June 2022 SFI standards and payment rates

[4course]

Ive just wasted another hour of my time and worked out that roughly we have 170ha 420acre of the land we farm that would be eligible for the scheme without too much hassle. which, at £22/h amounts to a payment of £3740 however taking no account of any costs involved of ensuring we meet the criteria,rules etc amounts to about currently 12t of wheat (less than 1% of average output ) 6t of osr or 5t of fertilizer, To put it into something that those who thought up this crock can understand a portion of fish and chips but no mushy peas every day of the year to share between the 3 family members who gain their living from the farm.

 

[Grass And Grain]

no you can sell carbon sequestration and still claim SFI

i have just had payment for last years ISO carbon certificates from Agreena and my first SFI quarter payment is imminent following my Jan start date


i may leave SFI pilot however as CSS is looking a better option at the moment

Are you sure? As I read the below quote, if you had say a winter cover crop used for OM addition in a private carbon certification scheme, then you can't claim that for SFI? Same for chopping straw?

Not sure how RPA will know if farmer is in a private scheme.

Private sector schemes​

In 2022, you can enter the same area of land into an SFI standards agreement and a private sector scheme arrangement, such as carbon trading or payments for natural flood management.

This is only possible if you are not being paid twice for similar environmental land management actions legally required in your SFI standards agreement and the private sector scheme.

 

[Clive]

Are you sure? As I read the below quote, if you had say a winter cover crop used for OM addition in a private carbon certification scheme, then you can't claim that for SFI? Same for chopping straw?

Not sure how RPA will know if farmer is in a private scheme.

Private sector schemes​

In 2022, you can enter the same area of land into an SFI standards agreement and a private sector scheme arrangement, such as carbon trading or payments for natural flood management.

This is only possible if you are not being paid twice for similar environmental land management actions legally required in your SFI standards agreement and the private sector scheme.

i asked this very specific question on a stage in front of a couple of hundred people at Groundswell last year and the answer was that DEFRA had no intention of getting in the way of carbon markets developing

Janets answer will be on the groundswell youtube channel i‘m sure

 

[Grass And Grain]

i asked this very specific question on a stage in front of a couple of hundred people at Groundswell last year and the answer was that DEFRA had no intention of getting in the way of carbon markets developing

Janets answer will be on the groundswell youtube channel i‘m sure


i think double funding means double public sector funding ie css on sfi parcels etc

Janet's Groundswell answer appears contrary to the new rules. Or at least, clarification is needed.

Don't want to be the bearer of bad news, but if you are getting paid in a private scheme for non-inversion tillage, then that might prevent entry into the higher tier when it becomes available in a year or two's time.

I'm convinced DEFRA might be selling/using the carbon credits created by ELMS.

 

[Jackov Altraids]

Are you sure? As I read the below quote, if you had say a winter cover crop used for OM addition in a private carbon certification scheme, then you can't claim that for SFI? Same for chopping straw?

Not sure how RPA will know if farmer is in a private scheme.

Private sector schemes​

In 2022, you can enter the same area of land into an SFI standards agreement and a private sector scheme arrangement, such as carbon trading or payments for natural flood management.

This is only possible if you are not being paid twice for similar environmental land management actions legally required in your SFI standards agreement and the private sector scheme.

"The approach to private sector schemes will be reviewed by Defra annually."

So a clarification now could be changed next year.
What would the cost be of having to default on one of the agreements?

 

[Clive]

Janet's Groundswell answer appears contrary to the new rules. Or at least, clarification is needed.

Don't want to be the bearer of bad news, but if you are getting paid in a private scheme for non-inversion tillage, then that might prevent entry into the higher tier when it becomes available in a year or two's time.

I'm convinced DEFRA might be selling/using the carbon credits created by ELMS.

advanced soils already exis in pilot, i’m in it

i did ask very specifically about this at Groundswell for this very reason


i think DEFRA have purposely avoided carbon sequestration as a public good as they do know how to consistently measure it

 

[Clive]

"The approach to private sector schemes will be reviewed by Defra annually."

So a clarification now could be changed next year.
What would the cost be of having to default on one of the agreements?

it would be interesting for this to be clarified again @Janet Hughes Defra as well as Groundswell I think it may also have been a question in one of the TFF Q&A’s we did ?

however as it looks likely that i now have to choose between Sfi and CSS next January the answer may not matter

carbon sales pay better than sfi anyway

 

[Sorbaer]

To get £40/ha you need to do the OM lab tests, a soil management plan, have 70% green cover by end of December (many didn't plant a seed in Autumn 2019), and then have 20% in multi-species over winter cover crops.

4ha fields, that's 20 X lab tests at £10 each, and your own time taking those samples (say £70), so that's £270.

Produce a soil management plan, including soil texture classification. Say £150.

I'll presume you get 70% of area in crop cover or weedy stubbles by Xmas, so no cost for that.

20% (16ha) in overwinter cover crop. Legumes, brassicas, and some other plant classification which I can't remember. So you're probably looking at purchased seed at say £50/ha. £50/ha to drill it, £50/ha to spray it off and destroy it with a flail (suppose some will graze with sheep).
I'm calculating it a bit cheaper than that, so let's say £130/ha for all that X 16ha = £2080.

Then if you're a heavy land farm and profit best from Autumn sowing, you've now to sow the 16ha in Spring, with potentially a lower gross margin (spring cropping will work fine for some farms).

That all comes to a grand total of £2,500, but use your own figures and calculations.

RPA payment of £3,200, leaving you £700 for all the hassle and risk of having a non-conformance penalty, and filling out the claim form, and compromising your cropping plans.

Is that still worth it?

Personally, on my farm, it's not worth the hassle. I'm out.

Edit. The OM tests and soil man plan are one off costs. So average those over say a 5 year period. Sorry, messed up a bit

Agreed. What a complete waste of time this scheme is for anyone, including those who already farm the intermediate levels. Is £700 really worth the hassle when they will limit your farming options and you have to deal with them?! Pretty obvious answer IMO... It seems like all the money from an ending bps scheme that 'will still be the same amount available to farmers' is long gone into ridiculous admin costs.

 

[ajcc]

So applying for this is worse than doing nowt ?

With me it’s about trust, openness and transparency. All that glitters is not gold. Buyer beware.

 

[farmerm]

with inflation

i asked this very specific question on a stage in front of a couple of hundred people at Groundswell last year and the answer was that DEFRA had no intention of getting in the way of carbon markets developing

Janets answer will be on the groundswell youtube channel i‘m sure

a week is a long time in this period of change, a year is an astronomically long time and may represent an alternative reality!

 

[delilah]

So as a sheep farmer with nearly all unimproved pp, i cant do anything till 2024 , can see all the soil testing /reports eating a big hole in the small bit i might eventually get , utter waste of energy

Quick little story: Spoke with a chap yesterday about all this, he has farmed through 60+ years of agricultural policy so has seen it all from headage payments and drainage grants to set aside and everything in between. He agreed with me: Pay for PP to be maintained and crack on with farming the cropped land to the best of everyone's ability. ,

 

[delilah]

Anyone hear Julia Aglionby on farming today this morning ? Worth a listen, spoke more sense than most on all this.

 

[Clive]

Quick little story: Spoke with a chap yesterday about all this, he has farmed through 60+ years of agricultural policy so has seen it all from headage payments and drainage grants to set aside and everything in between. He agreed with me: Pay for PP to be maintained and crack on with farming the cropped land to the best of everyone's ability. ,

did he have lot of PP by any chance ?

 

[delilah]

did he have lot of PP by any chance ?

Funnily enough he is mainly arable.
There are lots of ways in which cropped land should be rewarded for 'public good' - attractive payments on watercourse margins and hedgerows. Maybe some innovate things such as a margin on the boundary of domestic property ? - but fannying about with attempts to meddle in the actual cropped area isn't a public good. Witness these countless threads and posts pointing out the shortcomings.

 

[BrianV]

So as a sheep farmer with nearly all unimproved pp, i cant do anything till 2024 , can see all the soil testing /reports eating a big hole in the small bit i might eventually get , utter waste of energy

All the pillocks at Defra have no interest in livestock farmers!

 

[ajcc]

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Anyone hear Julia Aglionby on farming today this morning ? Worth a listen, spoke more sense than most on all this.

I heard the interview sounded right noises but I think JA is on the board or recently left as a board member at Natural England. Seems in a minority of one talking any sense on that board.

 

[texelburger]

I am coming to the opinion that there should be a national agreement by all farmers to reject this scheme as unworkable and unrewarding

I think it's all playing into the hands of RSPB ,National Trust etc who have been involved in setting up the workings of SFI, ELMS and the Landscape recovery.Its becoming more and more complex and hard to follow with lots of ambiguity as shown by all the debate on here.I admit to not being able to follow or understand and payments are fairly miniscule.
The losers will be farmers, the very group the money was originally aimed at.RSPB and various other land owning charities, who helped set up the workings,will be the winners scooping up a lot of the cash available.

 

[Huno]

advanced soils already exis in pilot, i’m in it

i did ask very specifically about this at Groundswell for this very reason


i think DEFRA have purposely avoided carbon sequestration as a public good as they do know how to consistently measure it

But when they work it out and can measure carbon offset values they will u turn and ban us all from SFI or similar for a double funding excuse @Clive ... don't sellum yet!!

 

[farmerm]

All the pillocks at Defra have no interest in livestock farmers!

All the pillocks at Defra have no interest in livestock farmers!

 

[Clive]

But when they work it out and can measure carbon offset values they will u turn and ban us all from SFI or similar for a double funding excuse @Clive ... don't sellum yet!!

Unless the rates change I'm getting less bothered about being in SFI - its such a small about of money vs CSS and ISO carbon value its hardly worth the bother

selling last years sequestration has paid me nicely and even if selling carbon sequestration on SFI entered land does become unallowable as its sold on a year on year basis I could simply stop selling going forward if the sfi was more attractive (unlikely from what I see so far !) - the only longer term commitment made when selling ISO carbon certificates is not to deep cultivate for 5 years, thats not something of relevance to SFI that I can see

CSS is looking a much better option for us and nothing in that to prevent Carbon sequestration sale