what price have you contracted at?

[Beef farmer]

That's all I feed in the summer. I add 2-3% molasses to dampen the dust.
Why will it hamper cow flow ?

Why don't you feed it in the winter? What levels you feed it at?
We want to feed 3kg and keep the cows running out the parlour

 

[sidjon]

Been offered current blend May to Oct £3/t more than current price.

Ours has dropped £13 since Christmas, will get updated Wednesday and can see it's a couple quid cheaper.

 

[lazy farmer]

Spring blend £223’ 13%
summer blend £268. 17%
winter blend £285 22%
All forward bought
Avg £28 ton cheaper than last yr.
no idea whether that’s any good but it’s done and will save us near on 18k compared with 2023

 

[happycows]

We're seriously considering a blend of barley/beet/soya/mins
We've the shed to store, and means to get it in the bin, just do not want to hamper cow flow.
3 way blend as above is 40 quid cheaper than the lower end cake quotes.
90 quod cheaper than similar spec cake

I’ve just calculated something similar in savings. Maize,wheat,sugar beet pellets maize distillers and soya.
Straight 20t loads delivered. With distillers and soya coming premixed.
Will need a couple decent doors for suitable shed that’s here ready.

 

[ollie989898]

We're seriously considering a blend of barley/beet/soya/mins
We've the shed to store, and means to get it in the bin, just do not want to hamper cow flow.
3 way blend as above is 40 quid cheaper than the lower end cake quotes.
90 quod cheaper than similar spec cake

Is that a mixed and finished blend or are you talking about layering a lorry?

 

[ollie989898]

Spring blend £223’ 13%
summer blend £268. 17%
winter blend £285 22%
All forward bought
Avg £28 ton cheaper than last yr.
no idea whether that’s any good but it’s done and will save us near on 18k compared with 2023

Not bad at all. Is that right through until May 2025 you've fixed now?

It's a bit off firms not standing on a contract, they can contract buy the materials for months and years into the future. I mean if one raw material went force majeure I'd understand it but I'd expect them to do something to help their customers.

 

[Beef farmer]

Is that a mixed and finished blend or are you talking about layering a lorry?

Finished

 

[ollie989898]

Finished

Good savings, and no filler material, either.

 

[Enry]

Doesn’t really matter as they’ll call force majeure if wheat rises much above your contracted price. Had that game played on us last year.
Oddly, never works in reverse

As I understand FM can only be used in exceptional circumstances eg failure to source, NOT to get out of a contract price - you should challenge it.

 

[Bald Rick]

As I understand FM can only be used in exceptional circumstances eg failure to source, NOT to get out of a contract price - you should challenge it.

Ultimately the upward price eased and they honoured their contract but we could have been goosed either way as if we had back out, other feed companies had put their prices up in any case and by the time it was all sorted out things would have moved on.

Moral is that, in general, contracts will be massively loaded in the supplier's favour. Who can afford to legally fight them?

 

[Pigless]

We're seriously considering a blend of barley/beet/soya/mins
We've the shed to store, and means to get it in the bin, just do not want to hamper cow flow.
3 way blend as above is 40 quid cheaper than the lower end cake quotes.
90 quod cheaper than similar spec cake

The biggest advantage to doing this is that you know whats going into the cows. Lots of crap about!

 

[sidjon]

Ours has dropped £13 since Christmas, will get updated Wednesday and can see it's a couple quid cheaper.

Dropped £3/ton , have a contract running until May so going to play the gambling game until at least end of March, before doing anything

 

[Enry]

Ultimately the upward price eased and they honoured their contract but we could have been goosed either way as if we had back out, other feed companies had put their prices up in any case and by the time it was all sorted out things would have moved on.

Moral is that, in general, contracts will be massively loaded in the supplier's favour. Who can afford to legally fight them?

NFU? BFU? FUW? Never had an issue with a contracted price tbf, win some lose some. Transport surcharge went on, but that was in the terms, FM is thrown about but the legality is complex so I'm told

 

[ollie989898]

As I understand FM can only be used in exceptional circumstances eg failure to source, NOT to get out of a contract price - you should challenge it.

This was my initial first gut feeling also. My understanding was that you could only use force majeure in extreme circumstances. The market prices of product had nothing to do with it.

The companies bringing this material over are huge and backed by millions of pounds worth of capital, it would have to be something pretty drastic for them not to be able to source product given that someone is harvesting something somewhere nearly every month of the year.

 

[Serup]

I mix my own in the Keenan. That way i can buy from anyone and not all at the same time.
is that not common practice?

i have covered about 85% of what i need this year, and would have covered less if i knew what i know today.

 

[ollie989898]

I mix my own in the Keenan. That way i can buy from anyone and not all at the same time.
is that not common practice?

i have covered about 85% of what i need this year, and would have covered less if i knew what i know today.

Some companies will let you buy so much a month on contract at whatever price they can get.

Some companies will let you fix the price of individual ingredients when you think the price is right to do so. They all vary a fair bit seasonally. So you tell the company you will need say 200 tonnes over the whole October-April period. You know it will need to contain 25% rapemeal and 20% wheat. On one day you agree a price for the wheat that goes in. Some time later you fix the price of the rape and maybe the 30% inclusion of sugarbeet. The smaller inclusions such as molasses (mostly for dust) and minerals don't really move that much and so aren't worth worrying about in detail.

Mixing your own means being able to store and accurately weigh out straights and it all takes time. If you're using worthwhile amounts then I can see it working for larger farms. But you might only use a modest volume over winter you can't really buy small amounts of individual ingredients any sense.

Lots of blends might have 6, 8 or 10 different ingredients. Might also contain exotic ingredients like megalac or NIS etc that you might not anticipate needing in a winter.

 

[Serup]

Some companies will let you buy so much a month on contract at whatever price they can get.

Some companies will let you fix the price of individual ingredients when you think the price is right to do so. They all vary a fair bit seasonally. So you tell the company you will need say 200 tonnes over the whole October-April period. You know it will need to contain 25% rapemeal and 20% wheat. On one day you agree a price for the wheat that goes in. Some time later you fix the price of the rape and maybe the 30% inclusion of sugarbeet. The smaller inclusions such as molasses (mostly for dust) and minerals don't really move that much and so aren't worth worrying about in detail.

Mixing your own means being able to store and accurately weigh out straights and it all takes time. If you're using worthwhile amounts then I can see it working for larger farms. But you might only use a modest volume over winter you can't really buy small amounts of individual ingredients any sense.

Lots of blends might have 6, 8 or 10 different ingredients. Might also contain exotic ingredients like megalac or NIS etc that you might not anticipate needing in a winter.

But i still have to buy everything from the same seller. I find that it affect the price if they know you don’t ask elsewhere.

I always ask 3 places when i buy.
I calve all year around, so i use the same amount all the time. I use a lot now, but we have done it like this, since we started with tmr, with a lot less cows than today.

My current mix is made up of 8 ingredients. I cheat and buy a mineral blend, to keep it at 8 i have to mix.
Half the hassle is because soya is too expensive to use in larger quantity - feeding cows was easier when terms like “non-gmo” and “vlog” wasn’t part of the feeding vocabulary.
My total tmr is 14 ingredients i handle on farm. I find it the best way to get high yield at semi-reasonable feed costs. The milkcheck doesn’t cover the easy way.

 

[ollie989898]

But i still have to buy everything from the same seller. I find that it affect the price if they know you don’t ask elsewhere.

I always ask 3 places when i buy.
I calve all year around, so i use the same amount all the time. I use a lot now, but we have done it like this, since we started with tmr, with a lot less cows than today.

My current mix is made up of 8 ingredients. I cheat and buy a mineral blend, to keep it at 8 i have to mix.
Half the hassle is because soya is too expensive to use in larger quantity - feeding cows was easier when terms like “non-gmo” and “vlog” wasn’t part of the feeding vocabulary.
My total tmr is 14 ingredients i handle on farm. I find it the best way to get high yield at semi-reasonable feed costs. The milkcheck doesn’t cover the easy way.

Customers are always at liberty to contact other companies to find out what their blend or ingredients cost or what straights would cost.

The headache of buying and storing and mixing 14 ingredients on a farm is surely a non-starter.

I agree soya probably isn't worth it these days, I have a very good friend who hasn't fed it for years and he would be in the top 10% of herds in the country. Used protected rape and rolled maize as straights but is something of a perfectionist when it comes to silage making.

 

[Serup]

Customers are always at liberty to contact other companies to find out what their blend or ingredients cost or what straights would cost.

The headache of buying and storing and mixing 14 ingredients on a farm is surely a non-starter.

I agree soya probably isn't worth it these days, I have a very good friend who hasn't fed it for years and he would be in the top 10% of herds in the country. Used protected rape and rolled maize as straights but is something of a perfectionist when it comes to silage making.

The 14 ingredients is my total tmr. 8 of them is in my blend. Then straw, rolled wheat, caustic wheat, beet pulp (26% dm), grass and maize silage.

my blend is mineral mix, c16 fat, urea, maizegluten60, dried distillers grain, rape meal, rape cake, and soybean meal. So half in bags, half in lorry loads. I save almost what i paid for my 28 cube Keenan per year, mixing it on my own. Takes about 1-1,5 hour/week.

 

[Serup]

@Headless chicken
For your entertainment, my current plan. I forgot one ingredient, water 🫣
I hope you get what most of it is, it’s all listed in my previous post.
The goal is 38 kg ecm average on all lactating cows.
Total cost/cow/day is about 45% more than 2 years ago. I hope it will go down again soon.

It would cost me almost £30.000 extra per year to have my blend delivered ready to go, excluding what it would cost extra to buy everything from the same seller