"...the worst disaster and largest capitulation in British history".

[ajcc]

Honda Swindon been running at less than half speed for years. 2 lines only one being used at all apparently.
As to farm subsidy, the system is badly
flawed we need a bespoke system farming just needs to ensure its voice is heard loud and clear at design stage....

 

[multi power]

He must be very intelligent to wright consistent drivel like that.

He is

 

[Yale]

Oh well,easy choice,Honda off the list when considering what to buy.

 

[neilo]

Don,t knock Honda, they seem to be the choice for your retired Solicitor or Bank manager, they are always parked in disability car parks or mother and child parking spaces in supermarkets. I would,t be surprised if Walter has one on the drive.

We bought a Civic 3 years ago, when we took on an extended school run of 30k miles a year, despite both thinking of it as a Grandad’s car. To be fair it averages between 50 and 65 mpg, whilst going like sh*t off a shovel and cornering like it's on rails. At 120k miles it still looks & runs like new, and has cost almost nothing other than the normal service items. It’s by far the cheapest car we’ve ever run, which is why it’s here while that school run continues.

 

[Cowabunga]

Oh well,easy choice,Honda off the list when considering what to buy.

I suppose that you do buy British built cars already? Of course you do.

 

[Yale]

I suppose that you do buy British built cars already? Of course you do.

German.......closer than Japan.

I do like the quality and ethics of Japanese made products however.

 

[Cowabunga]

German.......closer than Japan.

I do like the quality and ethics of Japanese made products however.

Thought perhaps not.

I bought my Honda's and Nissan's, and originally only considered them because they were built in Britain. Between the two brands I've bought five of their British built cars this century. I have found them to be excellent and a match for the foreign competition every time. In fact until Honda announced the petrol-only and imported CR-V I had seriously thought of replacing the Volvo with a second top of the range CR-V. I like it that much.

The only choice I now have left, and there are plenty of models to choose from, is LR or Range Rover. Lovely vehicles but I have bought many of their products over the years, including three new Range Rovers, a Discovery, and two Land Rover 110's plus earlier Series models and a Jaguar XK8, and found that when stuff goes wrong, and it does, that LR are the most arrogant dipshit of companies to deal with possible. They have nice fancy showrooms but their customer service for machines even well inside warranty, is an absolute disgrace. One of the more recent examples I can think of, apart from the current ongoing debacle with their six cylinder diesels, was with the front differential issue of 2001 to 2005 Range Rovers. People were left stranded all over the world and once past three years of age, they completely washed their hands of the issue. It took them five years to acknowledge the fault and issue a modified part and to reimburse customers who they forced to pay for repairs that were no better than the original. I really don't know why I bothered with them for so long and the only reason I still consider their vehicles today is because they are British built. That will soon rule the Discovery5 out and it also rules the new 'Defender' out as far as I'm concerned. There are plenty of better supported foreign built alternatives when JLR itself is no longer British owned and specific vehicles are built abroad. I still have a soft spot for their products, which is the sad thing.

 

[Yale]

Thought perhaps not.

I bought my Honda's and Nissan's, and originally only considered them because they were built in Britain. Between the two brands I've bought five of their British built cars this century. I have found them to be excellent and a match for the foreign competition every time. In fact until Honda announced the petrol-only and imported CR-V I had seriously thought of replacing the Volvo with a second top of the range CR-V. I like it that much.

The only choice I now have left, and there are plenty of models to choose from, is LR or Range Rover. Lovely vehicles but I have bought many of their products over the years, including three new Range Rovers, a Discovery, and two Land Rover 110's plus earlier Series models and a Jaguar XK8, and found that when stuff goes wrong, and it does, that LR are the most arrogant dipshit of companies to deal with possible. They have nice fancy showrooms but their customer service for machines even well inside warranty, is an absolute disgrace. One of the more recent examples I can think of, apart from the current ongoing debacle with their six cylinder diesels, was with the front differential issue of 2001 to 2005 Range Rovers. People were left stranded all over the world and once past three years of age, they completely washed their hands of the issue. It took them five years to acknowledge the fault and issue a modified part and to reimburse customers who they forced to pay for repairs that were no better than the original. I really don't know why I bothered with them for so long and the only reason I still consider their vehicles today is because they are British built. That will soon rule the Discovery5 out and it also rules the new 'Defender' out as far as I'm concerned. There are plenty of better supported foreign built alternatives when JLR itself is no longer British owned. I still have a soft spot for their products, which is the sad thing.

So it’s German or Japanese then.

 

[Cowabunga]

So it’s German or Japanese then.

No, it will probably be either Volvo, who actually still fit a lot of British built components, including the front and rear subframes, seat upholstery and so on, and it has the advantage of a dealer literally two miles down the road. Or it will be Land Rover again. Possibly a Discovery Sport or Velar. We've two new LR dealers, not quite locally but Shukers are 22 miles away and [formerly J V] Likes of Hay on Wye have been totally revamped and sold by Walters Group [of opencast mine fame] to Sinclair Group. So two new brooms who will hopefully sweep clean.
There's a heck of a lot to be said about a very local dealer though.

 

[glasshouse]

Walter is dead right about Singapore, we should never have lost that.
A total fuc up.
No tanks, and few aircraft, too much tennis and not enough jungle training
There was a very good article about the undignified and illprepared exit from india too.
A bit like the ferry co with no ferries, and the brexit sec who didnt realise that freight went through Calais
All down to camerons "chumocracy"

 

[roscoe erf]

 

[rob1]

Who says that Singapore has nothing to teach us?

The great calamity of 1942 (the quote is, of course, Churchill's) begat the disdain felt today for the English across much of Asia: overconfidence, under-preparation and an over-weening but unjustified sense of superiority led to an irreparable loss of both power and prestige. Pathos invests every moment of Arthur Percival's confrontation with reality, when he mumbled his surrender to Yamashita after vain attempts at circumlocution and denial.

England became a busted flush right there, right then, in front of the (non-existent) city walls.

No surprise, then, that Yamashita was executed after the Allied victory, on the slightest of evidence.

Today, it is the turn of the Japanese to treat the English with disdain - give them the runaround, and they'll close a factory. It is the Japanese way.

Can we say that the English ruling class have learnt anything since then?

I shake my head; whilst I read of the ongoing administrative shambles of DEFRA's agri-environmental schemes, I anticipate payment of my Glastir Entry and Advanced schemes which, these days, form the backbone of the farm business.

Last year it was paid on 1st February - the first day of the payment window, ending in June - and so this year I telephoned the ever-pleasant helpline in Caernarfon when payment didn't turn up. I was assured that the payment team was working on it, but that if I was anxious for payment I could write in and ask for expedition.

I am always anxious for payment, so I wrote on Wednesday, RPW received it on Friday; they paid it today (Tuesday).

If, in Wales, RPW means 'Rural Payments Wales' then what does DEFRA stand for across the border?

Reading the typical response to the Brexit sheep-flock cull proposal, I know that 'D', at any rate, stands for denial.

I'll leave you with a quote from another English leader; truly, 'nothing has changed'.

Perhaps if you spent more time working and less time being a bitter and twisted racist posting rubbish all day your business might stand on its own two feet and not be reliant on public handouts.

 

[Clever Dic]

Perhaps if you spent more time working and less time being a bitter and twisted racist posting rubbish all day your business might stand on its own two feet and not be reliant on public handouts.

Top post.

 

[egbert]

A sad indictment of the system to date IMO, and the reason that I voted for change.

How long can a country pay for public services when once productive industries are now charity cases?

I am glad to say that taxpayers money forms an ever diminishing percentage of my profits. If I did pack up, and the land was left unfarmed or bought at a knockdown price by the forestry commission then nature would thrive without the need for the environmental payments you rely on.

stepping sideways here.....
If uplands come out agreement, and go under trees, it won't be the FC buying the land, it'll be private investors.
And the trees will almost all be monocultured single age blocks, which hold stuff all wildlife.
Just saying.

 

[Muck Spreader]

Walter is dead right about Singapore, we should never have lost that.
A total fuc up.
No tanks, and few aircraft, too much tennis and not enough jungle training
There was a very good article about the undignified and illprepared exit from india too.
A bit like the ferry co with no ferries, and the brexit sec who didnt realise that freight went through Calais
All down to camerons "chumocracy"

Percival was a useless commander and was already defeated in his head by the time the Japanese had got halfway to the Johur Straits.

 

[Clever Dic]

Who says that Singapore has nothing to teach us?

The great calamity of 1942 (the quote is, of course, Churchill's) begat the disdain felt today for the English across much of Asia: overconfidence, under-preparation and an over-weening but unjustified sense of superiority led to an irreparable loss of both power and prestige. Pathos invests every moment of Arthur Percival's confrontation with reality, when he mumbled his surrender to Yamashita after vain attempts at circumlocution and denial.

England became a busted flush right there, right then, in front of the (non-existent) city walls.

No surprise, then, that Yamashita was executed after the Allied victory, on the slightest of evidence.

Today, it is the turn of the Japanese to treat the English with disdain - give them the runaround, and they'll close a factory. It is the Japanese way.

Can we say that the English ruling class have learnt anything since then?

I shake my head; whilst I read of the ongoing administrative shambles of DEFRA's agri-environmental schemes, I anticipate payment of my Glastir Entry and Advanced schemes which, these days, form the backbone of the farm business.

Last year it was paid on 1st February - the first day of the payment window, ending in June - and so this year I telephoned the ever-pleasant helpline in Caernarfon when payment didn't turn up. I was assured that the payment team was working on it, but that if I was anxious for payment I could write in and ask for expedition.

I am always anxious for payment, so I wrote on Wednesday, RPW received it on Friday; they paid it today (Tuesday).

If, in Wales, RPW means 'Rural Payments Wales' then what does DEFRA stand for across the border?

Reading the typical response to the Brexit sheep-flock cull proposal, I know that 'D', at any rate, stands for denial.

I'll leave you with a quote from another English leader; truly, 'nothing has changed'.

You can make history ( which there is a lot of) fit any political statement as fact.
Try this one ,
July 1940 at Mers El Kebir French fleet after their surrender holed up on the african coast. Britain is determined for the French fleet not to fall into German hands and sends a fleet to offer options of internment in a British port or even fight with the Royal Navy. The French can not decide and are worried how the Germans would react (sound familiar).So they decide to try and play for time.
Time is up and Churchill sends a message to German controlled europe and the rest of the free world. He orders the attack on the French fleet ,1 battleship is sunk others damaged and survivors dispersed never to fall into German hands.
Vichy France is appalled and De Gaulle livid, his liasion officer complains to Roosevelt and is met by the answer that the US would have acted exactly the same way.
The US and the free world now know that Britain no matter how bitter the pill will not give into Germany ,will continue the fight ,will take whatever steps are needed and is worth investing in.
Meanwhile europe waits for the USSR, US and Great Britain to forge a way out.
See ..

 

[Hilly]

Cadbury moved factory to Poland 2011 with EU grant.
Ford Transit moved to Turkey 2013 with EU grant.
Jaguar Land Rover has recently agreed to build a new plant in Slovakia with EU grant, owned by Tata, the same company who have trashed our steel works and emptied the workers pension funds.
Peugeot closed its Ryton (was Rootes Group) plant and moved production to Slovakia with EU grant.
British Army's new Ajax fighting vehicles to be built in SPAIN using SWEDISH steel at the request of the EU to support jobs in Spain with EU grant, rather than Wales.
Dyson gone to Malaysia, with an EU loan.
Crown Closures, Bournemouth (Was METAL BOX), gone to Poland with EU grant, once employed 1,200.
M&S manufacturing gone to far east with EU loan.
Hornby models gone. In fact all toys and models now gone from UK along with the patents all with with EU grants.
Gillette gone to eastern Europe with EU grant.
Texas Instruments Greenock gone to Germany with EU grant.
Indesit at Bodelwyddan Wales gone with EU grant.
Sekisui Alveo said production at its Merthyr Tydfil Industrial Park foam plant will relocate production to Roermond in the Netherlands, with EU funding.
Hoover Merthyr factory moved out of UK to Czech Republic and the Far East by Italian company Candy with EU backing.
ICI integration into Holland’s AkzoNobel with EU bank loan and within days of the merger, several factories in the UK, were closed, eliminating 3,500 jobs
Boots sold to Italians Stefano Pessina who have based their HQ in Switzerland to avoid tax to the tune of £80 million a year, using an EU loan for the purchase.
JDS Uniphase run by two Dutch men, bought up companies in the UK with £20 million in EU 'regeneration' grants, created a pollution nightmare and just closed it all down leaving 1,200 out of work and an environmental clean-up paid for by the UK tax-payer. They also raided the pension fund and drained it dry.
UK airports are owned by a Spanish company.
Scottish Power is owned by a Spanish company.
Most London buses are run by Spanish and German companies.
The Hinkley Point C nuclear power station to be built by French company EDF, part owned by the French government, using cheap Chinese steel that has catastrophically failed in other nuclear installations. Now EDF say the costs will be double or more and it will be very late even if it does come online.
Swindon was once our producer of rail locomotives and rolling stock. Not any more, it's Bombardier in Derby and due to their losses in the aviation market, that could see the end of the British railways manufacturing altogether even though Bombardier had EU grants to keep Derby going which they diverted to their loss-making aviation side in Canada.
39% of British invention patents have been passed to foreign companies, many of them in the EU
The Mini cars that Cameron stood in front of as an example of British engineering, are built by BMW mostly in Holland and Austria. His campaign bus was made in Germany even though we have Plaxton, Optare, Bluebird, Dennis etc., in the UK. The bicycle for the Greens was made in the far east, not by Raleigh UK but then they are probably going to move to the Netherlands too as they have said recently.

Anyone who thinks the EU is good for British industry or any other business simply hasn't paid attention to what has been systematically asset-stripped from the UK. Name me one major technology company still running in the UK, I used to contract out to many, then the work just dried up as they were sold off to companies from France, Germany, Holland, Belgium, etc., and now we don't even teach electronic technology for technicians any more, due to EU regulations.

I haven't detailed our non-existent fishing industry the EU paid to destroy, nor the farmers being paid NOT to produce food they could sell for more than they get paid to do nothing, don't even go there.
I haven't mentioned what it costs us to be asset-stripped like this, nor have I mentioned immigration, nor the risk to our security if control of our armed forces is passed to Brussels or Germany.

Find something that's gone the other way, I've looked and I just can't. If you think the EU is a good idea,
1/ You haven't read the party manifesto of The European Peoples' Party.
2/ You haven't had to deal with EU petty bureaucracy tearing your business down.
3/ You don't think it matters.

OUT OF EUROPE we need to be out of it

Not my words , i just copied and pasted , if 25% of is true that would be enough for me.

 

[Muck Spreader]

You can make history ( which there is a lot of) fit any political statement as fact.
Try this one ,
July 1940 at Mers El Kebir French fleet after their surrender holed up on the african coast. Britain is determined for the French fleet not to fall into German hands and sends a fleet to offer options of internment in a British port or even fight with the Royal Navy. The French can not decide and are worried how the Germans would react (sound familiar).So they decide to try and play for time.
Time is up and Churchill sends a message to German controlled europe and the rest of the free world. He orders the attack on the French fleet ,1 battleship is sunk others damaged and survivors dispersed never to fall into German hands.
Vichy France is appalled and De Gaulle livid, his liasion officer complains to Roosevelt and is met by the answer that the US would have acted exactly the same way.
The US and the free world now know that Britain no matter how bitter the pill will not give into Germany ,will continue the fight ,will take whatever steps are needed and is worth investing in.
Meanwhile europe waits for the USSR, US and Great Britain to forge a way out.
See ..

So are you suggesting a surprise attack on Brittany ferries whilst they are in port?

 

[Clever Dic]

So are you suggesting a surprise attack on Brittany ferries whilst they are in port?

Merely replying to @Walterp and one of his history parables.

 

[Ball acre]

Cadbury moved factory to Poland 2011 with EU grant.
Ford Transit moved to Turkey 2013 with EU grant.
Jaguar Land Rover has recently agreed to build a new plant in Slovakia with EU grant, owned by Tata, the same company who have trashed our steel works and emptied the workers pension funds.
Peugeot closed its Ryton (was Rootes Group) plant and moved production to Slovakia with EU grant.
British Army's new Ajax fighting vehicles to be built in SPAIN using SWEDISH steel at the request of the EU to support jobs in Spain with EU grant, rather than Wales.
Dyson gone to Malaysia, with an EU loan.
Crown Closures, Bournemouth (Was METAL BOX), gone to Poland with EU grant, once employed 1,200.
M&S manufacturing gone to far east with EU loan.
Hornby models gone. In fact all toys and models now gone from UK along with the patents all with with EU grants.
Gillette gone to eastern Europe with EU grant.
Texas Instruments Greenock gone to Germany with EU grant.
Indesit at Bodelwyddan Wales gone with EU grant.
Sekisui Alveo said production at its Merthyr Tydfil Industrial Park foam plant will relocate production to Roermond in the Netherlands, with EU funding.
Hoover Merthyr factory moved out of UK to Czech Republic and the Far East by Italian company Candy with EU backing.
ICI integration into Holland’s AkzoNobel with EU bank loan and within days of the merger, several factories in the UK, were closed, eliminating 3,500 jobs
Boots sold to Italians Stefano Pessina who have based their HQ in Switzerland to avoid tax to the tune of £80 million a year, using an EU loan for the purchase.
JDS Uniphase run by two Dutch men, bought up companies in the UK with £20 million in EU 'regeneration' grants, created a pollution nightmare and just closed it all down leaving 1,200 out of work and an environmental clean-up paid for by the UK tax-payer. They also raided the pension fund and drained it dry.
UK airports are owned by a Spanish company.
Scottish Power is owned by a Spanish company.
Most London buses are run by Spanish and German companies.
The Hinkley Point C nuclear power station to be built by French company EDF, part owned by the French government, using cheap Chinese steel that has catastrophically failed in other nuclear installations. Now EDF say the costs will be double or more and it will be very late even if it does come online.
Swindon was once our producer of rail locomotives and rolling stock. Not any more, it's Bombardier in Derby and due to their losses in the aviation market, that could see the end of the British railways manufacturing altogether even though Bombardier had EU grants to keep Derby going which they diverted to their loss-making aviation side in Canada.
39% of British invention patents have been passed to foreign companies, many of them in the EU
The Mini cars that Cameron stood in front of as an example of British engineering, are built by BMW mostly in Holland and Austria. His campaign bus was made in Germany even though we have Plaxton, Optare, Bluebird, Dennis etc., in the UK. The bicycle for the Greens was made in the far east, not by Raleigh UK but then they are probably going to move to the Netherlands too as they have said recently.

Anyone who thinks the EU is good for British industry or any other business simply hasn't paid attention to what has been systematically asset-stripped from the UK. Name me one major technology company still running in the UK, I used to contract out to many, then the work just dried up as they were sold off to companies from France, Germany, Holland, Belgium, etc., and now we don't even teach electronic technology for technicians any more, due to EU regulations.

I haven't detailed our non-existent fishing industry the EU paid to destroy, nor the farmers being paid NOT to produce food they could sell for more than they get paid to do nothing, don't even go there.
I haven't mentioned what it costs us to be asset-stripped like this, nor have I mentioned immigration, nor the risk to our security if control of our armed forces is passed to Brussels or Germany.

Find something that's gone the other way, I've looked and I just can't. If you think the EU is a good idea,
1/ You haven't read the party manifesto of The European Peoples' Party.
2/ You haven't had to deal with EU petty bureaucracy tearing your business down.
3/ You don't think it matters.

OUT OF EUROPE we need to be out of it

Not my words , i just copied and pasted , if 25% of is true that would be enough for me.

Can,t like that I’m afraid. It is by no means a comprehensive list either. HP sauce anyone?