Legality of Using Creosoted Posts for Stock Fencing

[Ukjay]

Good evening,

I have tried searching, but I have not been able to find the full sp on the use of Creosote Posts - be it that I am potentially not supposed to be able to buy them (as I'm not a trading farm - but our daughter has set out her equestrian business), but it is not clear to me if I am allowed to have them ahem, installed on our property, as I need to do some fencing work along a boundary, so thought I would check, as the adjoining land is the land that is being given to the ReWilding Trust - so as I do not want to waste money on tannelised crap, nor do I really want to go down the metal spikes route if possible.

Does anyone know the full facts on this to help me avoid any issues further down the line, as there is also a public style in part of the fencing line that I would potentially use something different there to avoid people touching it.

 

[ploughman1963]

I am not clear why you think creosoted post arent legal. You cant buy liquid creosote unless you are a professional user (fencing contractor or farmer) but I didnt think there was any issue with buying treated stakes?

 

[steveR]

Good evening,

I have tried searching, but I have not been able to find the full sp on the use of Creosote Posts - be it that I am potentially not supposed to be able to buy them (as I'm not a trading farm - but our daughter has set out her equestrian business), but it is not clear to me if I am allowed to have them ahem, installed on our property, as I need to do some fencing work along a boundary, so thought I would check, as the adjoining land is the land that is being given to the ReWilding Trust - so as I do not want to waste money on tannelised crap, nor do I really want to go down the metal spikes route if possible.

Does anyone know the full facts on this to help me avoid any issues further down the line, as there is also a public style in part of the fencing line that I would potentially use something different there to avoid people touching it.

Perfectly legal, BUT Stewardship type schemes won't accept it in some cases. Is the latter your concern?

 

[Wombat]

I am not clear why you think creosoted post arent legal. You cant buy liquid creosote unless you are a professional user (fencing contractor or farmer) but I didnt think there was any issue with buying treated stakes?

I thought there were limitations where you can use them, ie not on footpaths/watercourses etc

there was some guidance here but it looks like the links broken

Page not found - 404 error

www.hse.gov.uk

 

[Bury the Trash]

Perfectly legal, BUT Stewardship type schemes won't accept it in some cases. Is the latter your concern?

doesn't make sense to me that the very schemes that encourage the planting and protection of trees wont sanction the use of a wood preservative that makes the most of timber as a resource

 

[steveR]

doesn't make sense to me that the very schemes that encourage the planting and protection of trees wont sanction the use of a wood preservative that makes the most of timber as a resource

I "discussed" the sense in using shite short life treatments for a job against a river, that often lies wet. The job I had done 5-6 years previously, had all rotted off, admittedly with some of the fake treatment...

Steel was verboten too... Maybe the plastic ones will be an option in teh future...?

 

[Goweresque]

I am not clear why you think creosoted post arent legal. You cant buy liquid creosote unless you are a professional user (fencing contractor or farmer) but I didnt think there was any issue with buying treated stakes?

Could there be a limitation on fencing contractors installing creosote treated fencing in a domestic setting? If Joe Public is not supposed to be able to creosote his existing fence it would be a bit odd if he was still able to replace it with creosoted timber. I have to say I've not seen any new domestic fences put up using creo timber. They all seem to be the 'treated' crap or other things like concrete or plastic posts.

I would have thought that as long as the OP's land is being used for business in some way using creosoted posts would be perfectly legit.

 

[Frank-the-Wool]

Only use creosote strainers and stakes now.
Replacing ones put in 50 years ago.
Tanalised last a maximum of 10 years!!!

 

[Goweresque]

Here you go:

HSE authorises further uses for creosote-treated wood in UK - Fencing and Landscaping News

HSE authorises further uses for creosote-treated wood in UK We reported in WPA News 16 January 2017 that the Health & Safety Executive (HSE) had authorised creosote in the UK under The Biocidal Products Regulation (BPR) for industrial treatment of wood to be used as poles or sleepers. At the...

www.fencing-news.com

Creosote is authorised by the HSE for use (among other things) in livestock fencing (including equine) until March 2021. One assumes this is a rolling authorisation and its not going to be suddenly banned.

 

[Happy hillbily]

JFDI.
Put creosoted posts in, pointless using anything else, yes its going to cost a fortune, but replacing rotten posts in 5 years time will do too.
Fence properly now using good materials, and bar any accidents should last you your lifetime, and possibly some of your daughter's.
Don't worry about the rewilders the other side of your fence, their nothing but a bunch of lunatics. Anyway your going to need a good fence to keep all them wild animals out

 

[Ukjay]

I am not clear why you think creosoted post arent legal. You cant buy liquid creosote unless you are a professional user (fencing contractor or farmer) but I didnt think there was any issue with buying treated stakes?

I have read some conflicting literature that they cannot be purchased by non professional companies (although I can obviously buy them as well as creosote), but then also some say you can buy them, then some links say certain areas you cannot put them near, but I am not able to see concrete do's and don't.

This is why I thought I'd ask as there are a lot of people using them and obviously putting them near ditches etc, so thought the legalities may be widely known - as I will be running quite a bit along a dry ditch then along a ditch that has a flowing water?

 

[Ukjay]

Perfectly legal, BUT Stewardship type schemes won't accept it in some cases. Is the latter your concern?

Thank you. No, we will not be going into any schemes, just don't want to install the fencing only to be told rip it out and possible contamination claims.

 

[Ukjay]

I thought there were limitations where you can use them, ie not on footpaths/watercourses etc

there was some guidance here but it looks like the links broken

Page not found - 404 error

www.hse.gov.uk

This is why I'm looking deeper to avoid mistakes, as people use the footpath.

 

[Lincsman]

If anyone asks, its this;

Bartoline Dark brown Matt Creocote wood treatment 4L | DIY at B&Q

You can apply this creocote wood treatment from Bartoline to , using a brush, spray or dipping methods, to colour and provide protection. It takes 48 hours to dry and will cover 9 m² per litre on average.

www.diy.com

 

[Bogweevil]

Could there be a limitation on fencing contractors installing creosote treated fencing in a domestic setting? If Joe Public is not supposed to be able to creosote his existing fence it would be a bit odd if he was still able to replace it with creosoted timber. I have to say I've not seen any new domestic fences put up using creo timber. They all seem to be the 'treated' crap or other things like concrete or plastic posts.

I would have thought that as long as the OP's land is being used for business in some way using creosoted posts would be perfectly legit.

Creosoted posts allowed for domestic fences etc, but not where hands could be laid on them, which rather limits their use, the act speaks thusly:

Prohibition on use of treated wood
6.—(1) Subject to paragraph (3) wood treated in accordance with regulation 4(2)(a) or to which regulation 5(5) applies may not be used—

(a)inside any building;

(b)in toys;

(c)in playgrounds;

(d)in parks, gardens and outdoor recreational and leisure facilities where there is a risk of frequent skin contact; [Apparently railway old sleepers left for years in the permanent way pose a lower risk and can be used]

(e)in the manufacture of garden furniture (such as picnic tables); or

(f)for the manufacture of—

(i)containers intended for growing purposes;

(ii)packaging which may come into contact with raw materials, intermediate or finished products intended for human or animal consumption; or

(iii)any other materials which may contaminate the products mentioned in this sub-paragraph

(2) The items mentioned in paragraph (1)(f) may not be retreated with a dangerous substance or preparation.

(3) The prohibition in paragraph (1) on the use of treated wood does not apply where the treated wood was in such use before these Regulations came into force.

The Creosote (Prohibition on Use and Marketing)(No. 2) Regulations 2003

These Regulations implement Commission Directive 2001/90/EC (OJ No. L283, 27.10.01, p. 41). They revoke the Creosote (Prohibition on Use and Marketing) Regulations 2003 (S.I. 2003/721) (“the 2003 Regulations”) using the power contained in section 11 (5) of the Consumer Protection Act 1987. This...

www.legislation.gov.uk

 

[Lincsman]

Creosoted posts allowed for domestic fences etc, but not where hands could be laid on them, which rather limits their use, the act speaks thusly:

Prohibition on use of treated wood
6.—(1) Subject to paragraph (3) wood treated in accordance with regulation 4(2)(a) or to which regulation 5(5) applies may not be used—

(a)inside any building;

(b)in toys;

(c)in playgrounds;

(d)in parks, gardens and outdoor recreational and leisure facilities where there is a risk of frequent skin contact; [Apparently railway old sleepers left for years in the permanent way pose a lower risk and can be used]

(e)in the manufacture of garden furniture (such as picnic tables); or

(f)for the manufacture of—

(i)containers intended for growing purposes;

(ii)packaging which may come into contact with raw materials, intermediate or finished products intended for human or animal consumption; or

(iii)any other materials which may contaminate the products mentioned in this sub-paragraph

(2) The items mentioned in paragraph (1)(f) may not be retreated with a dangerous substance or preparation.

(3) The prohibition in paragraph (1) on the use of treated wood does not apply where the treated wood was in such use before these Regulations came into force.

The Creosote (Prohibition on Use and Marketing)(No. 2) Regulations 2003

These Regulations implement Commission Directive 2001/90/EC (OJ No. L283, 27.10.01, p. 41). They revoke the Creosote (Prohibition on Use and Marketing) Regulations 2003 (S.I. 2003/721) (“the 2003 Regulations”) using the power contained in section 11 (5) of the Consumer Protection Act 1987. This...

www.legislation.gov.uk

Whats on an electric pole then?

 

[Ukjay]

Could there be a limitation on fencing contractors installing creosote treated fencing in a domestic setting? If Joe Public is not supposed to be able to creosote his existing fence it would be a bit odd if he was still able to replace it with creosoted timber. I have to say I've not seen any new domestic fences put up using creo timber. They all seem to be the 'treated' crap or other things like concrete or plastic posts.

I would have thought that as long as the OP's land is being used for business in some way using creosoted posts would be perfectly legit.

This is the conundrum. The land will be used in Part for supporting the daughters business, but is also tied to the house.
We will also be putting some sheep on it to help avoid too much tractor use on it, but it will not be a commercial sheep flock.

 

[Goweresque]

This is the conundrum. The land will be used in Part for supporting the daughters business, but is also tied to the house.
We will also be putting some sheep on it to help avoid too much tractor use on it, but it will not be a commercial sheep flock.

The regulations I quoted above specifically state that its authorised for livestock use so if you're keeping sheep (regardless of whether or not they are a business) then you're fine.

To be honest its a JFDI scenario. There's no creosote police going around looking for illegal fences.

 

[ploughman1963]

I have read some conflicting literature that they cannot be purchased by non professional companies (although I can obviously buy them as well as creosote), but then also some say you can buy them, then some links say certain areas you cannot put them near, but I am not able to see concrete do's and don't.

This is why I thought I'd ask as there are a lot of people using them and obviously putting them near ditches etc, so thought the legalities may be widely known - as I will be running quite a bit along a dry ditch then along a ditch that has a flowing water?

According to the report referred to above, it just says creosoted posts should not be placed directly in fresh water

 

[gatepost]

I used Creo for all the grant work, as directed, crack on.