Sfi/elms

Farma Parma

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Northumberlandia
I know some who are plugging ten years worth of input and yield map data into clever analaytics software to create long term profitability maps which you can then forecast against different commodity prices and scenarios to see what outcomes will be. You can then use that data against your own scenario costings and due dilligence to make a more informed decision.
I know of one who found out 30% of his farm was regularly losing money and diluting the profit/yield. Was admittedly a large farm. Meant a restructure of machinery/overheads and a chunk of land out of production. Profits up. Haven’t done it yet myself but considering if only to be sure it’s actually the right thing to do and if the areas I suspect aren’t performing are as I think they are.
We all have them areas but they Schemes want you still too loosing some prime producing land i'll bet to go past there version of monoply & collect that £200 if you know what i mean
 

ajd132

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Suffolk
Our mixed farm with its plough based system ticks as many 'conservation agriculture' boxes as does any all arable farm employing DD. Which pretty much proves the point that we shouldn't be using public money to interfere in crop establishment techniques.
I’m not going to get drawn into a debate about this. I respect your view but I’m not interested in going round in circles anymore
 

Two Tone

Member
Mixed Farmer
Sure, not looking to go round in circles, just wanting to drive the point home for the policy makers on here.
@Janet Hughes Defra
Talk about kettle calling the pot black!

I’m absolutely sure that Janet knows exactly who is trying to influence policy makers with misnomers about the environmental benefits of DD, such as yourself.

Carry on and keep digging that whole (which is also bad for the environment btw).

But, what are you going to tell the farmers in the future who went bust, who were put off from adopting a system that could have kept them solvent by the likes of you?
 

delilah

Member
misnomers about the environmental benefits of DD,

Sigh. You can call me a Luddite, stupid and all the other insults you have thrown at me, that is your prerogative. However, please don't accuse me of saying things I have not said; not once on here have I questioned or criticized DD.
 

delilah

Member
Opportunity to input to ELMS at the ORFC on Thursday.

https://orfc.org.uk/orfc-2022/



Thursday, January 6th
What Progress On Environmental Land Management Schemes And Wider Farm Policy?
The Church
9:00 AM-10:30 AM
DescriptionHear from Defra, farmers and sector experts then make your own assessment of current ELM design and early roll-out in workshop format exploring four topics: i. Assess the overall design, clarity and direction of travel for Environmental Land Management and identify priority areas that need addressing and how ELM supports a whole farm systems approach; ii. Hear key learnings from those involved in tests and trials and pilots; iii. Assess the early SFI pros and cons - discuss forms of improvement; and iv. Look ahead to the other ELM components - Local Nature Recovery (LNR) design and trials - what should feature and what should be paid for? Workshop responses will be collated and fed back to Defra.
Speakers
 

Overby

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
South West
You can get more than a £150 a hectare for a cereal crop so I don’t get why you would take less and farm a bird cover for 5 years ? Or am I missing something
If you like tractor driving etc correct, but if you diversify other bits of your farming business and don't want the hassle of growing cereals and / or owning the relevant kit it may suit? Like everything, horses for courses. That's my take anyway.
 

Overby

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
South West
Had a farm inspected October 2021 for a mid tier arable offer commencing January 2021. Was a tad surprised! Few things we knew wrong. Inspector was very reasonable. no penalties applied but advice and agreement will check in Spring. Hopefully seeing the first of non EU driven ‘Eustace’ inspections.
WE were inspected 3 years back, all was correct (ie we put in slightly extra ab9 etc, 'just in case') but the new regime is more flexible, you get time to correct genuine errors, it's not just straight to the maximum fine, as was previously the case.
 

Overby

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
South West
I know some who are plugging ten years worth of input and yield map data into clever analaytics software to create long term profitability maps which you can then forecast against different commodity prices and scenarios to see what outcomes will be. You can then use that data against your own scenario costings and due dilligence to make a more informed decision.
I know of one who found out 30% of his farm was regularly losing money and diluting the profit/yield. Was admittedly a large farm. Meant a restructure of machinery/overheads and a chunk of land out of production. Profits up. Haven’t done it yet myself but considering if only to be sure it’s actually the right thing to do and if the areas I suspect aren’t performing are as I think they are.
Lots of this going on, equally lots too terrified to look into it for what they may find!!
 

steveR

Member
Mixed Farmer
There’s nothing in cross compliance that says you need to grow crops for BPS either but farmers still do it
Again, I agree totally with you.

But it is down to individual choice. I have effectively stopped farming certain areas and altered different aspects of the farmland useage at times, and taken the Govt shilling, as I felt it was the most appropriate choice..... at that time. I have left land "fallow" more than once and been happy with the area payment, as cropping would have been unviable for one reason or another.

All this change and moves, and IMO, the farmer who does not react accordingly, can effect their income negatively.
 

steveR

Member
Mixed Farmer
For sure, the way the two lower tiers have been amended (ie the DD sub removed) makes them pretty much open to all.
( Which then begs the separate question; in spreading the pot over so many cropped acres, can the payment level per acre be high enough to be worth it ?) .
The bone of contention with many of these posts, is over the third tier, ie a sub for DD. I've said it wont happen, so I guess I shouldn't really react at all.
I have more or less decided that for my business, planting 35/40ha of Bumblebird mix/annum with a DD makes sense with the money coming from STW scheme, so if HMG wants to may me a few quid more, I am happy to take the dosh. I will be waiting with hand outstretched... :)
 

ajd132

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Suffolk
I have more or less decided that for my business, planting 35/40ha of Bumblebird mix/annum with a DD makes sense with the money coming from STW scheme, so if HMG wants to may me a few quid more, I am happy to take the dosh. I will be waiting with hand outstretched... :)
Lower overheads accordingly and sell the carbon too and you will be way better off than with bps!
 

Nitrams

Member
Location
Cornwall
Stewardship looks a bit underwhelming atm, bit might look better than Nitram at say £500/t, wheat at £150 and one of those seasons where it struggles to yield 3t/acre. Or one of those seasons where it's too wet to sow in Autumn, so we drill S. Barley, then no rain and 1.5t/acre @£130/t.

Who knows what will happen with yields and prices.
Stewardship isn't very exhilarating, but does put a base profit in a proportion of the land, just sleepless nights worrying what the inspector will say. Hey ho.
Are any of these variables known or quantifiable before taking a CS agreement?
 

Nitrams

Member
Location
Cornwall
The problem is that to fit in with Sfi and claim the £130/ha we will likely have to compromise on yield and reliability of yield, by changing farming systems which is going to cost more that £130/ha or just 600kg/ha yield at todays prices. A safer bet would be to continue with current systems which have been fine tuned for generations adapted to individual farms and are far more resilient
Where is the 130/ha payment? Or is this to come
 

ajd132

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Suffolk

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

  • 0 %

    Votes: 105 40.5%
  • Up to 25%

    Votes: 94 36.3%
  • 25-50%

    Votes: 39 15.1%
  • 50-75%

    Votes: 5 1.9%
  • 75-100%

    Votes: 3 1.2%
  • 100% I’ve had enough of farming!

    Votes: 13 5.0%

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