Cross breeding Holsteins for block calving...?

[crashbox]

Considering cross breeding our holstein herd (e.g. with Jersey or Friesian) to help switch to autumn block calving.

Just wondering if anyone has done this, and what advice they would offer?

Bit more info here, in case that helps:

Closed herd, AYR, c. 9000 litres, very dry farm so Autumn block most viable as Summer grazing difficult.

Appreciate there would be a yield drop but hopefully offset by other benefits...?

Thanks,

CB

 

[organicguy]

No brainer, cross to Friesians, improve fertility, solids, feet loose,a little yield, improve cull and calf value. Have them dry June/July/August on standing hay when no grass growth, calve onto winter ration or Autumn flush depending on your farm.
The only question you need to ask is whether you do it quick(most pain, most gain) or slower,(less pain , more time to the economic gain.)
Factors such as climate and your milk contract need considering.
(I am available for consultation for a large fee)!!!

 

[dinderleat]

Or just stick with Holsteins doing similar here and moving to autumn block but at 10k Litres or 750kgms.
Plan to start calving from August the 1st this may change to September as would work well with school holidays. But graze night and day until weather conditions allow but house by mid October start serving 1st November feed hard through to turnout then if possible go all grass April onwards with turnout in the day early March. I’ve sold my Early summer calvers and Haven’t served anything since they all went so should have a 7 month block then will reduce this as we go forward. But hope to finish calving by Christmas.

 

[O'Reilly]

Considering cross breeding our holstein herd (e.g. with Jersey or Friesian) to help switch to autumn block calving.

Just wondering if anyone has done this, and what advice they would offer?

Bit more info here, in case that helps:

Closed herd, AYR, c. 9000 litres, very dry farm so Autumn block most viable as Summer grazing difficult.

Appreciate there would be a yield drop but hopefully offset by other benefits...?

Thanks,

CB

Is there anything actually wrong with your herd as it is?

 

[crashbox]

Is there anything actually wrong with your herd as it is?

We are currently all year round; it seems most autumn block calvers are using a cross breed or at least a smaller holstein?

Some points would be:
- Quite a lot of work and inputs for the milk we produce (block calving and a lower maintenance cow could help with this).
- Hard to encourage cows to make best use of grazed forage with current set up (buffer feed and out of parlour feeders as high yielders need good DM intakes + energy)
- Some high ground is a fair walk from the dairy (1.5 to 2 km), so I currently grow maize. A smaller cow could walk to this, then it could be grazing.

Of course all above can be improved on current AYR system but keen to know if and why people moved away from holsteins.

 

[buffalo_soldier]

How long would a crossbreeding program take, 10yrs?

Work with what you got as in the excellent post 3.
Or sell them and buy back some mongrels, thus keeping your herd value in your pocket rather than devaluing what you have.

I

 

[Beef farmer]

How long would a crossbreeding program take 10yrs?

Work with what you got as in the excellent post 3.
Or sell them and buy back some mongrels, thus keeping your herd value in your pocket rather than devaluing what you have.

I

Your block with 9k holstiens arnt you?

 

[vantage]

Your block with 9k holstiens arnt you?

One of my discussion group is 10k block and not an 11 month one either!

 

[buffalo_soldier]

They probably don't like to shout about it I guess, imagine if everyone worked it out

Whereas the mongel milkers, love a bit of conformation bias

 

[som farmer]

the hol breeders, are now producing bulls, that would match your requirements, as for xing, there are so many different systems/needs etc, that can easily become mind boggling, and everyones the best x. In all fairness, to the hol breeders, they have re-acted to current trends, rapidly, and they already have, an enormous gene pool to choose from. We tend to have more frx, suits us, but jx do as well. Many of the fr bulls available, are genomic, others, do not give you their physical traits. On the other hand, xbred tend to be cheaper to keep, and last longer, which is a good bonus, and, some of them will nearly match hols, for milk, we certainly have xbred capable of 9,000 upwards, we recently acquired one, that according to nmr, did 14,000 liters, in 305 days, we bought a bunch, on herd average, which was 7,500, so a bit of a shock ! I would say, health, and herd life span, would be the 2 best points, of xbred, yield, components, size etc, are why people go for them.

 

[Holsteinfriesian90]

the hol breeders, are now producing bulls, that would match your requirements, as for xing, there are so many different systems/needs etc, that can easily become mind boggling, and everyones the best x. In all fairness, to the hol breeders, they have re-acted to current trends, rapidly, and they already have, an enormous gene pool to choose from. We tend to have more frx, suits us, but jx do as well. Many of the fr bulls available, are genomic, others, do not give you their physical traits. On the other hand, xbred tend to be cheaper to keep, and last longer, which is a good bonus, and, some of them will nearly match hols, for milk, we certainly have xbred capable of 9,000 upwards, we recently acquired one, that according to nmr, did 14,000 liters, in 305 days, we bought a bunch, on herd average, which was 7,500, so a bit of a shock ! I would say, health, and herd life span, would be the 2 best points, of xbred, yield, components, size etc, are why people go for them.

Are Holsteins really getting better or are people just getting better at looking after them? They do suit the right system well but if your expecting them to graze all day in the pouring rain they won’t last.

 

[Llmmm]

[/QUOTE]

Considering cross breeding our holstein herd (e.g. with Jersey or Friesian) to help switch to autumn block calving.

Just wondering if anyone has done this, and what advice they would offer?

Bit more info here, in case that helps:

Closed herd, AYR, c. 9000 litres, very dry farm so Autumn block most viable as Summer grazing difficult.

Appreciate there would be a yield drop but hopefully offset by other benefits...?

Thanks,

CB

Friesan seems to be your safest bet to crossbreed with its been tried and tested.I can tell you from experience that first cross je x hol will be fertile but lack strength and be frail.The backcrosses are a disaster.Im currently trying norwegian red.

 

[som farmer]

Are Holsteins really getting better or are people just getting better at looking after them? They do suit the right system well but if your expecting them to graze all day in the pouring rain they won’t last.

as much as i dislike saying, hols are getting better, not suprising with the vast genetic pool, they can choose from, we haven't got many left, those that are, milk off grass, and get i/c, our oldest, is a 9th calver, av 9,5000 litres, 4.5 fat 3.3 protien, and i wish i had a herd like her. What really pees me off, is all the high PLI, ACI, that have a high SCI, something is at fault there.

Friesan seems to be your safest bet to crossbreed with its been tried and tested.I can tell you from experience that first cross je x hol will be fertile but lack strength and be frail.The backcrosses are a disaster.Im currently trying norwegian red.
[/QUOTE]
There lies the xbred problem, 1st crosses are great, 2nd are some and some, 3rd, a leap of faith, each x becomes less reliable, some brilliant, some good, and some crap. We have looked at, and have some, ayr x, tend to be lower fat, higher protien, jersy x as you said, fleks, don't seem to 'work' here, normandes, some and some etc. What we need, is a good solid, reliable cow, that breeds true, which leaves us Bfr or Hol, fr, haven't got the huge gene pool, the hols have, but, following years of pedigree breeding, by those 2, i am somewhat wary of going 'mongrel' again, which took decades to improve, to a true 'breed'.
Looking at bulls to use on our unexpected autumn block, interesting to see what is in, the various catalogues.