"

Sounds a good idea, why's it not already happened?

It has, one has just left the front line to the tech dpt, as you know.

 

[mawleymoos]

Get and buy those Fullwood 225’s for sale on sat! Reliable,Simple to maintain, and no contract!! Our older mark 2’s are not costing or breaking down any more than when they were new! (Actually loads less!!) that doesn’t mean that I wouldn’t like the new ones, but difficult to justify, as not having any issues with ours!

Sorry this was meant to be a reply for chips! Not no.1 Yorkshire farmer!!

 

[Chips]

At some point a good lely guy will realise that they could go private , charge by the minute for phone advice and do some install / repairs and do very well.

The problem here is no guy can go on his own because lely will not issue tech keys needed , unlike the motor trade where all the independents can have access to the software , As I understand it the tech keys only last 2 weeks so if an engineer leaves his key is useless in two weeks . Also going independent route is okay out of contract because a lot of the common repairs would not need a tech key but Lely are under no obligation to come out to you when you do need a repair with a tech key requirement and so there is an animal welfare angle to not having any contract , indeed I was told they have a list in the centre for farms not to go to although there is no one on it at the moment . I can't even get quotes from other centres for back up because I slap bang in the middle of three centres all controlled by the same lely centre . On top of this I have been told if I go on the medium contract with labour and no parts and I buy liners off any one else they will not come out to any bactoscan issues or similar . On top of this in the past when I have needed a ram for the grazeaway which is not covered , following a huge quote from lely I decided to ring a dealer for said make of air ram who was confident he could supply that size ram for well under a quarter of the lely price , however when he looked up the serial number he was told they are not allowed to sell that ram to anyone over than Lely , I believe the same is of many of the out sourced parts like valves etc . So it would appears every which way you turn to try and get some fair trade Lely and cutting it off , I even believe they set up an organisation with other manufacturers which lobbied to bring in the farm assurance reg requiring you to have your parlour serviced annually by an accredited member of their organisation ! Thus until they allow independents to be accredited to their own organisation and release tech keys no good lely guy is going to be able to go private .
They received huge fines for behaving this way in the Scandinavian Countries
https://www.en.kfst.dk/nyheder/kfst...-has-fixed-selling-prices-and-shared-markets/
But until the CMA sort them out here in the UK we farmers are left powerless to do anything other swallow the near enough doubling of service prices for the sake of our cows welfare .
Now my only choice of three different contracts , the service only one is £3200 , I've been told I can buy the service packs from Lely dealers abroad for between £100 and £300 pounds depending on which service , One of the engineers (who do a great job, I have no issue there at all) serviced my robot this morning in little over an hour , so at best Lely are charging £700 per hour for service work !

 

[chas]

The problem here is no guy can go on his own because lely will not issue tech keys needed , unlike the motor trade where all the independents can have access to the software , As I understand it the tech keys only last 2 weeks so if an engineer leaves his key is useless in two weeks . Also going independent route is okay out of contract because a lot of the common repairs would not need a tech key but Lely are under no obligation to come out to you when you do need a repair with a tech key requirement and so there is an animal welfare angle to not having any contract , indeed I was told they have a list in the centre for farms not to go to although there is no one on it at the moment . I can't even get quotes from other centres for back up because I slap bang in the middle of three centres all controlled by the same lely centre . On top of this I have been told if I go on the medium contract with labour and no parts and I buy liners off any one else they will not come out to any bactoscan issues or similar . On top of this in the past when I have needed a ram for the grazeaway which is not covered , following a huge quote from lely I decided to ring a dealer for said make of air ram who was confident he could supply that size ram for well under a quarter of the lely price , however when he looked up the serial number he was told they are not allowed to sell that ram to anyone over than Lely , I believe the same is of many of the out sourced parts like valves etc . So it would appears every which way you turn to try and get some fair trade Lely and cutting it off , I even believe they set up an organisation with other manufacturers which lobbied to bring in the farm assurance reg requiring you to have your parlour serviced annually by an accredited member of their organisation ! Thus until they allow independents to be accredited to their own organisation and release tech keys no good lely guy is going to be able to go private .
They received huge fines for behaving this way in the Scandinavian Countries
https://www.en.kfst.dk/nyheder/kfst...-has-fixed-selling-prices-and-shared-markets/
But until the CMA sort them out here in the UK we farmers are left powerless to do anything other swallow the near enough doubling of service prices for the sake of our cows welfare .
Now my only choice of three different contracts , the service only one is £3200 , I've been told I can buy the service packs from Lely dealers abroad for between £100 and £300 pounds depending on which service , One of the engineers (who do a great job, I have no issue there at all) serviced my robot this morning in little over an hour , so at best Lely are charging £700 per hour for service work ![/QU
What’s a tech key;I run a vms and the contract costs are lower ,but when I was on no contract there was no threat of not coming out to fix it unless your on a stupid list ,I would have sent the bloody things back that’s a cow welfare issue!!

 

[wasted years]

The problem here is no guy can go on his own because lely will not issue tech keys needed , unlike the motor trade where all the independents can have access to the software , As I understand it the tech keys only last 2 weeks so if an engineer leaves his key is useless in two weeks . Also going independent route is okay out of contract because a lot of the common repairs would not need a tech key but Lely are under no obligation to come out to you when you do need a repair with a tech key requirement and so there is an animal welfare angle to not having any contract , indeed I was told they have a list in the centre for farms not to go to although there is no one on it at the moment . I can't even get quotes from other centres for back up because I slap bang in the middle of three centres all controlled by the same lely centre . On top of this I have been told if I go on the medium contract with labour and no parts and I buy liners off any one else they will not come out to any bactoscan issues or similar . On top of this in the past when I have needed a ram for the grazeaway which is not covered , following a huge quote from lely I decided to ring a dealer for said make of air ram who was confident he could supply that size ram for well under a quarter of the lely price , however when he looked up the serial number he was told they are not allowed to sell that ram to anyone over than Lely , I believe the same is of many of the out sourced parts like valves etc . So it would appears every which way you turn to try and get some fair trade Lely and cutting it off , I even believe they set up an organisation with other manufacturers which lobbied to bring in the farm assurance reg requiring you to have your parlour serviced annually by an accredited member of their organisation ! Thus until they allow independents to be accredited to their own organisation and release tech keys no good lely guy is going to be able to go private .
They received huge fines for behaving this way in the Scandinavian Countries
https://www.en.kfst.dk/nyheder/kfst...-has-fixed-selling-prices-and-shared-markets/
But until the CMA sort them out here in the UK we farmers are left powerless to do anything other swallow the near enough doubling of service prices for the sake of our cows welfare .
Now my only choice of three different contracts , the service only one is £3200 , I've been told I can buy the service packs from Lely dealers abroad for between £100 and £300 pounds depending on which service , One of the engineers (who do a great job, I have no issue there at all) serviced my robot this morning in little over an hour , so at best Lely are charging £700 per hour for service work !

I've never heard of tech keys, my service centre didn't want (and probably still don't want to) give any back up to me as my model is the only one they support, the others are newer.
I'm told that Lely made it clear they had to support me and actually once they calmed themselves down we have managed quite well.
You should manage more easily with a multi robot set up as you can swap parts over to check what works or not.
With respect I wonder if you are swallowing a bit of BS?

 

[Sid]

Glad i didn't put in a lely!

Just sourced some parts for my robots online. One being an air ram as mentioned by @Chips

 

[Chips]

With respect I wonder if you are swallowing a bit of BS?

Fair comment , but in relation to which bit ? I know for a fact tech keys exist , the lely engineer had it on a loop around his neck , and I know the air ram company will not sell me rams as I've tried , the bit about the list , well maybe and I don't think they would refuse to come out if out of contract as I get on well with all the engineers but undoubtedly you would be back of the que . And to be fair to the centres it's not their fault either as they get charged the ridiculous prices for parts from lely and thus are forced into rip off service costs to stay in business , I believe the cost of parts from lely to the centres doubled overnight a few years back and thus now they are near enough doubling the cost of service to those of us on older contracts .
My only option now is to decide which of the three contracts , so how much do people on here spend per year on parts for an A3 on average ?

 

[Chips]

Glad i didn't put in a lely!

Just sourced some parts for my robots online. One being an air ram as mentioned by @Chips

On the flip side though , I believe a new laser will cost a fullwood farmer twice as much as a Lely farmer as Fullwood have to get them from Lely , it appears which ever way you turn , it's heads they win tails you lose !

 

[Sid]

On the flip side though , I believe a new laser will cost a fullwood farmer twice as much as a Lely farmer as Fullwood have to get them from Lely , it appears which ever way you turn , it's heads they win tails you lose !

Are lely good on warrenty for new parts that fail within a year?

As you probably know what annoyed me àbout Lely was the lump sum to be allowed to buy a s/h machine! Ran warning bells to me.

 

[Chips]

Are lely good on warrenty for new parts that fail within a year?

.

I guess all new parts would come with 12mths warranty , I think possibly there may be longer warranties on some new parts but I think more often than not the big ticket items will be reconditioned parts at a discount over new in which case I have no idea on warranty , anyone on here know ?

 

[chas]

I guess all new parts would come with 12mths warranty , I think possibly there may be longer warranties on some new parts but I think more often than not the big ticket items will be reconditioned parts at a discount over new in which case I have no idea on warranty , anyone on here know ?

Not sure,on vms you used to be able to say ,get a new camera on the end of the arm ,the old one got sent away to be fixed,so then was as good as new ,so you got charged for the repair because your old one could be either returned to your machine or sold to fix another,now you get charged for a new one end of,afaik

 

[wasted years]

Are lely good on warrenty for new parts that fail within a year?

As you probably know what annoyed me àbout Lely was the lump sum to be allowed to buy a s/h machine! Ran warning bells to me.

I bought an A2 privately over a decade ago now and it caused quite a stir as farmers buying their own wasn't supposed to happen!
Luckily @No1 Yorkshire Farmer was able to accommodate me, even though I was out of the designated postcode area.
Lely are a funny bunch.

 

[Chips]

I bought an A2 privately over a decade ago now and it caused quite a stir as farmers buying their own wasn't supposed to happen!
Luckily @No1 Yorkshire Farmer was able to accommodate me, even though I was out of the designated postcode area.
Lely are a funny bunch.

Well the trouble for me is the three nearest centres are all controlled by my local centre with the rest being far too far away for it to be in animal welfare interests to rely on for back up . So despite being told when being sold the robot the service cost would be linked to uk inflation it's as always the small print that catches you out aided and abetted by their flagrant disregard for fair competition , the lesson here being when buying a robot and looking at the affordability of the service costs remember to add in an 83% overnight increase in charges over and above that of UK inflation which they can implement at any time they choose while preventing you from going else where , while at the same time reducing what that charge actually covers .
I'm sure if we were private consumers being treated in this manor their would be some huge anti competition fines implemented on the company acting in this manor .

 

[Bald Rick]

@Chips

Probably not useful advice but we negotiated a service contract with Lely for a fixed sum. However this only covers the labour and travel as the consumables and any part needing replacement incurs an additional cost. And they do like to charge for telephone advice if you're not very careful with your 15 minutes of "free"
It might be worth sitting the new chap Lawrence Loxam down with a cup of tea & a slice of a rich cake and talk turkey? He's new so may be obliging?

 

[kill]

Well the trouble for me is the three nearest centres are all controlled by my local centre with the rest being far too far away for it to be in animal welfare interests to rely on for back up . So despite being told when being sold the robot the service cost would be linked to uk inflation it's as always the small print that catches you out aided and abetted by their flagrant disregard for fair competition , the lesson here being when buying a robot and looking at the affordability of the service costs remember to add in an 83% overnight increase in charges over and above that of UK inflation which they can implement at any time they choose while preventing you from going else where , while at the same time reducing what that charge actually covers .
I'm sure if we were private consumers being treated in this manor their would be some huge anti competition fines implemented on the company acting in this manor .

Oh dear. Just like wind turbine ownership!!!!

 

[clem dog]

Well the trouble for me is the three nearest centres are all controlled by my local centre with the rest being far too far away for it to be in animal welfare interests to rely on for back up . So despite being told when being sold the robot the service cost would be linked to uk inflation it's as always the small print that catches you out aided and abetted by their flagrant disregard for fair competition , the lesson here being when buying a robot and looking at the affordability of the service costs remember to add in an 83% overnight increase in charges over and above that of UK inflation which they can implement at any time they choose while preventing you from going else where , while at the same time reducing what that charge actually covers .
I'm sure if we were private consumers being treated in this manor their would be some huge anti competition fines implemented on the company acting in this manor .

Having followed the robot threads both here and the other side, I get the feeling that you never really have grown to love the robot or the company. It has been obvious that the machine has an issue with manual attach which seems to have been a complete thorn in your side.Perhaps I'm totally wrong in reading the situation, but perhaps it's time to change colour?

 

[happycows]

Or maybe go to something less machanical and reliant on one company.

With family showing interest i wouldn’t rule out going back too a parlour at all. I see loads of robots going in around here due to labour shortages, but personally I think they’ll all be very disappointed.

Fullwood are shutting there south west depot. They’ve been fumbling around desperately trying to get someone else to take it on. At this moment in time I wouldn’t have a clue who to contact in a emergency. The number of Fullwood robots working in Devon/Cornwall has fallen drastically with three multiple box setups having been switched off. I personally only know of 2 other Fullwood robot farms left down here.

Having my old robot for spares has been a godsend and probably the only way keeping the robots going here is possible. Also you’ll be surprised what you can get if you search the web. I bought a few new festo rams from America for half the price of a seal kit from Fullwood.

 

[Scholsey]

I had a huge issue with the control the lely service centre has over your busy when you are reliant on Lely robots for your income, that and the arrogance of the Lely dealer at the time for our area made me completely rule out Lely at a very early stage. Lely are bordering on being a cartel and it does really seem like you ever own the robot despite paying over 100k for it! Your just paying for the privilege of being told who is going to look after it and how much you will have to pay them, it seems like it has the downsides of a lease agreement and a straight purchase with none of the positives.

Fullwood are far from perfect and always seems to be some niggle going on, I worry about the huge amount of interest with the grants available at the moment towards new AMS units and the effect its going to have on the dealers/backup of all colours especially Fullwood.

 

[Leonb]

Has anyone ever been using robots without any service contract, and say stick to what ever software there running, just for example like an iPhone there’s always updated needed but it still works perfectly fine without doing it? Will the robot companies sell you parts if your not in a contract?

 

[Slowcow]

Out of curiosity, where are the fullwoods for sale on Sat?
I'm considering the merits of a s/h robot at the moment, thanks chips for your honesty, it seems to be a bit of racket with Lely and short sited of them. Delaval and fullwood bots seem more friendly to farmer servicing? If anyone would like to put me right on that please do ;-)