The squeeze on milk and meat continues...

[Cowabunga]

then perhaps you have clives cows then ,most arable farmers will suffer as much in the scenario that you predict

You must miss most of my posts because I have said this from the start and again in my last few posts. See post 414 for the most recent.

 

[Raider112]

You object to plain speaking and facts. I suggest that you wake up and smell the coffee.

So you're telling me to get out of livestock farming? Are you a livestock farmer?

 

[digger64]

Then I am right and you are plain wrong. The owner of this web site himself is farming sustainably with no animals and so are the majority of arable farmers.

like this one ?

 

[Cowabunga]

So you're telling me to get out of livestock farming? Are you a livestock farmer?

I'm not telling you what to do. I'm telling you what current policies and trends are and trying to explain what it means to you if they are carried through. What you do or don't do about it is your business. In fact I don't really care if you agree or not but don't come back in three or ten year's time and say your weren't warned.

I really do hope that policies and the rhetoric will change but the train has already left the station and it currently seems unstoppable.

 

[Raider112]

I'm not telling you what to do. I'm telling you what current policies and trends are and trying to explain what it means to you if they are carried through. What you do or don't do about it is your business. In fact I don't really care if you agree or not but don't come back in three or ten year's time and say your weren't warned.

I really do hope that policies and the rhetoric will change but the train has already left the station and it currently seems unstoppable.

You're good at saying a lot but avoiding answering questions

 

[Hilly]

Bill won’t be fighting with his own kind he will be forging ahead .....

 

[Cowabunga]

like this one ?

I'm not sure what you are trying to say but his economics will need adjusting if ruminant livestock decline spectacularly. It will be over a number of years of course, not an overnight thing. There will still be a reduced animal feed sector of course unless they go after chickens and pigs next. There will still be a reduced herd of cattle long into the future of course but the small producers and many big ones are likely to be squeezed out unless they have capital from other sources propping their enterprises up. Like the prolific builder and developer in South Wales that used to own a slaughterhouse and farm and is now buying land and actually going into large scale milk production with, apparently it is said, his own bottling plant. All from nothing and financed from large scale housing developments.
Best of luck to him even though his enterprise will be a further nail in many other dairy farmer's enterprises.
Everything is going reasonably well apart from pigs at the moment and I think that is giving people a false sense of long term security. I do hope that Government policy and the attempts at replacing meat and milk fall floppy-dead [Alice in Wonderland style] but over the last few years the momentum for change has been rapidly building. We shall see over the next two years which way the wind is really blowing.

 

[Cowabunga]

You're good at saying a lot but avoiding answering questions

Perhaps you lack comprehension skills. I avoid very few questions indeed, which is what annoys many people like [obviously] yourself.
If you want me to actually tell you what to do with your business, how to cope, you pay me a fee that I decide is fair in advance. It is probable that there are cheaper and better consultants more local to you.

 

[Raider112]

Perhaps you lack comprehension skills. I avoid very few questions indeed, which is what annoys many people.
If you want me to actually tell you what to do with your business, how to cope, you pay me a fee that I decide is fair in advance.

Well I asked 2 questions and you answered neither, I always assumed you were a livestock farmer but you aren't prepared to admit to that so maybe I'm wrong and I'm certainly not paying you to find out so I'll just have to guess what you are, the most likely ones are a fantasist, a wind up merchant or a bullhitter, am I close?

 

[Cowabunga]

Well I asked 2 questions and you answered neither, I always assumed you were a livestock farmer but you aren't prepared to admit to that so maybe I'm wrong and I'm certainly not paying you to find out so I'll just have to guess what you are, the most likely ones are a fantasist, a wind up merchant or a bullhitter, am I close?

Not within a country mile and you know it. You are resorting to trolling and I chew more skilled trollers than you and spit them out on a regular basis.

 

[Raider112]

Not within a country mile and you know it. You are resorting to trolling and I chew more skilled trollers than you and spit them out on a regular basis.

Maybe I was right the first time then but you don't have the mindset of a farmer, we get lots thrown at us but we plough on and it usually turns out ok, you seem to take rather too much satisfaction in our imminent downfall to be a farmer.

 

[Raider112]

Not within a country mile and you know it. You are resorting to trolling and I chew more skilled trollers than you and spit them out on a regular basis.

Delilah was right earlier though, you have a bad patronising habit, no need.

 

[Red Fred]

 

[Raider112]

Anyway, bedtime, we both have cattle to see to early in the morning

 

[digger64]

I'm not sure what you are trying to say but his economics will need adjusting if ruminant livestock decline spectacularly. It will be over a number of years of course, not an overnight thing. There will still be a reduced animal feed sector of course unless they go after chickens and pigs next. There will still be a reduced herd of cattle long into the future of course but the small producers and many big ones are likely to be squeezed out unless they have capital from other sources propping their enterprises up. Like the prolific builder and developer in South Wales that used to own a slaughterhouse and farm and is now buying land and actually going into large scale milk production with, apparently it is said, his own bottling plant. All from nothing and financed from large scale housing developments.
Best of luck to him even though his enterprise will be a further nail in many other dairy farmer's enterprises.
Everything is going reasonably well apart from pigs at the moment and I think that is giving people a false sense of long term security. I do hope that Government policy and the attempts at replacing meat and milk fall floppy-dead [Alice in Wonderland style] but over the last few years the momentum for change has been rapidly building. We shall see over the next two years which way the wind is really blowing.

The food industry is much bigger than just farmers I dont think its as politically simple as you make out .
You keep trying to justify your retirement/exit from the industry but you dont seem to wish to follow your strong convictions though ,if you like it why worry ?

 

[Cowabunga]

Delilah was right earlier though, you have a bad patronising habit, no need.

You start it and I'll finish it. Contrary to your previous assertion I do not avoid it. And you know damn well what I do as shown in the post 434 above. So you were trolling and I do not avoid trolls as a rule.

 

[Cowabunga]

Maybe I was right the first time then but you don't have the mindset of a farmer, we get lots thrown at us but we plough on and it usually turns out ok, you seem to take rather too much satisfaction in our imminent downfall to be a farmer.

You don't like the message so try to shoot the messenger. I get that. You don't like the messenger shooting back. I get that too.

Where you get that idea of me "seem to take rather too much satisfaction in our imminent downfall to be a farmer" is a mystery. I think it is potentially tragic for many livestock farmers in the long term and based on many mistaken ideas. However I can see things both from the farmer's perspective and from 'the other side', which one has to if one is to counter issues effectively without resorting to obvious bullcrap.

Unlike others here, I do not attribute evil intent to most of those that are pushing for the severe reduction in ruminant and therefore ruminant farmer numbers and certainly not to people like Bill Gates who I believe is doing it for purely altruistic and noble reasons as he sees them. Neither am I going to ignore the obvious pressures and trends and rules being imposed on the industry and again neither am I going to demonise the novel new products with no evidence whatsoever to back it up whether on nutrition or safety grounds. With a bit of luck there will be a massive cock-up in the production of a product that will put people completely off for years [without harming anyone in the process], but unless this happens the train is accelerating out of the station and greenhouse gas and carbon reduction targets are getting ever more ambitious with completion dates being brought forward rather than delayed. The powers that be are telling us point blank that there are profound changes on the way soon, yet a lot of us are completely ignoring it and, let's face it, the majority of us are currently ticking along just fine, apart from pig farmers.

 

[Old apprentice]

There could be even more green house gasses produced with this type of food production I use the words food production with scepticism. Would you like to look up what Allan Savery has done in arid parts of the world on you tube I first learned about him from groundswell.

 

[Ukjay]

What’s wrong with living on slaughtered animals, we’ve done it for thousands of years

For me, I enjoy eating a balanced diet which includes real meat - not really fond of Steak to be honest, as the quality is so wildly different week to week that I begrudge paying for the crap, as it is an expensive non enjoyable meal if you end up with a dogs dinner.
However - just because we have done something for thousands of year - does not therefore mean it will prevail, like some other long established practices gone before.

 

[Macsky]

Meat and dairy intake escapes stricter UK climate goals - Farmers Weekly

Stricter government targets on climate change will not include forcing people to eat less meat or dairy. The new government target is to cut greenhouse

www.fwi.co.uk