Who has replaced Guy Smith at Red Tractor?

[Sid]

A thought has occurred to me , sounds like Lloyd's has gone , I wonder if Wayne copes group will take on this work and if so will it bring around a change?
What do think @Sid Most/ all of his Inspectors are a good bunch .

In 24 years I've had one bad inspector.
I am not the only one that didn't like their attitude and the way they worked.

 

[Sid]

RT recognise other schemes. E.g. Scottish schemes are seen as equivalent, and so SQC grain can carry the RT logo. Same system could apply.
Slaughter houses, processors, retailers just need educating that organic has RT equivalence.

The "legal framework???" already exists in existing organic standards. Just a case of adding on the half dozen or so questions on to the end of the organic audit (optional add-on). If it costs £400k, then the boards want a clear out. Could be done for a few £k.

Bit like the BFU £10.

Bargain , farm assurance for a tenner, where do I sign?

Half a dozen questions

 

[Sid]

This is completely off topic, should go back to Guys replacement.

 

[Treg]

In 24 years I've had one bad inspector.
I am not the only one that didn't like their attitude and the way they worked.

Same here but most Inspectors say Organic Farmers have a different approach to Farm inspections because obviously we see more benefit through a price premium.
I actually meant with Wayne s group that there maybe more feed back to people above and think they'd have a fair approach on the whole to farm assurance.
Obviously depending on the pressure above to keep adding stress to Farmers, sorry I mean important box ticking so consumers know their food is safe.

 

[SilliamWhale]

No apology made.

I said I wish the have a basic assurance scheme if that's what the "consumer " requires

You're spinning it well now Sid - you must be getting dizzy.

If the "consumer" really wants assurance why do they mix grain with non assured imports? Can you buy Red Tractor assured cake from a feed mill? No. Can you buy RT assured bread? - no.

We have pointed out these massive inconsistencies and double standards from the very beginning. You know what they are and we know you know what they are. People are not stupid - they can see when there have been corporate shenanigans to restrict free and fair marketplace trading.

 

[Humble Village Farmer]

Yes, independent inspection bodies, who simply inspect as per the standards set by the scheme they're inspecting.

So instead of paying full price for organic cert + full price for RT, just pay for organic cert which could have an optional add-on for any of additional things covered by RT (but at fraction of the cost).

They won't like that

 

[Sid]

You're spinning it well now Sid - you must be getting dizzy.

If the "consumer" really wants assurance why do they mix grain with non assured imports? Can you buy Red Tractor assured cake from a feed mill? No. Can you buy RT assured bread? - no.

We have pointed out these massive inconsistencies and double standards from the very beginning. You know what they are and we know you know what they are. People are not stupid - they can see when there have been corporate shenanigans to restrict free and fair marketplace trading.

I've no dealing with grain, as I have said previously.
Outside of my knowledge base and no interest in getting specifically involved.

Assurance inspection , singular, covering off legal requirements I am happy with.
Rather than 2,4,6 or more sporadically throughout the year.

 

[SilliamWhale]

That's not a CBA situation IMHO, that's a I'll pay my dues and get "employ" someone else to represent my interests.
The issue with any representative organisation is they have to represent everyone, big, small, organic, conventional, arable , livestock.

Within those there is of course conflicts of interest.

I'm sorry but Red Tractor is hardly a conflict of interest. Its overwhelmingly unpopular because we know its market control by the back door via a monopoly and reducing choice and equal trading terms. Of course you are not going to get that information via a soft soap AHDB or Red Tractor "survey" which you seem to hold inordinate value on because they are not designed to find out that sort of thing.

It says volumes as an NFU acolyte that you can't see it, its the very reason farmers are leaving in protest. As I keep saying it wins the NFU only more enemies not friends and its not leadership its craven.

 

[SilliamWhale]

I've no dealing with grain, as I have said previously.
Outside of my knowledge base and no interest in getting specifically involved.

Assurance inspection , singular, covering off legal requirements I am happy with.
Rather than 2,4,6 or more sporadically throughout the year.

Well I can tell you straight that most of this fury has evolved from the grain assurance, because we can see how how organisations have coalesced to restrict free and fair trading. I'd suggest you have a read up about it.

 

[Grass And Grain]

They won't like that

They won't will they.

It's obvious the organic inspection covers most of RT, and obvious why NFU haven't stood up for the organic producers ('cos they'll lose RT members overnight).

Poor representation by NFU and self interest over what's right for the farmer member.

Bringing the discussion back to topic... Wonder if new RT Combinables chair will work with organic organisations and producers to see to it they don't need to also pay for RT due to duplication. Can RT recognise organic cert as food safety assurance similar to RT. Will the new chair sort this, or wish to keep the farmers locked in to the RT membership.

 

[Grass And Grain]

They won't will they.

It's obvious the organic inspection covers most of RT, and obvious why NFU haven't stood up for the organic producers ('cos they'll lose RT members overnight).

Poor representation by NFU and self interest over what's right for the farmer member.

Bringing the discussion back to topic... Wonder if new RT Combinables chair will work with organic organisations and producers to see to it they don't need to also pay for RT due to duplication. Can RT recognise organic cert as food safety assurance similar to RT. Will the new chair sort this, or wish to keep the farmers locked in to the RT membership.

Maybe AHDB can help their organic levy payers.

 

[Sid]

I'm sorry but Red Tractor is hardly a conflict of interest. Its overwhelmingly unpopular because we know its market control by the back door via a monopoly and reducing choice and equal trading terms. Of course you are not going to get that information via a soft soap AHDB or Red Tractor "survey" which you seem to hold inordinate value on because they are not designed to find out that sort of thing.

It says volumes as an NFU acolyte that you can't see it, its the very reason farmers are leaving in protest. As I keep saying it wins the NFU only more enemies not friends and its not leadership its craven.

It wasn't specifically RT I was describing within the conflict of interest context.
It could be GE or GM
Arable V livestock
Solar/rewilding/trees v food production

To represent all side is an impossible task.

Once again you have jumped to conclusions on what I can and cannot see.
You should really pay more attention IMHO

 

[Humble Village Farmer]

Maybe AHDB can help their organic levy payers.

Well if the ahdb don't soon do something for their levy payers, they will have had the chance.

 

[MrNoo]

The trouble is the more the NFU/RT nonsense gets worse, it’ll just drive food production towards solar, rewinding etc etc. maybe that is what the NFU’s gov remit is??
I’m throughly fed up with it, put 100ac into solar and would put the whole farm into it given the chance, that’s how pee'd off I am with it all.
Yet you carry defending the sham.
I’m not alone, speak to many others with the same views

 

[Sid]

Maybe AHDB can help their organic levy payers.

That's a joke!

I've challenged them on many occasions on what organic levy payers get for their money.

Chair of dairy board is an organic dairy owner.
Chair of AHDB is ex organic coop chair.

 

[Humble Village Farmer]

The trouble is the more the NFU/RT nonsense gets worse, it’ll just drive food production towards solar, rewinding etc etc. maybe that is what the NFU’s gov remit is??
I’m throughly fed up with it, put 100ac into solar and would put the whole farm into it given the chance, that’s how pee'd off I am with it all.
Yet you carry defending the sham.
I’m not alone, speak to many others with the same views

I'm thinking exactly the same. We're just working for the benefit of the likes of Frontier and Tesco

 

[Sid]

Well I can tell you straight that most of this fury has evolved from the grain assurance, because we can see how how organisations have coalesced to restrict free and fair trading. I'd suggest you have a read up about it.

I know the background, but haven't gone into detail.

 

[SilliamWhale]

It wasn't specifically RT I was describing within the conflict of interest context.
It could be GE or GM
Arable V livestock
Solar/rewilding/trees v food production

To represent all side is an impossible task.

Once again you have jumped to conclusions on what I can and cannot see.
You should really pay more attention IMHO

Farming is complex we all recognise that. No is disagreeing. We are talking about Red Tractor you know that.

I think you are being obtuse for the sake of it.

 

[SilliamWhale]

That's a joke!

I've challenged them on many occasions on what organic levy payers get for their money.

Chair of dairy board is an organic dairy owner.
Chair of AHDB is ex organic coop chair.

Then how did it feel to achieve no impact but at least go through the proper channels so at least if made you feel good that you were ignored in the correct way eh?!

My experience is that lots of high falutin organisations with a pumped up sense of self importance won't shift until they are acutely embarassed or shamed into doing something.

 

[SilliamWhale]

I know the background, but haven't gone into detail.

I think you to have a serious discussion about this you would need to know more.

Otherwise your lack of awareness of the topic means I think you are flip flopping