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Where do we stand ?

delilah

Member
10 years uninterrupted use of a field.
Nothing ever put in writing.
Landlord saying it is a tenancy at will, so 30 days notice.
google suggests to me that, as we have never signed out of the '54 act, we may have a periodic tenancy, ie 6 months notice ?
Or, pushing it, does the lack of anything ever being in writing give more than 6 months security...?
TIA
 

Frank-the-Wool

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
East Sussex
10 years uninterrupted use of a field.
Nothing ever put in writing.
Landlord saying it is a tenancy at will, so 30 days notice.
google suggests to me that, as we have never signed out of the '54 act, we may have a periodic tenancy, ie 6 months notice ?
Or, pushing it, does the lack of anything ever being in writing give more than 6 months security...?
TIA

Have you ever paid any rent?
Have you done any recorded improvements to the field?
Have you had uninterrupted use of the field and can anyone confirm this?

You refer to "Landlord" so presume at some point in time rent or an agreement was in place, if so and this was not renewed on an annual basis such as a grazing agreement of 11 months or 364 days then it is highly likely a tenancy has been unwittingly created and you are in a protected position.
 

delilah

Member
Have you ever paid any rent?
Have you done any recorded improvements to the field?
Have you had uninterrupted use of the field and can anyone confirm this?

You refer to "Landlord" so presume at some point in time rent or an agreement was in place, if so and this was not renewed on an annual basis such as a grazing agreement of 11 months or 364 days then it is highly likely a tenancy has been unwittingly created and you are in a protected position.

Rent: some years paid cash, but most years in kind by taking landlords horse manure away.
Improvements: No; it may be argued that we have done the opposite through planting soft fruit on a portion.
Uninterrupted: Yes, plenty of witnesses.

Has only ever been a verbal agreement.
To complicate it: We have been unofficial sub-tenants. The main tenant has been instructed by the landowner to shift us.
 

delilah

Member
reckon you're stuffed m8...sorry....wasn't his to let and letting it to you might endanger his tenancy....just my 'laymans' view :scratchhead:

For sure, it wasn't his to let, it just seems to me that by saying we have a 'tenancy at will' they are attaching some form of legal status to our occupancy, and if so then maybe that occupancy is more secure than they suggest.
 

Frank-the-Wool

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
East Sussex
Rent: some years paid cash, but most years in kind by taking landlords horse manure away.
Improvements: No; it may be argued that we have done the opposite through planting soft fruit on a portion.
Uninterrupted: Yes, plenty of witnesses.

Has only ever been a verbal agreement.
To complicate it: We have been unofficial sub-tenants. The main tenant has been instructed by the landowner to shift us.

You are in a weak position, however if you are friends with the official tenant it may well depend on what the tenancy agreement states as if sub letting is permitted.
 

Humble Village Farmer

Member
BASE UK Member
Location
Essex
I reluctantly agree, although such short notice after 10 years seems unreasonable. Unfortunately some people are like that. I doubt you will gain anything from even discussing it with the landlord.
 

lim x

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Nottinghamshire
that's the problem: to where ?
Not complaining - our business model is based on fly grazing, it is a bed we must lie on - but as it stands this field is fundamental to our enterprise.

Then you should have made it official to your enterprise ten years ago.
We had to tender officially for grazing/silage land let to enable us to keep livestock. If someone had unofficially offered some grazing I would, without question, move on if asked.
 

delilah

Member
Then you should have made it official to your enterprise ten years ago.
We had to tender officially for grazing/silage land let to enable us to keep livestock. If someone had unofficially offered some grazing I would, without question, move on if asked.

As said, not complaining, just saying where we are at and exploring our options.
10 years ago we were new entrants. Things can become fundamental to your business without you realizing it.
 

Bury the Trash

Member
Mixed Farmer
In your position digging your heels in will only give you a reputation for being difficult and make it harder to get somewhere else.
Thank the land owner and the tenant for what you've had, and ask for a bit more time to find somewhere else.
As Lim x says above.
That's what I was thinking.
 

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Webinar: Expanded Sustainable Farming Incentive offer 2024 -26th Sept

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On Thursday 26th September, we’re holding a webinar for farmers to go through the guidance, actions and detail for the expanded Sustainable Farming Incentive (SFI) offer. This was planned for end of May, but had to be delayed due to the general election. We apologise about that.

Farming and Countryside Programme Director, Janet Hughes will be joined by policy leads working on SFI, and colleagues from the Rural Payment Agency and Catchment Sensitive Farming.

This webinar will be...
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