Could a self assured scheme be better than RT?

homefarm

Member
Location
N.West
I think we could serve all sectors better without the cost.

Any uk scheme will already offer traceability through the passport so that is above imports already.

AHDB could offer all levy payers a an Ebay/tripadvisor site where buyers merchants could give good and bad feedback thus giving them means the report bad practice and encourage good.
We could also have the counter site where farmers rate the trade and buyers in the same way.

Would this work better than the meaningless box ticking we do now?

Anyone any better ideas self assurance has to work for everyone in the chain.
 

Drillman

Member
Mixed Farmer
I’m always looking at ways of saving money,

And would quite happily join an alternative lower cost or better still a scheme that actually benefitted us as farmers.

The current RT farming profit reduction scheme isn’t doing What it set out to so some competition might make them focus a bit clearer.
 

Steevo

Member
Location
Gloucestershire
The reviews idea concerns me slightly.....you only have to look at Tripadvisor etc to see that reviews aren’t always reliable and only tell one side of the story.

I can see it stirring up bad feeling between parties, especially those that shout loudest or have axe to grind.

We should be working together collaboratively with those in the grain trade, not judging each other imo.
 

homefarm

Member
Location
N.West
I am open to other ideas but how do we work together collaboratively with those in the grain trade when mistakes happen.

From our point of view the injustice that their sample is representative of the 30 tonne load when our sample tests fine and the previous load was fine too.

Too the buyers who believe all farmers are trying to deliver out of spec grain because there testing is state of the art and is never wrong.

Feedback can be answered too, I could say sorry if I was wrong and offer an explanation. The mill could explain why low bushel grain needs to be discounted in their operation. Understanding each other's problems is the key to Working together.
 

MrNoo

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Cirencester
And who watches over the mills etc? They are a law unto themselves. They overbook lorries then find themselves full so lorries are turned away with dubious claims. Had one myself last year, making out they are whiter than white is wrong, same with the malsters, I know of a large outfit not a million miles away from here where all their barley only made feed despite making malting spec, still tipped in the malt pile, believe they settled out of court on that one.
In the old days a merchant would come out on farm, look at your pile, take a sample and then offer you a price, nowadays as soon as the lorry leaves site youre in the hands on the buyers, it's interesting that we're supposed to trust them but that they dont trust us!!
 

homefarm

Member
Location
N.West
And who watches over the mills etc? They are a law unto themselves. They overbook lorries then find themselves full so lorries are turned away with dubious claims. Had one myself last year, making out they are whiter than white is wrong, same with the malsters, I know of a large outfit not a million miles away from here where all their barley only made feed despite making malting spec, still tipped in the malt pile, believe they settled out of court on that one.
In the old days a merchant would come out on farm, look at your pile, take a sample and then offer you a price, nowadays as soon as the lorry leaves site youre in the hands on the buyers, it's interesting that we're supposed to trust them but that they dont trust us!!
There is another side to all these stories. They are our customers we should be able to speak directly with each other with to understand the other point of view.

I remember the Spanish miller who explained a £2 deduction for UK wheat was a in fact bonus
because french wheat was 12% moisture and UK 14.5%
 

MrNoo

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Cirencester
There is another side to all these stories. They are our customers we should be able to speak directly with each other with to understand the other point of view.
I agree but they always ensure there is a merchant/trader or two between them and us. If you have an issue the Miller/malster they can be particularly difficult to contact esp if spurious load rejection.
You only have to speak to the lorry drivers to know what occurs.
Anyway thread drift!
 

homefarm

Member
Location
N.West
I agree but they always ensure there is a merchant/trader or two between them and us. If you have an issue the Miller/malster they can be particularly difficult to contact esp if spurious load rejection.
You only have to speak to the lorry drivers to know what occurs.
Anyway thread drift!
It is not thread drift.

That is what feedback would allow, You can leave feedback, the mill/maltster has the right to reply and everybody can see the attitude and outcome.

It happens a bit on here but difficult to know the frequency or the mill responsible.

Could a mill risk lots of dodgy feedback everyday.
 

Eden.Agri.AD

Member
Mixed Farmer
Bear with me on this,
The waste industry has the qualification called WAMITAB, which basically is a NVQ which deems you technically competent to manage a waste management facility, every waste management facility has to have a WAMITAB qualified person on site at least 40% of the time. There is a few different levels of them but to achieve one of the top level ones you have to actively manage/own a waste management facility.
They cover a broad range of topics but the main being environmental and health & safety. I'm sure there is a few on TFF that have WAMITAB.

I do wonder if there was an agricultural version would it keep more of the wolves away. A qualification that covers a broad spectrum, pest control, health & safety, employee welfare, animal welfare, environmental matters etc etc. The qualification would deem you technically competent in farming basically and the rest of the industry would have to acknowledge you as that, no more being talking down too or being treated as an incompetent person.

Realistically a farmer that has been farming for years shouldn't have to prove that they are competent but sadly its the way that it is going.

If something like this would put the big stick back in the farmers hands to beat RT/Merchants/Retailers back with, what would be wrong with it?
 

Flat 10

Member
Location
Fen Edge
And who watches over the mills etc? They are a law unto themselves. They overbook lorries then find themselves full so lorries are turned away with dubious claims. Had one myself last year, making out they are whiter than white is wrong, same with the malsters, I know of a large outfit not a million miles away from here where all their barley only made feed despite making malting spec, still tipped in the malt pile, believe they settled out of court on that one.
In the old days a merchant would come out on farm, look at your pile, take a sample and then offer you a price, nowadays as soon as the lorry leaves site youre in the hands on the buyers, it's interesting that we're supposed to trust them but that they dont trust us!!
That's an interesting point. Really if RT worked for us they would be doing inspections of intakes and resolving disputes etc.......
 
That's an interesting point. Really if RT worked for us they would be doing inspections of intakes and resolving disputes etc.......

RT should be inspecting rejections and claims to ensure trust in the industry.

Lorry drivers have been complaining how Barley loads were rejected en masse. Probably because of lack of production.

We commit to a contract then find the rug pulled from under our feet, but you try doing it the other way around. They'd take your leg off at the neck.
 

MrNoo

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Cirencester
RT should be inspecting rejections and claims to ensure trust in the industry.

Lorry drivers have been complaining how Barley loads were rejected en masse. Probably because of lack of production.

We commit to a contract then find the rug pulled from under our feet, but you try doing it the other way around. They'd take your leg off at the neck.
In my case I was spoken to like something you trod in, make out that I was in error and if they didnt have a rectification letter within 28 days I was to be chucked out the stupid scheme.
I was the one that was made to feel like a mass murderer.
I had sold/moved near part of a 700t of milling wheat, no rejections, all in spec, in fact they were moaning about the protein being too high but still took it.
Had a call on the Friday morning load (I jikingly told the lorry driver it would be rejected) saying bugs in it, I knew there wasnt any in it as checked the heap while I waited for the lorry.
Load redirected to be cleaned, I asked if they could double check it as I knew there were no bugs meanwhile trader tried to contact mill but no reply.....
Lorry arrived at cleaning several hours later and sampled and zero bugs found, after this the mill became available (strangely) and then changed rejection to ergot. Needless I was pi**ed off is an understatement.
NSF or whoever they are still had it as my fault and suggested that I used a full rate fungicide program and wanted to know what I was going to do to stop this happening again.
Saying I wouldnt send any more wheat to that mill was an unacceptable answer apparently!!!
RT are systers, they do zero for us and I would go so far as to say they treat us like criminals
 

homefarm

Member
Location
N.West
In my case I was spoken to like something you trod in, make out that I was in error and if they didnt have a rectification letter within 28 days I was to be chucked out the stupid scheme.
I was the one that was made to feel like a mass murderer.
I had sold/moved near part of a 700t of milling wheat, no rejections, all in spec, in fact they were moaning about the protein being too high but still took it.
Had a call on the Friday morning load (I jikingly told the lorry driver it would be rejected) saying bugs in it, I knew there wasnt any in it as checked the heap while I waited for the lorry.
Load redirected to be cleaned, I asked if they could double check it as I knew there were no bugs meanwhile trader tried to contact mill but no reply.....
Lorry arrived at cleaning several hours later and sampled and zero bugs found, after this the mill became available (strangely) and then changed rejection to ergot. Needless I was pi**ed off is an understatement.
NSF or whoever they are still had it as my fault and suggested that I used a full rate fungicide program and wanted to know what I was going to do to stop this happening again.
Saying I wouldnt send any more wheat to that mill was an unacceptable answer apparently!!!
RT are systers, they do zero for us and I would go so far as to say they treat us like criminals
MrNoo we all dread Friday loads, I often say I am unable to load especially Friday afternoon unless it is a load for Monday.

You have not named the Mill so they are possibly still doing the same thing and only the victims know.

Ebay style feedback would let us all know when we needed to be unavailable to load.

The excuse is that they need to order more loads than they need because bloody farmer's refuse to deliver on spec. To get 20 loads of on spec wheat we need to order 25, barstewards. If we need to reject a good load on a Friday so be it, does not cost us a penny.

If that mill found they could no longer get wheat delivered on a Friday, perhaps they would find a different solution, like more storage or better communication regarding delivery.

Does any farmer mind having a load canceled at short notice?

Equally the farmers who send more than the odd accidental load which gets rejected would also stand out, and have to improve, so rejections go down and the problem has gone away.
 
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I won’t load Fridays unless I know it’s being tipped Monday.

Two years ago I sold borderline GP2 wheat to a merchant and he knew full well its was borderline on the protein. No problem he said, we will send it to Manchester, if it gets rejected it can go around the corner to the feed mill. I got up early that Friday to load it as I was out for the day.Mid morning I had a call to say it had been rejected on protein, no problem send it around the corner to the feed mill, merchants assistant, err it’s at bugbrooke, £8 redirection and loss of premium spoiled that day’s shooting! Not sold them a grain since.
 

Rejuvenating swards: Which option is best?

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Written by Brian McDonnell

Maintaining grass quality during mid-season grazing is important. Farmers can maintain quality by entering ideal grazing covers of 1,300 – 1,500kg DM/ha, and grazing down to a residual of 4cm every rotation.

If you are now in a situation where cows are not cleaning out paddocks as well as they should be, leading to the development of steamy grass within the sward, here are some options.

Common options for rejuvenating swards include:

  1. Take a silage cut, probably into bales, remove the material and start again with the aftermath...
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