UK sinking under an ocean of debts?

[BrianV]

When debt triggers crashes its only the essentials that maintain worth, food, water, and energy.

This debt crisis is diffrent to the stock market crash in 2007, as others have said it’s governments debt, not the banks, the banks were folding that would have crashed the whole system, if a banks holds your house under a mortgage then in fact they own it so if the bank goes bust then your home can be pulled in to cover the debt, so it’s sold to repay the mortgage you owed, you can see how that different from the government owes more money.
the spiral the banks going bust was causing is not the same as governments extending borrowing.

As for musk, He did it, because he had stock options that were ending if he didn’t use them he lost them, so he used them, that triggered very large tax bills so to cover that income, he sold some of the shares he holds about 20%, of his total that he received from his stock options and personal holdings, to cover the tax.
the impression I get is he only sold as many as he needed too, the trades he did were watched and the trade understood he needed to sell 20% to cover his tax bill, and he only sold 20%. Most analysts still bet on the stock going up in value.

I shouldn’t bet your house on it, the Chinese are not stupid they let Tesla into their country for a reason & believe me it’s not because they love America!

 

[roscoe erf]

Time to find a desert island

you won't be able to afford the rent

 

[Dave645]

I shouldn’t bet your house on it, the Chinese are not stupid they let Tesla into their country for a reason & believe me it’s not because they love America!

The government don’t hold the mortgage on anyone’s house.
As for Tesla in China, so are a lot of car companies, nothing new there, a lot of companies moved production to China to avoid import tax China impose, China is one of the worlds biggest car markets it makes sense to avoid import taxes and import costs, and take advantage of local labour markets.

I agree China looks after China, China can see a good investment when they see one, and a good product, they also like to steal designs, and clone stuff, unless you have production in China the Chinese car market is near impossible to get into.

 

[bluebell]

that was one of trumps bigist beefs? the fact that china wanted and had it all one way as far as imports into the US but exports of cars into china, same as he had a big problem with european car imports into the US, ie, BMW mercedes etc, but tarriffs the other way if they the US wanted to export cars into Europe?

 

[Boomerang]

Its called investment, tsking the long term view
Something totally foreign to the uk shortsighted mentality

Investing in a NON profitable business seriously how many years you going to give it .
What other business can lose money for so long and keep going .
It's more like blind greed .

 

[Boomerang]

That is America all over though, investors will throw money at someone who they think has the next bright idea. In reality, making a car is a serious business- most engineers will tell you that just designing the doors on a vehicle can take months. Now consider drive by noise, emissions, NVH, suspension, etc etc etc you name it and you realise why it is years between new models being launched.

Tesla's products include what seems to be the latest tech but in reality their build quality is terrible. It won't be long before Toyota and the rest have wide ranges of fully electric cars and are kicking Tesla's arsh in volume terms. There isn't much else to engineer in- batteries and motors are established technologies which are already mature.

Ford sell more pickup trucks (just pickup trucks ) than tesla entire production .
Musk must be laughing himself silly .
Has anyone thought why Is he selling tesla stock ,whilst expecting others to fund /gamble /invest in tesla.

 

[serf]

So if there’s all this debt in the world who has the money?

some old boy in a hollowed out volcano?

Ponzi scheme...

 

[ollie989898]

that was one of trumps bigist beefs? the fact that china wanted and had it all one way as far as imports into the US but exports of cars into china, same as he had a big problem with european car imports into the US, ie, BMW mercedes etc, but tarriffs the other way if they the US wanted to export cars into Europe?

The Chinese don't really sell cars into Europe. And they can't because many of their companies steal the designs of cars in the West.

 

[2wheels]

The Chinese don't really sell cars into Europe. And they can't because many of their companies steal the designs of cars in the West.

mg? not a big seller at the moment but picking up in our area.

 

[ollie989898]

mg? not a big seller at the moment but picking up in our area.

1 brand? Out of the myriad of models sold in China.

 

[andybk]

mg? not a big seller at the moment but picking up in our area.

carrying on the traditions of British Leyland carp cars with a short lifespan

 

[zero]

It's all possible because it's just the perceived wealth that countries have that keeps them going. Money only exists on the ground to keep the population happy, but for those in power of nearly every country it's just numbers on a computer screen and a lip service guarantee that the cash exists. Which is why there wasn't a run on any banks in the last financial crisis, and the world keeps bumbling along as it does today.

 

[Breakthru]

Michael burry (predicted the subprime mortgage crisis) gave up his large short position on Tesla as he believed that these companies no longer behave according to traditional indicators. How Tesla could be worth more than Toyota is an absolute mystery.

In the 90's my pension adviser told me to change my fund choices around.
At that time I had them split equally between commercial property (predominantly London) Managed Fund and Far East ( Essentially at that time Japan). He wanted me to reduce Comm property increase Japan and Managed fund. I told him to clear me out of Japan and reduce managed fund by 50% and put it all into Comm Property. Not a happy bunny.
2 years later when Jap Stock market dropped from 33000 to about half and Comm property had increased by 70% he asked me what I knew. When Tokio was worth more than the whole of the US somebody got it wrong. My unfortunate expression was when a bunch of slanty eyed dwarfs (the supposed master race) living in paper mache huts was worth more than the Yanks in total then there were too many dreamers and idiots. Recently Goldmine sax said oil would be 200$ by Xmas. Guy called Curry said 50$. He was bang on. Guess who employs him now! Keep your friends close but your enemies even closer. The Vampire Squid G sax forecast Bitcoin at $100,000. Dropped like a stone. These guys want to suck you in so always take the alternative view. B

 

[stewart]

Ford sell more pickup trucks (just pickup trucks ) than tesla entire production .

And yet Teslas market capitalisation is more than the other top 10 car manufacturers around the world combined.

 

[oil barron]

Ford sell more pickup trucks (just pickup trucks ) than tesla entire production .
Musk must be laughing himself silly .
Has anyone thought why Is he selling tesla stock ,whilst expecting others to fund /gamble /invest in tesla.

He had to sell the stock to pay the tax bill on the stock options because he doesn’t draw any salary. He lives off debt he takes on against the value of Tesla. He doesn’t even own a house. It’s good to see a CEO who actually has true belief in his company and put everything on the line for it.

He is the modern day Brunel. It’s great to be alive at the same time and witness it.

 

[oil barron]

Investing in a NON profitable business seriously how many years you going to give it .
What other business can lose money for so long and keep going .
It's more like blind greed .

AMAZONE didn’t turn a profit for 20 years, but it was probably the best investment you could have made in 2001.

 

[dave mountain]

AMAZONE didn’t turn a profit for 20 years, but it was probably the best investment you could have made in 2001.

They must be selling more fert spinners than I thought

 

[Muck Spreader]

The Chinese don't really sell cars into Europe. And they can't because many of their companies steal the designs of cars in the West.

Two Chinese car makers copies of the Range Rover, the LandWind X7 and the Hunkt Canticie. All yours from around £14,000.

 

[dave mountain]

He had to sell the stock to pay the tax bill on the stock options because he doesn’t draw any salary. He lives off debt he takes on against the value of Tesla. He doesn’t even own a house. It’s good to see a CEO who actually has true belief in his company and put everything on the line for it.

He is the modern day Brunel. It’s great to be alive at the same time and witness it.

Ford sell more pickup trucks (just pickup trucks ) than tesla entire production .
Musk must be laughing himself silly .
Has anyone thought why Is he selling tesla stock ,whilst expecting others to fund /gamble /invest in tesla.

I would love somebody to explain the value of Tesla.
2021 was the first year that Toyota has been the best selling brand in the USA, as well as the best selling brand globally (which it has held since 2008). Has the biggest dealer network and parts supply network in the world. They sell 9.5 million vehicles a year which they can share parts, design costs etc over, including many parts which are transferrable to EVs. Also has a joint venture with Panasonic (arguably the best battery manufacturer in the world), as well as the worlds best and most established reputation for reliability. When they start releasing mainstream electric cars Tesla will not be able to compete on price (or build quality), and will become a premium brand reserved for the very wealthy in those small parts of the world where reliability is unimportant (like Jaguar Land Rover) That's my 2p prediction anyway. No way Tesla has more value than Toyota.

 

[Dave645]

Ford sell more pickup trucks (just pickup trucks ) than tesla entire production .
Musk must be laughing himself silly .
Has anyone thought why Is he selling tesla stock ,whilst expecting others to fund /gamble /invest in tesla.

But the market for non EV’s is ending in 2 ways legislation, and the public’s choice, so the old car companies mentality is like saying I make millions of last year 2020 calendars, and hope that when 2021 comes along they still want to buy them?
Ford is hoping to make in 3 years time the number of EV’s that Tesla make now, and you just said that Ford make more trucks per year than Tesla makes EV’s, that becomes a liability for Ford not a strength.
When you have a production line that costs billions to convert from 2020 calendars to 2021 calendars it’s no longer and advantage to be making a lot of 2020 calendars.
Ford hopes to be in the possition Tesla is now in 3 years time, in three years time Tesla will be be producing as many vehicles as VW or GM do now,
Tesla’s cost base will fall while the other cars companies is rising as they transition over production to EV’s.
It’s a no brainier.
Tesla is the new Amazon, as other have said it took Amazon 20 years to make a real profit, Tesla did it in 14.
And they have 2 new factories starting production this year, with their own dedicated battery production factories to supply them.

battery constraints will stifle the competitors ability to build EV’s they for the most part rely on other companies to supply them GM had to stop production of their bolt EV because they had a massive recall to sort out, which stopped all EV car production.
even Tesla has been battery limited with its products, Tesla is a charge network, solar, battery, battery storage, for grid and home, car company, with software, drive train, battery, etc etc development in house.
half of the other car companies barely make cars, they just design them and put them together for the most part.
If any of the other car companies have a chance it will be VW if they get them selves out of their own way.

that’s not to say that Tesla is not over valued, but I think investors can see where they are headed and are incorporating future values and valuations in the current stock price.