George Eustice's announcement "The path to sustainable farming." 2021-2024

[delilah]

It’s not all about carbon though is it.
What about habitat and food for birds and bees. So pollen and nectar plots. Bird seed plots. Beetle banks . Pond restoration etc.

Elements of that don't come under area payments. I am talking specifically about any £x/Ha payments. All of that money should go to PP. There can still be schemes for pond restoration etc open to all.
The greatest public good that arable farmers can deliver is food.

 

[digger64]

Because at the moment you get a lump sum for doing nothing.
Edestroying ing to be based on income forgone, and upon targets such as wildlife corridors, tree planting, hedge row management, fencing
They all have a cost involved.
£90/acre for nothing
£90/acre with costs

Some of it yes but alot will be to change the management of once used land , bunging drains / rivers , destocking hill farms and lowland pasture and abandoning cropped land to various things like scrub, trees or large areas of" sown " unproductive plants for bees etc - sort of posh setaside if you like . The things you suggest (the work part )will have to be grant added on top or they won't happen .
The occupier will recieve income for doing nothing and not taking risk as now if that is their policy but it will be much more frequent
unless actual farming income becomes much more profitable than these options .

 

[redsloe]

It looks like its going to be income foregone with costs involved.

So, how much is income foregone? Everyone bemoaning the fact of BPS going means that they can't make money without it so are presumably losing money on their wheat anyway!
If your fixed costs are £200/ac, which they should be, then AB15 should just about do you.

 

[redsloe]

Fair enough, but you could have had mid tier payments for the last 5 years on your PP and had £30k income over that period? Luckily your rent must be low enough not to have needed to.

An ELS term finishing 18 months or so ago didn't help with that.

 

[B'o'B]

As I said earlier in this thread, they don't know what they want. The paper just released can be summarized in one word: "Help !". We should help them.

ELMS is easy:
1) All area based payments to go to PP.
2) Most of the remainder to go to the 'public engagement' section. Get bus loads of kids out of the cities on day trips to farms. For which arable farms are best suited. Clean yards, days when they can plan to be available.

It's 'public money for public goods'. Which means teaching the kids and giving everyone else a nice day out. The public will play merry hell if the PP goes to scrub.

What is all this PP going to do?

 

[B'o'B]

Elements of that don't come under area payments. I am talking specifically about any £x/Ha payments. All of that money should go to PP. There can still be schemes for pond restoration etc open to all.
The greatest public good that arable farmers can deliver is food.

Apparently food isn’t a public good.

 

[Mixedupfarmer]

An ELS term finishing 18 months or so ago didn't help with that.☹

Oh I see, that is fair enough

 

[redsloe]

What is all this PP going to do?

And a lot are wondering how to get it!!!

 

[Mixedupfarmer]

So, how much is income foregone? Everyone bemoaning the fact of BPS going means that they can't make money without it so are presumably losing money on their wheat anyway!
If your fixed costs are £200/ac, which they should be, then AB15 should just about do you.

Many around here have rent and drainage rates on FBT's of approaching £200/acre without any other fixed costs

 

[midlandslad]

What is all this PP going to do?

why would they pay for something that farmers will continue producing regardless

 

[Sid]

So, how much is income foregone? Everyone bemoaning the fact of BPS going means that they can't make money without it so are presumably losing money on their wheat anyway!
If your fixed costs are £200/ac, which they should be, then AB15 should just about do you.

That is the big question .
It's not about delivery cost but the income lost from production

 

[onthehoof]

If that planned schedule does become reality

Has it not already been agreed

 

[steveR]

Well i had a meeting today with someone very high up and knows everything about these schemes etc and he stated to me that there is no point reading all that waffle as things will change again before they are implemented and untill they set the final rules there is not much point worrying too much!

As he said: The devil is in the detail and when you finally have that then you start looking at your options!

A hell of a lot can and may well change before 2024 including perhaps a new Gov who may well rip up this Elms scheme/ % of BPS payments and start again!

Said much the same yesterday to a fellow farmer. Broadscale planning only at present.

 

[lloyd]

Not a lot new from today’s announcement.
Everyone knew what would happen if we left the EU. I voted to leave as did the majority of farmers I know.
I’m young and keen and want to expand going forwards. Subsidy’s disappearing are going to hurt, but look at what happened in NZ. A lot of farmers will go out of business, land owners who rent their farms are going to have to drop rents or start getting off their arse and do some work. Land prices will crash for a few years then the industry will recover and be better for it, those who survive will flourish long term. we’ve got a massive population that will need food.
the whole ELMs thing is just an excuse by the gov to help meet emissions rules and nothing to do with farming.
I certainly won’t be jumping through too many hoops going forward

I think you've been led a false dream i can't see land prices crashing ,
infact the opposite is happening around here.
Are you involved in sheep,beef ,arable,poultry or dairy?

 

[Clive]

So, how much is income foregone? Everyone bemoaning the fact of BPS going means that they can't make money without it so are presumably losing money on their wheat anyway!
If your fixed costs are £200/ac, which they should be, then AB15 should just about do you.

on an arable farm (cereals) fixed costs should be half the number you quote !

 

[steveR]

Perhaps they will claim elms and sit back and do nothing

That is my take on it...

Local lad comes in to establish any cover crops and then harvests anything with a Spearhead...

 

[lloyd]

Yep ,we are going to supply our southern cousins with FOOD.

Not after Nicola builds a wall you wont.

 

[onthehoof]

There was talk that if you entered a new stewardship scheme now, you could leave it early if Elms was better, but not mentioned in this speech??

 

[Hindsight]

Then that is what should be pushed for. All area based ELMS to be paid on PP. Such a scheme would deliver the greatest public good, and be the best option financially for UK ag. What am I missing ?

Out of general interest do you farm an all Permanent pasture farm? Askin' for a friend?

 

[Hindsight]

Apparently food isn’t a public good.

That is why he is intent on focussing payments on permanent pasture, I had kinda assumed.