France to link food prices to farmers’ cost of production!!!

[Bossfarmer]

I wasn't aware any of the above operated trucks in the UK?

I have 3 main points;

1) UK haulage industry is just as vital to feeding the nation and the national economy as UK farmers, if not more so.

2) UK based hauliers face stiff competition from hauliers based in Europe. These European hauliers can have much lower costs (both fixed and variable) yet still legally operate in the UK, within certain rules. They are in effect exporting their haulage services. They can easily undercut UK based hauliers.

3) Despite the above the UK haulage industry receives no direct subsidy. In light of this, what makes farmers so special that they should receive subsidy?

You cannot compare the two, hauliers can be replaced at the drop of a hat, farmers cant and 60m people need a secure local food supply, farmers across the uk put in hours every week which would be considered illegal to hauliers and dont get their £10/hr, many farming families are basically working for free to feed a nation once that goes it will never be replaced

 

[unlacedgecko]

You cannot compare the two, hauliers can be replaced at the drop of a hat, farmers cant and 60m people need a secure local food supply, farmers across the uk put in hours every week which would be considered illegal to hauliers and dont get their £10/hr, many farming families are basically working for free to feed a nation once that goes it will never be replaced

We are going around in circles. I shall leave this here.

 

[Agrispeed]

I would agree with the hauliers being the most important part of the chain. We could import food, produce it domestically or even in a lab, but its got to get to the consumer. I would be screwed if I didn't have a few chaps rock up every other day to collect the milk.

I will also pee everyone off and suggest that in terms of the consumer supermarkets are also an important part of food security, as they manage the logistics, quality and quantity of actually getting the food to the consumer, no matter where its produced. We could produce all the food in the UK but without the transport or shops to sell the food the consumer would never see it.

In terms of working hours. I'm not sure working silly hours is something to be proud of. I do as possible and I'm proud of the fact that I'm a lazy farmer!

 

[kiwi pom]

I don't have anything against farmers and I don't want to see them fail.
I do get fed up with some constantly complaining that life's not fair and they have it harder and work harder than every other member of society and are poorer than anyone who has a "normal job" whatever that is.
The "I'm just doing this to feed the world" line's wearing a bit thin.
Its not all farmers of course, many of the younger ones that have started with very little and are building their businesses up for the good of future generations seem quite upbeat about farming. A quick look on the "all things dairy" thread will confirm this. Its something I also saw whilst working on farms whilst still living in the UK.

@Dave645 As for the swap thing, if you started with nothing and built your farm up from nothing to the 4 million its worth today, well done sir. I'm sorry I cant afford to buy you out.
If the farm was handed down to you and you grew up on the farm in relative security knowing that one day you would take it over, I would have swapped with that as a kid every day.
Its often mentioned by farmers that own their farm that they are asset rich and cash poor. Very true but if something bad DID happen you COULD sell up and cash the asset in.
Having a back up plan like that certainly makes life a bit more comfortable.

 

[Farmer Roy]

food security - look at the absolute PLAGUE of obesity in western society. Across all demographics, but ESPECIALLY amongst those of a lower socio economic group. There is obviously NO shortage of abundant cheap food, in fact the opposite is true. Overeating is the single BIGGEST health issue we face today

I wish these fudgeing pommie farmers would stop drinking the kool ade of food security & feeding the masses & they should all be thankfull to us & not only buy our products ( even if they are more expensive than imports ) but also subsidise us with their taxes ( that would be far better going into health or education, when you see how ill, unfit & uneducated the population is ) as well !!!!!!!! Oh, that's right, farming is "special", an essential service like water & electricity. fudge off. Food supply isn't an issue. How many tonnes of food are wasted or thrown out every day? People DO NOT value food or food production, we are surrounded by too much cheap food . . .

FFS

Rant over








but yes, very good point. If food security IS the number one issue, maybe more farmland should be turned over to allotments & community gardens, so the great unwashed public can take part in providing their own food security & have a true understanding of the challenges of growing food>

I should stand for Parliament

 

[Doc]

You can't educate pork.
I too give up on this one, but I do like the sentiment that keen, start from scratch youth from any background will be the future of Ag industries and the be prepared to 'have a go' on the platform they are given, whatever it is, mentality still exists. I just hope they get the opportunity as the backward thinking dead wood is removed.

 

[Dave645]

Thanks for the interest, but I plan to keep farming.

It's not that I like subs in what ever form they come, and if you read my older posts you will see I think they do as much damage as good to the industry, and would gladly see them go, but for that to safely happen things have to change, farming either needs a closer connection to the consumer or farm gate prices have to rise, the position uk farming is in is not sustainable, but the bottom line is if subs go that income has to be replaced there is only 2 ways it can be increased shop prices for food or decreased middle men's cut, or a mix of the 2.

I will say this letting the uk farming industry to fail is not an option anyone that likes to eat should consider. You may scrape by now from imports but not indefinitely. You got to remember we are competitive to the EU market our prices are linked to theirs, sure some of them are not the cheapest in the world but they are your closest supplier and we are competitive with them and we also have to partially compete with external imports like NewZealand lamb. Viar the trade structure of the EU.

What you sub hates have got to get your heads around, is poor prices are a world wide problem, the cheap sources of food you think can replace uk farmers are also struggling. And would jump at a chance to double their prices farming has been struggling for quite some time that's why we have subs at all, it's not because we were all getting rich it was because we were all going bust, the problem now is like all sub it twists the markets, and make farmers reliant on it.

Like this threads topic I would welcome a system that fixes things so I can end up running a business without subs, but be under no illusions your going to pay for it just the same your only swopping subs for food prices if you don't control retailers and middlemen. The bottom line is farmers need to be payed more it's a simple as that, you could all do the maths an owned farm is no where near a business in the classic sense, and cannot be one. So I am not expecting a 200k a year income, but I do need a living. And to be able to invest in my farm to keep renewing machinery.

I do see it's not a right to farm with support, but as long as the govermant asks me to grow food, I will, the minute they say stop, I will have to except my fate.

And no farming is not in the position to radically change the market. So it gets a bigger cut of retail. Not without laws.

I personaly think, if the govermant wants new farmers they need to buy farms and rent them out to them, on cheap rents ( at least early on) it's the only way to start new businesses without crippling debts, which would stifle innovations they may bring to farming.

I find innovation in farming is stifled by the lack of investable money. Not that all innovation is expensive but changes in equipment can be. And can be hard to justify.
I think the natural progression is for smaller farms to fold, just because they are not very viable, not only that family owned farms often just break up on a death, mine will, before I get to own it, as I have 2 brothers (they don't farm) like most family farms progression from one generation to the next is never smooth. My parents made choices, their results I have to live with. I do nearly all the work but only get 33% of profit. It puts me in a limited possition to instigate change. But it also doesn't push me to break my back to improve the farm, it's defiantly stifling innovation, that and my dads a Yorkshireman.......I think that's all I need say on that lol. A risk taker he is not......

Thanks to you all for the debates it's good to see things from all angles.

 

[Bossfarmer]

food security - look at the absolute PLAGUE of obesity in western society. Across all demographics, but ESPECIALLY amongst those of a lower socio economic group. There is obviously NO shortage of abundant cheap food, in fact the opposite is true. Overeating is the single BIGGEST health issue we face today

I wish these fudgeing pommie farmers would stop drinking the kool ade of food security & feeding the masses & they should all be thankfull to us & not only buy our products ( even if they are more expensive than imports ) but also subsidise us with their taxes ( that would be far better going into health or education, when you see how ill, unfit & uneducated the population is ) as well !!!!!!!! Oh, that's right, farming is "special", an essential service like water & electricity. fudge off. Food supply isn't an issue. How many tonnes of food are wasted or thrown out every day? People DO NOT value food or food production, we are surrounded by too much cheap food . . .

FFS

Rant over








but yes, very good point. If food security IS the number one issue, maybe more farmland should be turned over to allotments & community gardens, so the great unwashed public can take part in providing their own food security & have a true understanding of the challenges of growing food>

I should stand for Parliament

we NEED an over supply of food in order to keep it cheap though