Advice on buying a mengele sh 40

[beaconsboy]

I've read loads of threads about choppers. The mengele seems to come out on top. So is there much difference between the blue and red and the later blue and black 1s. We got 200hp. Is it too much. Read you can get wider pulleys to stop them eating belts. How much does it cost for this. How many extensions do you need to fill big trailers. Are bits still available. All advice please. Or other breads considered

 

[mengeleguru]

Blue and red up to 1995. 1996 were blue only & blue & black from 1997 with a galvanised bed, the old style beds had 4 tine bars becoming 5 bar machines and a little later the auger was made to lift up when selecting reverse.
The best machines were probably made in the late 90,s as the paint work in the early 2000’s was poor.

The ideal horse power is approximately 185 as the machine gives a bit & the tractor too, above that you may have belt problems as the tractor says I’m off you can follow if you like.

We have one running at 300 horse power but with a few special modifications, 8 v belt pulleys , stronger bearings etc but that one is a one off & gives a self propelled a run for its money.

standard height is 12’ approx but 2 height extensions can be put in ,11” each.

Bits are readily available.

Power in straight lines , no wastage, various pulley sizes to change horse power settings , chop lengths from 6 mm to 38 mm , fit extra paddles & the blow will clear 2 trailers.

Can be adapted to many different applications, see below, 1 we did a little while ago.

Hope this helps

Anything is possible

 

[beaconsboy]

Thanks for the advice. Do you still sell them .anything kicking about.

 

[Lofty1984]

Blue and red up to 1995. 1996 were blue only & blue & black from 1997 with a galvanised bed, the old style beds had 4 tine bars becoming 5 bar machines and a little later the auger was made to lift up when selecting reverse.
The best machines were probably made in the late 90,s as the paint work in the early 2000’s was poor.

The ideal horse power is approximately 185 as the machine gives a bit & the tractor too, above that you may have belt problems as the tractor says I’m off you can follow if you like.

We have one running at 300 horse power but with a few special modifications, 8 v belt pulleys , stronger bearings etc but that one is a one off & gives a self propelled a run for its money.

standard height is 12’ approx but 2 height extensions can be put in ,11” each.

Bits are readily available.

Power in straight lines , no wastage, various pulley sizes to change horse power settings , chop lengths from 6 mm to 38 mm , fit extra paddles & the blow will clear 2 trailers.

Can be adapted to many different applications, see below, 1 we did a little while ago.

Hope this helps

Anything is possible

Any videos of the one running on 300hp

 

[mengeleguru]

Only video with the new 300 forager

 

[Oh Deere]

Age less important than condition.
Try and find a machine with good wearing parts as new knives , shear bar and wear plates will cost a fortune your sharpening stone and belt also expensive wear items. Check when the front flywheel bearing was done last as poorly set up or poorly sharpened knives will cause grass to wrap around the bearing with failure following. There is a modification with a sleeve inside a sleeve to stop grass entering. We found the pickup was not the best in heavy crops . we would go through the pickup every year with new tine bar bushes and cam bearings but we were pushing the machine hard in very heavy crops. Never really had much trouble with the power band and was using in excess of 200hp but not a tractor with boost.. Fantastic machine which was made well. When it was completely worn out you could strip it back to the chassis and rebuild which is something you can't do with any other forager and we've tried. Dont get me started on bloody JF or Pottinger. Both very good machines at eating grass but not for year after year. 2 choices buy the best you can afford or my choice would be to buy a older machine and completely rebuild I used to enjoy the rebuilding more than the driving.. Or if you want some proper fun weld a bloody big engine in the drawbar.

 

[devonshire farmer]

We bought a second one last summer for an insurance policy, if we have a breakdown mid silaging we just switch and sort it out after, when you have a gang of blokes on it soon pays for itself, only downside is it's another thing to keep in the dry!

 

[beaconsboy]

Age less important than condition.
Try and find a machine with good wearing parts as new knives , shear bar and wear plates will cost a fortune your sharpening stone and belt also expensive wear items. Check when the front flywheel bearing was done last as poorly set up or poorly sharpened knives will cause grass to wrap around the bearing with failure following. There is a modification with a sleeve inside a sleeve to stop grass entering. We found the pickup was not the best in heavy crops . we would go through the pickup every year with new tine bar bushes and cam bearings but we were pushing the machine hard in very heavy crops. Never really had much trouble with the power band and was using in excess of 200hp but not a tractor with boost.. Fantastic machine which was made well. When it was completely worn out you could strip it back to the chassis and rebuild which is something you can't do with any other forager and we've tried. Dont get me started on bloody JF or Pottinger. Both very good machines at eating grass but not for year after year. 2 choices buy the best you can afford or my choice would be to buy a older machine and completely rebuild I used to enjoy the rebuilding more than the driving.. Or if you want some proper fun weld a bloody big engine in the drawbar.

Thanks for the advice. Got a chance of 1 that has been all rebuilt after an insurance claim. But been left out for a good few years. Do they get metal fatigue. I think it's a 1999 year. Gray and black. It's 5k. Is a wide angle shaft important.

 

[devonshire farmer]

Thanks for the advice. Got a chance of 1 that has been all rebuilt after an insurance claim. But been left out for a good few years. Do they get metal fatigue. I think it's a 1999 year. Gray and black. It's 5k. Is a wide angle shaft important.

We started out with a standard PTO but you really have to switch PTO off on the ends and it knocks when you do your headland turns, not ideal!

 

[jf850]

We bought a second one last summer for an insurance policy, if we have a breakdown mid silaging we just switch and sort it out after, when you have a gang of blokes on it soon pays for itself, only downside is it's another thing to keep in the dry!

30 or 40s ?

I suppose 30s are very rare .

A friend bought 1 owner , used for 600 acres 30N around 2003 . It had sat unused for years . I think it is 1986 . He used it for his own use of about 100 acres for 4 years , before buying a late 90s 40N , which would have had much more work done , but gone through , and new blades/shearbar . His reason mainly being the built in hydraulics on the 40N . He always picked 10 fts , and I dont recall there being massive difference in output . Both driven by an old Ursus 385 with a Perkins 372 conversion .
He has an ex demo Lely Storm this past 2 years , driven by an MF 3690 . I have never seen it working , but another friend drives it for him , and reckons output is seriously good . Cant beat horses in front of a flywheel machine .

 

[devonshire farmer]

30 or 40s ?

I suppose 30s are very rare .

A friend bought 1 owner , used for 600 acres 30N around 2003 . It had sat unused for years . I think it is 1986 . He used it for his own use of about 100 acres for 4 years , before buying a late 90s 40N , which would have had much more work done , but gone through , and new blades/shearbar . His reason mainly being the built in hydraulics on the 40N . He always picked 10 fts , and I dont recall there being massive difference in output . Both driven by an old Ursus 385 with a Perkins 372 conversion .
He has an ex demo Lely Storm this past 2 years , driven by an MF 3690 . I have never seen it working , but another friend drives it for him , and reckons output is seriously good . Cant beat horses in front of a flywheel machine .

We have 2 40's run them on MF 7495

 

[danpwll]

go and see W and M agri in Oswestry, know them inside out !!!!

 

[mengeleguru]

SH 30’s were made till 1987. Then obviously became SH40 in 1989. , bear in mind that all of the major parts still fit all of the SH 40’s machines from then right up till the Lely 300 came out. 16 Years. shear bar, stone etc still the same now.

This was good because dealers could stock parts because they fit many machines.

J F 3 or 4 models 3 or 4 sets of parts

Regarding out put a good SH40 in good maintainance should do 70 acres as day with 180 HP . We look after many machines & one with a bit of gigery pokery does 130 acres every day.

The machine loves grass so don’t give it 10’ Get it rowed up.

You can’t run after the crop , get the feed roller full , keep it full , cuts better, blows better, uses less diesel per acre , you only as quick as the slowest part of the foraging experience & it won’t be you on the forager.

Two in to one moves it on to dry ground , leave it a couple of hrs. Magic. Don’t start me on rowing up ?

The best modification I have ever seen was done locally by a contractor , young lad with good ideas , he put an engine behind the flywheel on a frame and an extra wheel on a rocking beam axle on the right hand wheel , it’s own fuel tank, controls from the cab & an over run on a P T O shaft that connected on the the main shaft hub on the cutting cylinder. When short of power , heavy crop, up hill just turn the key & an extra 100 H P went straight in to the back of the flywheel.

Don’t need it just turn it off overrun takes over.

Best engine addition I have ever seen.
Still sits in a shed not far from me.

 

[jf850]

SH 30’s were made till 1987. Then obviously became SH40 in 1989. , bear in mind that all of the major parts still fit all of the SH 40’s machines from then right up till the Lely 300 came out. 16 Years. shear bar, stone etc still the same now.

This was good because dealers could stock parts because they fit many machines.

J F 3 or 4 models 3 or 4 sets of parts

Regarding out put a good SH40 in good maintainance should do 70 acres as day with 180 HP . We look after many machines & one with a bit of gigery pokery does 130 acres every day.

The machine loves grass so don’t give it 10’ Get it rowed up.

You can’t run after the crop , get the feed roller full , keep it full , cuts better, blows better, uses less diesel per acre , you only as quick as the slowest part of the foraging experience & it won’t be you on the forager.

Two in to one moves it on to dry ground , leave it a couple of hrs. Magic. Don’t start me on rowing up ?

The best modification I have ever seen was done locally by a contractor , young lad with good ideas , he put an engine behind the flywheel on a frame and an extra wheel on a rocking beam axle on the right hand wheel , it’s own fuel tank, controls from the cab & an over run on a P T O shaft that connected on the the main shaft hub on the cutting cylinder. When short of power , heavy crop, up hill just turn the key & an extra 100 H P went straight in to the back of the flywheel.

Don’t need it just turn it off overrun takes over.

Best engine addition I have ever seen.
Still sits in a shed not far from me.

Is the flywheel bigger in a 40 , versus a 30 ?

Are parts different/available for a 30 ? Or are they basically scrap now ?
There is supposed to be a small SP Mengele in a shed about 3 miles away which might be for sale . Hasn't run in years .
Would that be a 30 , mated to a 160 hp odd Deutz engine ?

 

[mengeleguru]

30 - 40 very different,spout same, later 30’s drawbar same other than that no

Spares hard to get for a 30 , blades shearbar etc ok

Flywheel bigger & completely different in a SH40.

Sh 30 now spares only realy

Old self propelled it’s a no .

 

[beaconsboy]

Where can you get a book about setting the machines up. Clearly it's doesn't sound an easy job.

 

[devonshire farmer]

Has anyone swapped the flywheel pulley from a 400 to a 355mm, does it make much difference?

 

[mengeleguru]

A 355 mm pulley is used above 135 horse power because below that the 400 mm comes in to its own.
A bit like a Mini & a Ferrari going up hill if you haven’t got the power you won’t win.

Probably ups production by 30%

 

[devonshire farmer]

A 355 mm pulley is used above 135 horse power because below that the 400 mm comes in to its own.
A bit like a Mini & a Ferrari going up hill if you haven’t got the power you won’t win.

Probably ups production by 30%

Thanks, we have 200hp so be worth doing then

 

[mengeleguru]

Different belt though